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I was 3ID shock and awe to take Baghdad in 2003, equal is equal, if you cannot do a push up you are not welcome in the Infantry, this is not a matter for the social engineers but national security. the "girly" pushups the females do ARE NOT pushups, they are a joke, let the real men like me and my squad of "predators" fight for our country, I EARNED my C.I.B.
The females were usually only good for one thing in the field, anyone want to guess where these fine young soldiers were regularly caught having sex? in the the "Porta-Johns". case closed
''Equality of the standards'' applies to the mental capacity of each gender. They are to be treated equally in terms of mental ability - not physical ability. Obviously!
Has anyone ever debated that men were physically superior to women?
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What a bizarre observation you've made...
I was in the Navy and while TDY on the USS Abraham Lincoln, the first carrier to go coed, I came across a female E3 sailor trying to drag a portable, water submersible pump up to the 08 level (Flag Bridge level)from the first deck, normally something 2 people did. I asked what her rate was and why she didn't have any help. She said she is a damage control person and that she was capable of doing any job a man could. I ordered her (me an E6) to continue dragging that thing up eight flights of stairs (ladders in Navy parlance) and went on my way.
I ordinarily help anyone who is struggling but she deserved everything her motor mouth caused.
That was my observation. I could have easily slung that thing on my shoulder and got it to its predetermined location without much trouble.
And if we should hold everyone to the same standard then shouldn't we hold everyone to the same standard, regardless of age?
In the army, in combat conditions, the "job" doesn't care that you are male or female. That 80 lb pack weights the same. The body armor weighs (very nearly anyway) as much, the weapon and the ammo is the same. The hills are just as high and the walls just as tall when you have a vagina as they are if you have a penis. So, given that they have the same job to do, one that doesn't care what sex you are, why do we lower the standards just because of genitalia? The PT standards are developed to screen out those that are unable to do the job and therefore put themselves and others at risk.
Today's political establishment is too willing to sacrifice the lives of our servicemen and women in order to use the military as their own little social experiment.
To be clear I have nothing against the military, and even in combat conditions. Just so long as they can do the same job, to the same standards, as their male counterparts. And yes, I agree with other posters, the PT test should not be adjusted for age either.
Last edited by Toyman at Jewel Lake; 01-22-2015 at 07:44 AM..
In the army, in combat conditions, the "job" doesn't care that you are male or female. That 80 lb pack weights the same. The body armor weights (very nearly anyway) as much, the weapon and the ammo is the same. The hills are just as high and the walls just as tall when you have a vagina as they are if you have a penis. So, given that they have the same job to do, one that doesn't care what sex you are, do we lower the standards just because of genitalia? The PT standards are developed to screen out those that are unable to do the job and therefore put themselves and others at risk.
Completely agree.
There are some women that can hurl my 230 pounds across a room but they are the exception rather than the rule. Want to play with the big boys, then they better have the same physical capabilities as a man.
There are some women that can hurl my 230 pounds across a room but they are the exception rather than the rule. Want to play with the big boys, then they better have the same physical capabilities as a man.
Good lord...you guys sound like a bunch of knuckledragging cavemen.
There are some women that can hurl my 230 pounds across a room but they are the exception rather than the rule. Want to play with the big boys, then they better have the same physical capabilities as a man.
Yep. The change I could see to the PT test would be to eliminate the "pushups" or "situps" part. Have it require strapping on an 80 lb pack with a combat load of gear and ammo, a weapon, body armor and do a forced march over difficult terrain in a set timeframe; say 20 miles in 8 hours. That task is based on the requirements of the job, not some arbitrary task that doesn't relate to the task. In wildlands fire fighting, men and women to have to meet the same pack test. 45 lb pack, 3 mile hike, in 45 minutes. That's nothing extreme by any means, and certainly not anywhere near what the military has to do on a regular basis. A co-worker's son is in the 82nd airborne. They regularly carried 100lb+ loads over brutal terrain.
Yep. The change I could see to the PT test would be to eliminate the "pushups" or "situps" part. Have it require strapping on an 80 lb pack with a combat load of gear and ammo, a weapon, body armor and do a forced march over difficult terrain in a set timeframe. That task is based on the requirements of the job, not some arbitrary task that doesn't relate to the task. In wildlands fire fighting, men and women to have to meet the same pack test. 45 lb pack, 3 mile hike, in 45 minutes. That's nothing extreme by any means, and certainly not anywhere near what the military has to do on a regular basis.
Ummm....the overwhelming majority of people in the military don't do 3 mile hikes with 45 lb packs on "on a regular basis."
Ummm....the overwhelming majority of people in the military don't do 3 mile hikes with 45 lb packs on "on a regular basis."
Not even on a semi-regular basis.
Dude, really? 45lbs/3 miles/45 minutes is pretty much nothing. I'm overweight and out of shape and passed a red-tag (pack test) in my late 40s without any problem. What the army actually does is MUCH more demanding. The army actually fights battles with bad guys, they don't all sit in an office. Supply is potentially as physically demanding as combat. Loading HMMWVS, HEMTTS and packing ammo to armored vehicles is demanding work.
Marines have to execute 20 dead hang pull-ups/chin-ups, 100 crunches in 2 minutes or less, and a 3-mile run in 18 minutes or less. Anyone that could achieve 300 points on this test is a true warrior-athlete.
I have no problems with anything in the water perhaps, (If water sport is a requirement to be a seal I can be a seal) just don't water board me) but I cannot run to save my life. I admire the lady Marines, I can only be a wannabe. (wanted to be a Marine when I was 13, but life killed the dream I dream. )
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just don't water board me) but I cannot run to save my life. I admire the lady Marines, I can only be a wannabe. (wanted to be a Marine when I was 13, but life killed the dream I dream. 
)
