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Not true. And I'm not suggesting ending tips so that workers end up earning LESS. I don't think that conscientious diners, who tip well, should have to make up for the cheapskates who tip low or nothing.
The vast majority of people tip right around 18-20%. The average server in a nice restaurant will average right around 19%.
I don't think servers should be paid close to minimum wage. Anyone here know how much a server averages, with tips? Whatever that is, that's what they should be paid. (I realize it will be higher for higher end restaurants).
And they should do a good job because they should take pride in their job. If they consistently give poor service, they should be fired. Plenty of unemployed people will be happy to take their place.
I would think the workers would be happy to know they have a guaranteed amount coming in, and not having to worry about the pastor who doesn't want to pay the server more than she "pays God," or the depression-era diner who still thinks 3 bucks is a great tip, or the cheapskates who are going to leave a handful of change, or whatever.
When I was a server in college, I made a little over double minimum wage with tips. That being said, regardless of what we THINK a person should be paid, I think that there are people who would gladly be servers if they were paid minimum wage (obviously depending on the quality of the restaurant). What we think a person should be paid is irrelevant to what their real wage actually becomes.
Did you actually read my post??? Did I say anything that could be construed as "tipping is a burden" for me? I think servers like it when I dine out. I'm quite a generous tipper. I have tipped 50% for an awesome experience (though 20-25% is my norm)
Location: Currently I physically reside on the 3rd planet from the sun
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kayanne
I would MUCH prefer that the waitstaff (and cooks, bus staff, and anyone else tips are shared with) be paid a reasonable amount, and that tips be reserved for TRULY exceptional service. (yes, I realize the menu prices would increase. Fine by me.)
In my ideal world, tips would be a rarity. They would not be given for doing one's expected job duties. The whole system makes no sense to me. Who determined that hair dressers and massage therapists, for example, are to be paid tips for their services (services which already cost a lot!) but the grocery check out clerk and the trash collector, for example (who work very hard and aren't getting wealthy) are not to be tipped? Really, how were the "rules" made?
I think the appropriate solution is a no-brainer.
Get Uncle Sam's fracking fingers out of gratuities.
I absolutely don't mind tipping wait staff 20% for good service. (not even great service, just good, prompt, courteous service)
However I resent the expectation that I'm somehow obligated to tip them for bad service and do not feel obligated to tip them anything for just showing up and doing their job. I am not their employer and do not feel responsible for subsidizing their wages. As you say, I wouldn't mind paying more for the food without the expectation that I am going to subsidize bad employees. I didn't hire them, they restaurateur did.
If anything I should be comped for bad service.
I recently dropped $60 at a restaurant for a takeout order ($50 food, $10 tip - even though the order was takeout). The hostess was friendly and actually upsold me on some pie slices (apple jalapeno and peach habanero - I know sounds odd but actually delicious). I ordered a nacho supreme with all the fixings and sides including shredded beef - about a $14.00 dish, plus my childrens orders).
I got home and realized they had given me chips with beans smothered in cheese.
I called them and here is the kicker. If they had apologized, been gracious offered to comp me I would have said, no, thats all right accidents happen - I like this place. As it was the cook/owner acted as if I were the one inconveniencing him rather than the other way around. I went back to the restaurant told him I just drove about 6 miles home and back, missed eating with my kids and expected to be comped. He complied but was surly - end result, I will not eat at the Moosehill Cantina on Kipling in Lakewood Colorado again.
I tell this story because I believe this attitude comes from the idea that somehow you as the customer are expected to act as the employer and subsidize their wages. I will never eat there again - TG there is another one over on Colfax so I can still get my pie fixes.
With the recent Applebee's brouhaha (Pastor didn't want to pay waitress 18% gratuity because she pays God only 10%. Waitress ends up being fired), I am interested to know your thoughts on the whole system of tipping in the United States. As most people know, waitstaff at restaurants are paid far below minimum wage, with the expectation that tips will make up the difference. I would MUCH prefer that the waitstaff (and cooks, bus staff, and anyone else tips are shared with) be paid a reasonable amount, and that tips be reserved for TRULY exceptional service. (yes, I realize the menu prices would increase. Fine by me.)
In my ideal world, tips would be a rarity. They would not be given for doing one's expected job duties. The whole system makes no sense to me. Who determined that hair dressers and massage therapists, for example, are to be paid tips for their services (services which already cost a lot!) but the grocery check out clerk and the trash collector, for example (who work very hard and aren't getting wealthy) are not to be tipped? Really, how were the "rules" made?
And is it just me, or does it seem like more and more workers are expecting tips now than in the past. For decades, if I ordered a major appliance or furniture, and paid $100 or more delivery fee, it never even crossed my mind that I should pay a tip to the delivery person. But recently it has been brought to my attention that I should. Sorry, I didn't know! What about the cable guy if he comes out to check on something? How about the guy who fertilizes and weed-treats my lawn? Do some people tip them? Why or why not?
Last week I had new flooring installed. When the guy finished, it seemed like he kept trying to think of things to say rather than just leaving. I was pretty sure he was stalling so that I would pay him a tip. But the fact is I am not happy with the floor (in fact I have been told it will all be ripped out and replaced), so why would I tip him? And frankly, since his labor charge was $1400 for a job that took 2 men about 15 hours, why should additional tip be paid at all???
I really wish tips were reserved for those moments when I am so incredibly touched by a worker's "above and beyond" service, that I feel I MUST reward with an additional gift. But when it is everyday, common, part of their pay ---- just charge me a higher amount and leave the meaningless "tip" out of it.
(BTW, I am not a cheapskate. I tend to pay 20-25% tip at restaurants because I know waitstaff don't earn much).
I once listened to a paper delivered by a history Ph.D. student whose research interest was the rise and creation of the restaurant industry in the United States in the late 19th century. The particular subject of the paper was the public controversy about tipping in restaurants which was debated in national magazines such as Harpers, newspapers and other print media throughout the 1880s and 90s.
The point was that the model of the restaurant had been imported from Europe: restaurants themselves were originally an upper-class preserve modeled on grand households (think dinner at Downton Abbey), waiters were essentially a public version of liveried footmen, and most of the customs, including tipping, were borrowed from the habits of the European aristocracy.
The "anti" side in this debate held that tipping was a fundamentally un-American thing to do: it was a way of reinforcing social inequality, one the one hand by giving the customer a way of demonstrating his superior wealth and status, on the other hand by demonstrating the dependence of the "servant class". These anti-tippers believed it was more true to American principles to pay wait staff a normal wage and include all costs in the menu.
There's a huge difference between what a server does over the course of a multi-course two hour meal for four people at a table and a suggestion in a shop on a purchase.
Ha ha! You don't know how indecisive I can be when I shop!
But that does make me think......ok, let's say it's a couple shopping for an engagement ring. Obviously this is not going to be a quick decision. I know I spent hours and hours (at multiple stores) looking at rings before selecting my engagement ring. So, there were many workers who gave me perhaps 30-60 minutes of their time, showing me various settings, various stones, explaining details to us, but we ultimately didn't buy from most of those stores. They didn't get a sale, not because they didn't provide good service, but they didn't happen to have "THE ring" that I wanted to wear for the rest of my life. Should I have tipped them for their time? I don't know anyone who does that. And at the store where we did make the ring purchase --- sorry, no tip. Didn't occur to me.
So I ask again, how were "the rules" of who to tip determine? Is there even an agreed upon list?
I don't think servers should be paid close to minimum wage. Anyone here know how much a server averages, with tips? Whatever that is, that's what they should be paid. (I realize it will be higher for higher end restaurants).
The highest earning server at one of the restaurants at the hotel I own earned over $100k in 2012. The lowest earner earned $72k. A lot of it has to do with what shifts they work and how many hours they work.
There's a huge difference between what a server does over the course of a multi-course two hour meal for four people at a table and a suggestion in a shop on a purchase.
That's absolutely not true.
I make a product that I sell in my own shop. I know my product backward and forward. I spend a great deal of time and MONEY making sure my product is the best it can be.
I converse with my customers as to why my product will do what it does. They leave knowing more than they did when they came in.
I price my product based on what I have in it and what the market will bear.
I neither expect nor receive a tip. I spend far, far more time and am far more knowledgeable about my product than a waiter is about a bottle of wine or filet mignon.
A waiter is nothing more than a clerk or salesperson selling food.
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