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I see. And what about babies, young children, the elderly, people overpowered by fear, weapons, drugs, whatever? They all obviously are responsible, right? I hate to break this news to you, but a rapist is the one responsible for raping someone.
Of course the rapist is responsible - but that is not the point.
If she had been conscious - it is highly unlikely that this would have occurred.
This was not an anger driven rape(yes, there are many different motivations for rape - and I can refer you to some good books if you are interested) - this was some kids who got drunk and made a bad judgment and decided to put their hands where they didn't belong.
Of course the rapist is responsible - but that is not the point.
If she had been conscious - it is highly unlikely that this would have occurred.
This was not an anger driven rape(yes, there are many different motivations for rape - and I can refer you to some good books if you are interested) - this was some kids who got drunk and made a bad judgment and decided to put their hands where they didn't belong.
You see to be condoning underage drinking.
Why is that?
If your son was drunk and got the same treatment by some men would you feel he was "partially responsible"? I don't think so.
Of course the rapist is responsible - but that is not the point.
If she had been conscious - it is highly unlikely that this would have occurred.
This was not an anger driven rape(yes, there are many different motivations for rape - and I can refer you to some good books if you are interested) - this was some kids who got drunk and made a bad judgment and decided to put their hands where they didn't belong.
You see to be condoning underage drinking.
Why is that?
You and DC seemed to have missed the link I provided where apparently this is not the first girl they did this to. You two must have missed where it was stated that there was the possibility that she was drugged - as in someone slipped something into her drink.
They are all guilty of one thing - they were underaged and drinking. The difference is, those boys had the presence of mind and chose to violate someone who was incapacitated and unable to think from drinking too much or from having been drugged. My guess it was a combination of alcohol and drugs.
Apparently there are alot of town folk that were trying to cover it up. Giving little boys the power to think they are untouchable and can get away with anything, taking what they want and doing what they want to girls that are incapable of fighting back or giving consent. If they got away with it twice before they sure as hell thought they could do it again and get away with it. Apparently they did it to the wrong person. She stopped them from doing it to anyone else. I guess that is one good thing that came out of this tragedy.
Let me add: I'm sure she is being hard on herself, which would include a level of "blame", for being foolish. It's not as if she got off scott free. She has been punished for her foolishness. Don't you think that having those photos and videos spread all over the internet along with her name, something she will have to live with for the rest of her life, isn't enough punishment? As for the boys, they will be registered sex offenders for the rest of their lives.
Last edited by softblueyz; 03-19-2013 at 06:53 AM..
What part of getting drunk means that you share responsibility for what happens in such a condition do you not understand?
You realize that is bull****, don't you?
If you find a drunk by the road, and decide to set fire to him, you are responsible, not him. If you watch someone through their window getting drunk in their own home, and you burgle it while they are passed out, it is not their fault. If a woman gets into your taxi to go home from town because shes had too much to drink and you rape her on the way, it is not her fault.
Not morally, not etichcally, not legally.
The system in the western world requires you to not violate other people. Period. It does not hold everyone else responsible for staying at peak alertness at all times so you don't see an opportunity to violate them. Nor does it allocate responsibilty for crimes comitted against someone because they for some reason were unable to defend themselves at the time.
Its just the old saw of the rapist that got caught over again: "She asked for it, the way she was acting/dressed etc" Dressed up with a new excuse for why it is not your fault.
Of course the rapist is responsible - but that is not the point.
If she had been conscious - it is highly unlikely that this would have occurred.
Right, because the millions of women who are raped daily are all drunk? What an utterly stupid comment.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Harrier
This was not an anger driven rape(yes, there are many different motivations for rape - and I can refer you to some good books if you are interested) - this was some kids who got drunk and made a bad judgment and decided to put their hands where they didn't belong.
Bad judgement? No, they raped her, that is not bad judgement, it is rape. It would seem you could educate yourself more on the subject. If you are interested I can refer you to some legitimate books.
This was not an anger driven rape(yes, there are many different motivations for rape - and I can refer you to some good books if you are interested) - this was some kids who got drunk and made a bad judgment and decided to put their hands where they didn't belong.
What a knob!!!!
No, this wasn't anger driven. It was for their own amusement. And to further their amusement they took photos and made videos and plastered them all over the internet and sent them around on mobiles and they were probably sober when they did that. Again, "bad judgment"??
Put their hands where they didn't belong? I guess you aren't informed about what else they did. She was not only violated but humiliated in several ways. Apparently the boy who was offering $3 to anyone to urinate on her didn't happen. I guess the bid was too low?? or did they think that would have been "disgusting"?
How does their "bad judgment" excuse them, but her "bad judgment" doesn't excuse her?
Yep, Bill Johnson is my Congressman. He lives a few miles from me. So it's not liike they elected him. And we've had plenty of Democratic Congressmen around here before.
Stuebenville makes up less than 1% of the vote in the district.
Just like I said, Stuebenville is a union town full of democrats.
Last edited by OhioRules; 03-19-2013 at 07:34 AM..
They are products of a liberal society that has banished God.
When morality becomes relativistic, and you tell people that they are animals, don't be surprised with the negative results.
Quit bringing your agenda into every discussion.
Quote:
Originally Posted by FinsterRufus
Oh rubbish.
I'm going to take a wild guess here and surmise that this being a smallish city in the Heartland, that the large majority of people there identify as Christian and that God is quite prevalent in most people's lives.
I would reckon that the large majority of people involved in this case go to church and would throw a big ole hissy fit should you accuse them of being liberal.
So don't pull that crap. And don't try and pretend this is some kind of modern phenomena. It isn't.
I grew up in that area, about 50 miles from Steubenville. Although I haven't lived there for more than 40 years, that sounds about right. And no, what happened there isn't anything new. Football worship has long been big there. Joe Namath went to my high school, and there have been many others who made it into the pros from that area. There is also a huge drinking culture there. When I was a kid, you could purchase 3.2 beer in Ohio at age 18. "Going to Ohio" was a favorite activity of some at my high school. Pretty much everyone went to church on Sunday, too.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dale Cooper
Granted I haven't read all the posts in this thread, but I haven't seen anyone blaming the girl. I've seen a lot of people, myself included, who say they share equal blame.
As they say: live by the sword, die by the sword. When you play with fire, you're gonna get burned. She was a player, too.
So you can stop with the crying around about people placing all the blame on the girl. It's your perception and unwillingness to see what people are saying that's the problem.
You sure as h*ll haven't read all the posts if you haven't seen anyone blaming the girl.
Quote:
Originally Posted by FinsterRufus
Rubbish. I dare you to go to that town, stand in the town square, and tell them all that they've marginalized God. I bet you one million trillion dollars that they would be quite put out should you suggest such a thing.
Mixed feelings. The girl has some culpability here. She is a known liar according to fellow students, and by some accounts known as Steubenville's "train wh ore" indicating that some believe she has engaged in similar nefarious activity on multiple occasions. Does this excuse the activity of the two young men? No, but it should have been a consideration in the sentencing phase. Indeed, as many young men will tell you, this type of activity happens all the time in Teen World. I have a feeling this case would have never been pursued had there not been a social media aspect to it.
Except that she's only 16. She's too young to give sexual consent and she's too young to be drinking, too young to be out after 11 pm and should have never been given permission to be at that party in the first place. Nomal and good parents make sure their daughters are not out all night and getting drunk.
The reason kids have parents is that parents are supposed to guide and protect them. Same goes for the boys, they were 16 and 17, too young to be allowed to party all night, too young to have been given alcohol and too young to be at a boy-girl party with no adult supervision.
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What an utterly stupid comment.
