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A man-hater? No, not at all.
All I see from you are justifications for a man to able to fu*k-and-flee, or rut-and-run.
Sorry. You don't want to pay? Don't play. Or wrap it up.
We'll never see eye to eye on this, so it's best to just end it now. If a man impregnates a woman, he should help support the child. He doesn't get to run away. Period.
How is abortion any different? Just answer me that. How is a woman not taking responsibility for her actions by getting an abortion, which is done most often because they can't afford it, not rut-and-run?
We probably won't see eye to eye on this. But that doesn't make your opinion justified. It isn't rational or logical. Not if you support the idea that abortion is solely the woman's choice. She shouldn't have all the say when it comes to this. Yes it's her body and her decision to have an abortion or not, but she should not be able to force the man to financially support her and the child unwillingly.
Women get a choice after the act, men deserve one too.
Privileged status? Boy...got anything else to offer other than 40 year old feminist propaganda?
How is this propaganda? There is male privilege and female disadvantage. There is also female privilege and male disadvantage in many situations.
The point is that the OP and like-minded people only believe or care that the second one exists. Or they lash out at feminists, who they (in most cases, falsely) accuse of only believing the first one exists. So if you want to stand up for male disadvantage, it's only fair that you should stand up for female disadvantage as well.
How is this propaganda? There is male privilege and female disadvantage. There is also female privilege and male disadvantage in many situations.
The point is that the OP and like-minded people only believe or care that the second one exists. Or they lash out at feminists, who they (in most cases, falsely) accuse of only believing the first one exists. So if you want to stand up for male disadvantage, it's only fair that you should stand up for female disadvantage as well.
I do stand up for female disadvantage. I stand right beside feminist and women's rights activists all the time giving their cause my support. You don't know what I believe or think, so please don't assume you do. Just because you deny that men have actual disadvantages and are systematically discriminated against, doesn't make it so. Society, especially liberal feminists like to hide and deny such things. Why? I have no clue why anyone who supposedly stands for equal rights, would deny equal rights for anyone. It has never made sense to me. It also makes no sense to me when feminists tell me that they are working on these issues already in their own way, I have yet to see any feminist prove this. They claim we should label ourselves are feminists and support their issues, if we want to fight for our own. This makes no sense and feel it is a cop-out so they don't have to acknowledge that men do have some inequality issues that need to be addressed. They can't universal male privilege if men also face disadvantages.
I don't think they should have a say in abortion. But I do think that they should have a say once they find out the woman is pregnant and going to have the baby.
The way I was talking about earlier WOULD allow the man to make his choice.
Quote:
Originally Posted by raison_d'etre
That is hardly the issue today. Most households need dual incomes to survive. Majority of couples with or without children have both people working. They don't base alimony on who works and who doesn't as much as they did, now it is about who works more and who works less. My wife and I both work, I work slightly more than she does, we share the housework equally and pay bills equally. If we were to get a divorce she would get alimony if she asked for it. I would be forced to pay up to 25% of my income to support her.
I am a stay at home mom. I haven't had a full time job in over 12 years, I have been a substitute teacher off and on. I do everything in the house, cook, clean, do the shopping, take care of the kids needs, tend the garden, take care of the animals, handle the finances, do the taxes, handle all appointments, buy the last minute birthday gifts, bake hundreds of cookies for school events, do all school meetings, run the cars for service, do the home repairs,etc. All my wife has to do is go to work 5-6 days a week. She does help me with heavy spring cleaning.
Since I take care of everything else, she has been able to concentrate on her career and promotions. She never has to worry about needing to find a sitter if she works late or has to travel for work, she never has to worry about dinner for the kids if she has to work overtime.
There are millions of families just like mine, in many of them the man stays home and the woman is the sole breadwinner.
Quote:
Originally Posted by raison_d'etre
You might not think that feminists who are against ending circumcision would matter much, but they do. Until ending circumcision becomes an actual human rights issue, nobody is going to take is seriously. A million men could stand up against it, and it would go nowhere as both liberal feminists and conservative misogynists either ignore it or deny the legitimacy of it being an issue. And you being a simpleton about it doesn't help either.
I have already shown you womens groups that are fighting to end MGM. Sorry if not everyone agrees, but that is life. You will never get everyone to agree on everything.
Read the comments of any article on this case and you should be sick with how people are reacting to this. Not one peep can be heard from the feminists who demand justice for rape victims. If this was a woman, every feminist blogger, feminist organization and news site would be exploding. Society, including feminists, has it in their heads that only women can be raped and if a man is raped, he is lucky, overreacting, or making it up.
Did you not notice that you linked to a womens news site. That site was saying that the comments were disgusting.
Both male and female victims are talked about. "She deserved it" "she was dressed like a ****" "she should have never been there in the first place"
Both sides deal with the same thing. The only way to change perceptions is for victims to stand up.
I do stand up for female disadvantage. I stand right beside feminist and women's rights activists all the time giving their cause my support. You don't know what I believe or think, so please don't assume you do. Just because you deny that men have actual disadvantages and are systematically discriminated against, doesn't make it so. Society, especially liberal feminists like to hide and deny such things. Why? I have no clue why anyone who supposedly stands for equal rights, would deny equal rights for anyone. It has never made sense to me. It also makes no sense to me when feminists tell me that they are working on these issues already in their own way, I have yet to see any feminist prove this. They claim we should label ourselves are feminists and support their issues, if we want to fight for our own. This makes no sense and feel it is a cop-out so they don't have to acknowledge that men do have some inequality issues that need to be addressed. They can't universal male privilege if men also face disadvantages.
I'm a male going into teaching. I'm well aware of instances of male disadvantage. They might even affect me.
I just don't feel the need to turn this into a men vs. women battle and attack feminists (most of whom have a main goal of ensuring gender equality for everyone) in order to address instances of male disadvantage.
I already gave examples of this. Just look up men's rights groups, it doesn't take long to find feminist attacking the issues the MRA's stand for.
So you want me to do your work. This seems to be becoming a theme. You are proclaiming foul and accusing feminists (which is very vauge). If you want to be taken seriously give specific examples/links. As I said your examples for the most part have nothing to do with rights. I agree there were a few legitmate examples but again where is the advocacy on men's part. I have never heard of and activists or what they are doing to bring these issues to the public attention. Do you?
Yes, I can voluntarily sign up for selective service or face five years in jail, up to $250,000 in fines, be denied financial aid, voting rights, a driver's license, and much more. But I have a choice, right?
And women put that in place?
Not surprising, methinks you're barking up the wrong tree.
S igh
Yes rape is a crime so is discrimination. But the spotlight on rape culture and focus on men makes it hard for a man to go to a park with their kids, work in a daycare, or any job that works with kids. Men are not the problem, society is.
I'm forced to work at nights at my job that's in a dangerous neighborhood, because my life is less important. I'm faced with working the job at nights and walking home at midnight, or find a new job. Chances are that job will have to be at night as women don't normally work at night because its too dangerous for them.
I also get paid less at my job. I'm the only male and I do the physical labor, the women stand behind the counter and make more than I do. We'vell been here equal time and have similar experience.
When it comes to days off, I got the last pick. When I want vacation time, I am t their mercy. When they want vacation
time I am required
to cover them.
So you can deny the legitimacy of these issues all you want, but they are issues and I won't be told by a feminist that I can't. I'm called a fascist for advocating men's
rights. How is feminist having the only say on gender equality not fascist?
Ok first if your claims at work are legitmate you as a man have the same right as I as a women to file suit against your employer for discrimination. That is what a right is. I see plenty of men at the park with and without kids. There is no law barring men from working with kids. Most daycare positions pay squat and that is why you dont see a lot of men there. Now get on up to teaching school, especially on the highschool, university level you will see more men because the PAY is better.
You are not forced to work any job. You are not forced to walk home at midnight. The equal opportunity law are not meant to guarentee everyone the cushy dream job they desire. That is up to us as individuals.
What you describe are isssues not rights. You need to understand the differenence. Do you actually actively advocate for men's rights (issues). Do you allow feminists to tell you that you cant? Has a member of a feminist organization actually called you a fascist?
I have been told that If you are a men's rights advocate you are sexist, but if you are a women's rights advocate you are about equality. Explain, please.
Also, I have heard that feminists are working on men's rights issues, and by men's rights groups working on it too, they are somehow derailing their progress. But, I have yet to see any feminist group working or standing up for men's rights.
Why are feminists so against men's rights advocacy groups?
Men's rights advocacy groups are like white rights advocacy groups in America redundant and hateful.
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Boy...got anything else to offer other than 40 year old feminist propaganda?
