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I didn't say white privilege was economic. I said that the video you provided as evidence said it was.
Quote:
Originally Posted by kidkaos2
That's fine, but again that isn't what your initial video was about. I watched it. Bill O'Reilly and John Stewart discussed the disadvantages black people have in achieving success due to coming from ghettos. I never said white privilege didn't exist. I just said your video doesn't support your assertion that white privilege has nothing to do with economics.
I have no interest in repeating myself to people who have trouble reading.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Opin_Yunated
No, white privilege is not economic. White privilege can result in economic privilege. They are not synonymous. OJ Simpson's white privilege didn't help him get off.. did it?
Blacks' burden is both societal and economical. They are not mutually exclusive. Barack Obama and Henry Louis Gates don't have white privilege, but have economic privilege. They are still subject to social biases due to skin color.
My assertion was clearly mentioned above. I said white privilege does not equal economic privilege. They can exist together or independently. The discussion used housing segregation as an example. It also asked... "why aren't wall-street bankers being stopped and frisked?"
Quote:
Originally Posted by kidkaos2
No, he doesn't. He didn't back away from his racist "typical white person" comment nor from his "bitter clingers" comment nor from his Trayvon Martin comments nor from his comments about racism and Katrina.
He did back away in 2009, because he had to get re-elected.
Quote:
Originally Posted by kidkaos2
Backing away from racial comments when your opposing party's constituency is angry white racists is absurd. You're not even making sense. If you can expose racism in your opponents then you win, not lose. Come on.
Maybe the GOP should heed your advice.
Quote:
Originally Posted by kidkaos2
And by the way, with your "angry white racist" comment, welcome to being a bigot yourself.
stubborn and complete intolerance of any creed, belief, or opinion that differs from one's own.
Since I issued no such proclaimation of hating "angry white racists," (proclamation =/= intolerance) you made an incorrect use of the term.
Quote:
Originally Posted by kidkaos2
Maybe or maybe not. But does that alter the fact that when they arrived the police acted appropriately? No, it doesn't. What you're doing is speculating. What I pointed out is fact. The facts of your link do not demonstrate any white privilege.
Actually it does. Why was the police called? He was on his property.
Quote:
Originally Posted by kidkaos2
You're making a race based assumption without any factual provable knowledge. In other words, you are being a bigot.
The facts were - man was arrested on his own porch. He was questioned despite his license saying it was his place of residence.
Quote:
Originally Posted by kidkaos2
I didn't cite any grievances. That was someone else. Once again, please follow your own advice to read more carefully.
If a post was not directed to you, don't bring it up in your argument.
I hear 'White privilege' and I think of Condoleeza Rice, among others. I'm sure her privileges far exceed mine and I'm not even black. Some others might include OJ Simpson.
Ok... can people STOP using OJ as an example for anything, now?
The man is locked up for life. The people who wanted him to rot in '95 are finally getting what they want.
I don't understand what sort of response people who stress the "white privilege" meme would like from white people.
Is it enough to say, "Yeah, there are situations where being white probably made things easier for me", i.e, speaking to other white people who didn't know me?
Should I then feel pity for all blacks I encounter?
Should I feel ashamed of myself?
Should I support any and all programs that claim to help blacks?
Should I rush to denigrate or dismiss the accomplishments of whites in the past --- from Christopher Columbus to my grandparents --- because they were "people of privilege"?
If I fail to do any of the above, am I a racist? I'm not trying to be flippant or facetious, I'm honestly curious.
Because the visceral reaction I have to such programs (and I say this as someone who strives to be honest about my own personal moral failures and shortcomings) is resistance.
Everyone has challenges to overcome, and if you endorse a culture of grievance, I fear you're just going make "privileged people" resent the feeling of being browbeat into confessing their "privilege", particularly whites who grew up in tough circumstances or who currently struggle to get by.
When you go from rightfully criticizing individual acts of hatred and violence against blacks to creating categories of collective guilt like "white privilege" I think you're moving into Mindcrime territory.
"Blacks' burden is both societal and economical. They are not mutually exclusive. Barack Obama and Henry Louis Gates don't have white privilege, but have economic privilege. They are still subject to social biases due to skin color."
Are there social biases due to skin color - not like there used to be but yes there is - but guess what - blacks don't have the market cornered on it. There are other minorities that are also discriminated against but I think the bulk of the American population are well over the skin color issue - there are more important things like economics, health crisis, or the threat of terrorists.
So basically your argument is to anoint my argument correct and downplay its importance. Got it.
Quote:
Originally Posted by TriMT7
Oh. Go on. Enlighten us as to what your social justice professor taught you what the academic definition of "white privilege" is. It's always fascinating that social science is treated like hard science, where you believe there is some objectivity to the field.
Lemme guess... this the same professor who taught you the academic definition of racism through the prism of "there is no racism without power?"
Do me a favor and slap who ever is teaching you that kind of nonsense. Or whatever social justice tumblr blog you're using as reference. "White privilege" as discussed by professors and the black community is an theoretically unsophisticated and incomplete approach to complex phenomena and problems. Period.
Yes, I know.. slap "liberal academics." Should I slap my engineering professors too?
Quote:
Originally Posted by TriMT7
No, it is YOU have deflected from my argument. I have admitted there is privilege EVERYWHERE, depending on what context we are looking at, and I admitted as much. This is true around the world.
I gave many different examples of the various privileges that exist in our society. You have privileges others do not. You have privileges that other white people may not, depending on the situation. Nobody can argue that. The question is, "what do you want to be done about it?" Maybe more importantly.... what do you think CAN or SHOULD be done about it? Beyond teaching people to do their best to treat everyone as equal, and respect people?
Can start by reforming the criminal justice system and destroying the Prison Industrial Complex. Let's also end the war on drugs. Legalize marijuana.
Quote:
Originally Posted by TriMT7
Definitely race was a #1 factor in the past for determining outcomes of black people. But TODAY, delve deeper into inequality of outcomes in many contexts based on "skin color," and the harsh truth is that you'll often the more important explanatory factors have more to do with systemic cultural issues that only marginally correlate to race (because race and culture are not synonymous).
For example: Do you know what % of black children are born into single parent households vs. other races or ethnicities? Do you know what the #1 factor is in common for "children living in poverty," regardless of their race? Do you know that the number one determinant of how far someone will go in life is where they started out in life?
Yea, 400 years of oppression let's throw it out the window because a black man was elected president. The slate was wiped clean.
Quote:
Originally Posted by TriMT7
Do you know why east Asian descent people have the highest test scores and are the highest earners in the country as a "group?"... and Jewish, who despite being 3% of the population hold 10X or more their representation in fields such as law, medicine, government and business.
Why are African-immigrants the most educated group in the country? What is the difference between them and native-born blacks?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Taratova
There are wealthy blacks as well as whites.. is there black privilege? Yes there is... I think it should be called RICH PRIVILEGE. Jon Stewart is wealthy.. he should give most of his money to the poor so he doesn't feel like he is privileged if he is so bothered by it.
Being a wealthy black =/= a "black privilege."
Quote:
Originally Posted by TriMT7
A portion are simply situational mechanics of living in a world where everyone is not the same. Half of those are simply whining. Honestly. Bandaids? I wonder if the stores in Zaire stock as much white people shampoo as they do African hair products?
A remainder are legitimate. But what good does pointing out someone else's privilege - be it racial, economic, or any other kind - do when it's actually not an issue? Or when someone isn't using their privilege against you?
Privilege is a fact of life. However, we strive to allow everyone a chance to succeed. Privilege is alright if it doesn't oppress the underprivileged.
I don't understand what sort of response people who stress the "white privilege" meme would like from white people.
Is it enough to say, "Yeah, there are situations where being white probably made things easier for me", i.e, speaking to other white people who didn't know me?
Should I then feel pity for all blacks I encounter?
Should I feel ashamed of myself?
Should I support any and all programs that claim to help blacks?
Should I rush to denigrate or dismiss the accomplishments of whites in the past --- from Christopher Columbus to my grandparents --- because they were "people of privilege"?
If I fail to do any of the above, am I a racist? I'm not trying to be flippant or facetious, I'm honestly curious.
Because the visceral reaction I have to such programs (and I say this as someone who strives to be honest about my own personal moral failures and shortcomings) is resistance.
Everyone has challenges to overcome, and if you endorse a culture of grievance, I fear you're just going make "privileged people" resent the feeling of being browbeat into confessing their "privilege", particularly whites who grew up in tough circumstances or who currently struggle to get by.
When you go from rightfully criticizing individual acts of hatred and violence against blacks to creating categories of collective guilt like "white privilege" I think you're moving into Mindcrime territory.
+1
Never a good answer to the question. Ok, privilege recognized. And now what?
What do any of us do when we recognize our various privileges (and we all have many)? Empathize with those who are not similarly privileged? Ok. I can do that.
Never a good answer to the question. Ok, privilege recognized. And now what?
What do any of us do when we recognize our various privileges (and we all have many)? Empathize with those who are not similarly privileged? Ok. I can do that.
What else?
Good, we are getting somewhere.
Now be conscious of your prejudices and how they can oppress people without that privilege. Be an ally when injustices happen. You have the right idea!
The great irony in all of this is that liberal, Jewish Jon Stewart is the embodiment of so-called "white privilege" than working-class, Irish Bill O'Reilly ever was.
I don't understand what sort of response people who stress the "white privilege" meme would like from white people.
Is it enough to say, "Yeah, there are situations where being white probably made things easier for me", i.e, speaking to other white people who didn't know me?
Should I then feel pity for all blacks I encounter?
Should I feel ashamed of myself?
Should I support any and all programs that claim to help blacks?
Should I rush to denigrate or dismiss the accomplishments of whites in the past --- from Christopher Columbus to my grandparents --- because they were "people of privilege"?
If I fail to do any of the above, am I a racist? I'm not trying to be flippant or facetious, I'm honestly curious.
Because the visceral reaction I have to such programs (and I say this as someone who strives to be honest about my own personal moral failures and shortcomings) is resistance.
Everyone has challenges to overcome, and if you endorse a culture of grievance, I fear you're just going make "privileged people" resent the feeling of being browbeat into confessing their "privilege", particularly whites who grew up in tough circumstances or who currently struggle to get by.
When you go from rightfully criticizing individual acts of hatred and violence against blacks to creating categories of collective guilt like "white privilege" I think you're moving into Mindcrime territory.
A lot of white people believe as long as theyre not "rich", white privilege doesn't apply to them
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