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I think what people mean when they say Europe isn't free like the US is because they're socialists. People in Europe look to and count on their government to take care of them. They always have.
European socialism spread after that Hitler thing and Khrushchev thing. But Europeans would say they are more free than we are in the U.S. because in many of those countries they are free of worrying about health care, free of worry about how they will get their kids through college, free of worry about health effects of GMO and glyphosate, free of worry about how they will survive when they're too old to work any longer, and free of laws stopping workers from organizing to petition for their interests.
Think about this: the ultimate indicator of the success of a government and the freedom of the people is found in the U.N. measure of Global Happiness survey. If we have the highest Global Happiness score in the world, little else matters. And Denmark has had the highest score for a while.
This is my first time at the political forum so please bear with me. I'm asking this question to learn because as of now ive lived a shelter life when it comes to happenings around the globe.
One thing I'm interested in is I always hear conservatives say "vote for us-- keep your freedoms... otherwise we will end up like Western Europe". I then go read an article or look at the news on line and it would appear most people from England, France, Spain, Germany, etc are "free". They go to work, school, have families-- doesn't seem much different than what we do here in the states. So what freedoms do Americans have that folks in those other countries don't? I know guns is one-- but they still hunt in England? So can someone please help me understand? I need specifics....
Finally, I know there is A LOT of fear mongering out there. The quote above may just be that-- I don't know. Liberals are guilty at that as well....
Thanks
I would start with you reading the Bill of Rights then many of the writings of our founding Fathers.
The Federalist Papers is a good place to start.
After that look at the Western European laws and see how the compare and why.
In my opinion it's "Freedom From" vs "Freedom To". I have numerous European friends (both in work and home life). They truly believe their governments should care for them from birth to death - a freedom from need..... and of course they pay for it in many different forms
The U.S. has been historically been the opposite. A person is expected to basically take care of themselves and really not to expect much from the government - it's small and stays out of the way...... but of course in the last few decades that has changed.
I prefer the U.S. model and would use the term liberty in stead of freedom......
Well, my opinion is that the use of the slogans raving about "freedom" and "individualism" and "liberty" and "self reliance" in the U.S. is a cultural characteristic, and it is cultural because the leading and dominant voices represented a cause they cherished, and that is the cause of capitalism. It is all in support of the psychology and economic and political needs of the capitalist and their success. And it sounds so good that they have succeeded in convincing most of us that we have a stake in their right to own private profit. If you eliminate that economic model and replace it with one that is truly based on government and society that is "of the people, by the people, and for the people" there is suddenly no need, and far less interest in the slogans of private profit.
I think generally, right wingers think along the lines of "If I ever become rich one day, I want x freedoms."
Whereas those on the left, including in Europe, tend to think "If I ever lose my job, have an accident, or some other worst case scenario happens, I want my family and I to be free from fear and worrying about death or suffering, etc".
This is my first time at the political forum so please bear with me. I'm asking this question to learn because as of now ive lived a shelter life when it comes to happenings around the globe.
One thing I'm interested in is I always hear conservatives say "vote for us-- keep your freedoms... otherwise we will end up like Western Europe". I then go read an article or look at the news on line and it would appear most people from England, France, Spain, Germany, etc are "free". They go to work, school, have families-- doesn't seem much different than what we do here in the states. So what freedoms do Americans have that folks in those other countries don't? I know guns is one-- but they still hunt in England? So can someone please help me understand? I need specifics....
Finally, I know there is A LOT of fear mongering out there. The quote above may just be that-- I don't know. Liberals are guilty at that as well....
Thanks
You're right to say that the differences are largely exaggerated. Europe isn't generally all that different from the USA in most things.
But here are some specific freedoms that we have in the USA that some or all of Europe doesn't have:
The right to bear arms, as you already mentioned. All over Europe, it is extremely difficult to get a gun for any purpose, including hunting.
The right to own a stun gun. You have a similar list of nations where it's illegal.
Freedom of speech -- "Hate speech" is illegal in much of Western Europe. Enforcement isn't really consistent since Muslim's spouting hate are rarely ever prosecuted. Also, what is or is not "hate speech" is a matter of opinion in many cases.
European nations are far more Socialistic, so you have far more cases of freeloaders milking the system for all it's worth.
Many nations in Europe are weaker due process of law and justice than the USA in many areas. I'm told that France can theoretically hold a foreigner for question indefinitely without breaking any laws.
In the greater scheme of things, freedoms in Europe and freedoms in the USA are not much different. The GOP sees Europe as one giant failed Socialist experiment and there is a great tendency to exaggerate their flaws. Presently, Europe is doing just fine for the most part.
I think generally, right wingers think along the lines of "If I ever become rich one day, I want x freedoms."
Whereas those on the left, including in Europe, tend to think "If I ever lose my job, have an accident, or some other worst case scenario happens, I want my family and I to be free from fear and worrying about death or suffering, etc".
I've never really thought of it that way, so definitely interesting...I think it may be that way for some, but I'm not sure that's accurate for most.
I think freedoms were infringed when individual countries lost their sovereignty to the European Union.
The US is still sovereign, but there is something called the North American Union developing. Look it up and see who's behind it (Cruz and his wife in particular).
Wow, Ted and Heidi Cruz are SO POWERFUL! Maybe that's why Trump is so hateful towards Cruz.
Where is that tinfoil hatted emoji when you need him.
This has been good deal more polite than I thought it would be, nice job.
I'll throw in that much depends on what European country you're talking about. In Finland, Norway and Sweden you can hike, ride, kayak even camp just about anywhere in the countryside , for instance.
The "Right of Public Access" (""Allemandsretten) makes it perfectly legal to move about (almost) anywhere as long as you don't damage anything and stay away from livestock, cultivated fields, houses & gardens (obviously) etc. - in other words, common sense rules. You can even pick wild berries or mushrooms.
Is this freedom? Depends on whether you're a hiker or landowner, I guess...
I think generally, right wingers think along the lines of "If I ever become rich one day, I want x freedoms."
Whereas those on the left, including in Europe, tend to think "If I ever lose my job, have an accident, or some other worst case scenario happens, I want my family and I to be free from fear and worrying about death or suffering, etc".
Doesn't hurt the entrepreneurial spirit, either - "If I start a business and fail, my family will still have healthcare, I'll still have a pension, my parents will be able to stay in their home."
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