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Old 03-21-2016, 03:22 PM
 
Location: Glendale, Arizona
482 posts, read 533,455 times
Reputation: 403

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Quote:
Originally Posted by dman72 View Post
What the hell does that have to do with "liberals".
The fact of the matter is in my 63 years of living, the only people I have heard put forth such foolish arguments were in fact LIBERALS. So it has everything to do with it. It's not my fault they're full of crap. It's not as if I went out and solicited them. They were just doing what comes perfectly natural for them.

 
Old 03-21-2016, 03:48 PM
 
33,016 posts, read 27,464,007 times
Reputation: 9074
Quote:
Originally Posted by TrexDigit View Post
Exactly.

And your point is what?

A tax expenditure is government overtaxing Taxpayer A in order to spend it on Taxpayer B.

It's NOT government's money - it's Taxpayer A's money.
 
Old 03-21-2016, 03:52 PM
 
13,711 posts, read 9,235,353 times
Reputation: 9845
Quote:
Originally Posted by InformedConsent View Post
That's ridiculous. Person X still paid person Y $80 of their own money. The government paid nothing.

No, Person X only paid $70 because the government credited back $10 to X.

So Person X paid $70.

The Government paid $10.

This is not supposed to be complicated.

.
 
Old 03-21-2016, 03:59 PM
 
33,016 posts, read 27,464,007 times
Reputation: 9074
Quote:
Originally Posted by InformedConsent View Post
It's not confusing. One merely doesn't pay what one doesn't owe.

Money that is not owed to a payee cannot be considered an expenditure on the payee's part when that money is not collected. The payee was not intended to receive that money. Period.

How do you explain A having lower income than B and paying more tax than B?

How does B get to owe less tax than A who has lower income?
 
Old 03-21-2016, 04:01 PM
 
Location: CO
2,172 posts, read 1,454,188 times
Reputation: 972
Quote:
Originally Posted by freemkt View Post
And your point is what?
Read any of my posts and you might get a clue.
Quote:
Originally Posted by freemkt View Post
A tax expenditure is government overtaxing Taxpayer A in order to spend it on Taxpayer B.
No.
Quote:
Originally Posted by freemkt View Post
It's NOT government's money - it's Taxpayer A's money.
Who'd be getting the money without the expenditure?

Of course, we could always create more government waste by cutting checks AFTER people file their taxes since some cannot seem to grasp this most basic concept.
 
Old 03-21-2016, 04:01 PM
 
33,016 posts, read 27,464,007 times
Reputation: 9074
Quote:
Originally Posted by beb0p View Post
No, Person X only paid $70 because the government credited back $10 to X.

So Person X paid $70.

The Government paid $10.

This is not supposed to be complicated.

.

Wasn't that $10 paid by Y with government being merely the transfer agent?
 
Old 03-21-2016, 04:05 PM
 
13,711 posts, read 9,235,353 times
Reputation: 9845
Quote:
Originally Posted by freemkt View Post
Wasn't that $10 paid by Y with government being merely the transfer agent?
Person X is the transfer agent, with the government's money routed to Y.
.
 
Old 03-21-2016, 04:08 PM
 
13,711 posts, read 9,235,353 times
Reputation: 9845
Quote:
Originally Posted by petlover8 View Post
No, they just create them.
So, this is the "If you build it, they will come" argument again.

The right and their supply-side fantasy.
.
 
Old 03-21-2016, 04:25 PM
 
13,711 posts, read 9,235,353 times
Reputation: 9845
Quote:
Originally Posted by petlover8 View Post
This reminds me of when I hear all of these liberals constantly talk about "writing things off". I have to laugh. They tell me how foolish I am to have my house paid off. While they pay $10,000 a year in interest payments. They then proceed to tell me how I don't understand because they, "write it off". They claim, "I'm not taking advantage of all of the tax benefits the government is giving out". I try to tell them they're not giving out anything because they are only getting back the percentage of the tax bracket they fall into.

So for example, if they fall into a 20% tax bracket, they're only going to get back $2,000 of the $10,000 they paid. No matter how they cut it, they're still out $8,000 that I'm not. Their "write off" cost them $8K, period. They don't accept it and argue with me.

I then tell these liberal geniuses I'll make the same deal the government gives them. You pay me $10K over the course of the year. Any way you choose. Just so by December 31st you've given me $10,000. Then, by the following April 15th, I'll give you $2,000 back, and keep the remaining $8K for myself. Then you can run up and down the street, telling everyone who will listen, how badly you screwed me. And they talk about how we don't understand the tax code, all the while believing the bank is giving out free money.

That's a bad analogy, the $10,000 is interest payment. To make your example work, there has to be borrowed money in there somewhere.

Here is a better analogy: you lend me $300,000, I pay you $10,000 in interest every year. But on April 15, you refund $2,000 back to me.

Meanwhile I invest the $300,000 and make $15,000 a year. Minus your interest payment and factoring in the rebate, I am $7,000 in the black.
.
 
Old 03-21-2016, 04:31 PM
 
Location: CO
2,172 posts, read 1,454,188 times
Reputation: 972
Quote:
Originally Posted by beb0p View Post
That's a bad analogy, the $10,000 is interest payment. To make your example work, there has to be borrowed money in there somewhere.

Here is a better analogy: you lend me $300,000, I pay you $10,000 in interest every year. But on April 15, you refund $2,000 back to me.

Meanwhile I invest the $300,000 and make $15,000 a year. Minus your interest payment and factoring in the rebate, I am $7,000 in the black.
.
Exactly - and further that with compounding interest over time.

If someone's investing / saving wisely while you're paying off the house, you could be worlds apart balance-wise.
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