Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
bringing in illegals or whoever hasnt hurt me. im at least half black and in the best financial position of my life.
i know im not in the market for field or fast food jobs which illegals do.
if the economy is firing on all cylinders, nobody cares about illegal immigration, simple as that.
In the present day, the economy is not firing on all cylinders. What seemed to work in the past is no longer working. The faith based 'trickle down' concept is punctured by present day reality. 'A rising tide lifts all boats' has morphed into 'A falling tide sinks all boats'.
Immigration is only one factor. I watched the discussion cited in the OP & found very few points of disagreement.
A lot of good points both ways in this thread. I haven't read every post yet so pardon me if I'm someone already pointed this out, but it's not just about jobs for Black folks with immigration, it's about resources, voting power & the future.
Sure illegals take a disproportionate % of traditional Black jobs, but that's only half the damage. It also means Black folks have to battle the immigrants for all affirmative action positions. Academic entrance, scholarships, civil service jobs, etc. You already see the effects in California where many Blacks are now calling for Asians to be excluded from affirmative action in the Universities. All immigration did there was make the already limited academic resources for Blacks even more scarce.
Here in Minnesota the Somalis have moved in and like the Asians, they're very dedicated academically. They've set up charter schools that demand entrance to a post-graduation program in order to get their diplomas. They've set up a lending network at no-interest and are buying homes and becoming part of the middle class as the Blacks sit on the sideline watching. They've absolutely dominated the taxi, hotel worker and airport/train jobs that were the bread and butter of Blacks here in Mn. They also have a great sense of community and share info on government programs, freebies, etc and help one another apply for those resources. Every Section-8 home that new immigrant Somalis (or Hispanic, or Asians) gobble up is one less for a waiting Black family. Go by PC's for People, the local non-profit that sells/repairs computers and low cost internet. In 10 years the Somalis have leap-frogged over the US Blacks on the cultural ladder. Same with the Asians. Same with Hispanics. There's no question that this immigration, both legal and illegal hits Blacks harder than Whites proportionally.
Then there's the future. There's no real Black-Brown coalition, other than temporary alliances of convenience. Hispanics have no respect for US Blacks, who they see as having pissed away all the opportunity in the world. They want THEIR kids to get those college acceptance letters, scholarships, civil service jobs, etc. and don't give a damn about including Blacks. More importantly, they're the fastest growing demographic and as their votes become more and more important than that of the dwindling Blacks, resources, by necessity, must be diverted to them and away from the Black community. As they continue to catch up to Whites and eventually overtake them in population & voting power, it will only make the Black vote & community more and more insignificant.
IMO it is silly for people to even think that the above was true in regards to the 1950s.
Black people were not doing better in the 1950s versus today. In the 1950s over 75% of black people lived in poverty. In the 1950s black people were still being lynched in the south. In the 1950s black people could not hold jobs in a specific field or even be a supervisor or manager of a manufacturing outlet. In the 1950s on all fronts, black people were worse socio-economically than we are today. Crime rates around the country for every demographic were on the rise in the 1950s and reached a climax in the 1960s/1970s.
The businesses of which you speak were true of all ethnic group due to the entrenched racism and discrimination lodged at people who were "different." Black people had to have businesses in their community because whites and even lowly regarded immigrant whites in many instances would not serve them.
The demise of black commercial districts occurred because black people fought for the end of housing discrimination and were able to move to whatever neighborhood they could afford. They fought for the end of discrimination in hiring and promotion and were subsequently in the 1960s and forward allowed to be employed as supervisors/managers and to make more money and so were able to be more open with where they spent their money.
The only thing I agree with you on is the fact that "urban renewal" was a culprit in the decline of black neighborhoods, this mostly occurred by the razing of black neighborhood for public works projects, including public housing being constructed and enforced by race (which is why a majority of inner city black neighborhoods deal with concentrated poverty to this day - ones where those projects have not been demolished and gentrified). Also freeways and road construction and other public buildings were built on land where black people lived and owned businesses because they were easier to take advantage of by local, state and federal governments since black people and their concerns are usually ignored anyway.
And yet employment and two parent homes were the norm and on par with Whites. Today unemployment is double for Blacks and almost 75% of all Black students come from single parent homes who live under the poverty line.
Black people don't like to work but illegal Mexicans do. This Obama understands and in his wisdom he Know we need millions of illegals which is exactly why he encourahes border jumpers.
LMAO....see what I mean?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mason3000
A lot of good points both ways in this thread. I haven't read every post yet so pardon me if I'm someone already pointed this out, but it's not just about jobs for Black folks with immigration, it's about resources, voting power & the future.
Sure illegals take a disproportionate % of traditional Black jobs, but that's only half the damage. It also means Black folks have to battle the immigrants for all affirmative action positions. Academic entrance, scholarships, civil service jobs, etc. You already see the effects in California where many Blacks are now calling for Asians to be excluded from affirmative action in the Universities. All immigration did there was make the already limited academic resources for Blacks even more scarce.
Here in Minnesota the Somalis have moved in and like the Asians, they're very dedicated academically. They've set up charter schools that demand entrance to a post-graduation program in order to get their diplomas. They've set up a lending network at no-interest and are buying homes and becoming part of the middle class as the Blacks sit on the sideline watching. They've absolutely dominated the taxi, hotel worker and airport/train jobs that were the bread and butter of Blacks here in Mn. They also have a great sense of community and share info on government programs, freebies, etc and help one another apply for those resources. Every Section-8 home that new immigrant Somalis (or Hispanic, or Asians) gobble up is one less for a waiting Black family. Go by PC's for People, the local non-profit that sells/repairs computers and low cost internet. In 10 years the Somalis have leap-frogged over the US Blacks on the cultural ladder. Same with the Asians. Same with Hispanics. There's no question that this immigration, both legal and illegal hits Blacks harder than Whites proportionally.
Then there's the future. There's no real Black-Brown coalition, other than temporary alliances of convenience. Hispanics have no respect for US Blacks, who they see as having pissed away all the opportunity in the world. They want THEIR kids to get those college acceptance letters, scholarships, civil service jobs, etc. and don't give a damn about including Blacks. More importantly, they're the fastest growing demographic and as their votes become more and more important than that of the dwindling Blacks, resources, by necessity, must be diverted to them and away from the Black community. As they continue to catch up to Whites and eventually overtake them in population & voting power, it will only make the Black vote & community more and more insignificant.
We don't care about getting respect from Hispanics. Hell, we weren't getting any respect from whites either and we've managed to survive. You're right...there is no black-Brown coalition and one isn't needed anyway.
Fact is, whites have always preferred Hispanics over blacks and will always continue to do so.
We should leave things the way they are. Regardless, blacks need to stay out of this whole illegal immigration mess. It's not our fight. This is a fight between people who are descended from immigrant groups, which is why they're so touchy on this issue.
Blacks are not the descendants of immigrants. So we aren't nearly as touchy feely on the issue.
Sorry. Whites can't be trusted. You know I'm right.
Lemme run down my example again since you ignored it.
In 1959, the whole south (the region you love) was in the grip of Jim Crow. No state moreso than the state of Florida.
All of a sudden, Cuba has internal troubles, and white folks welcome HISPANIC Cubans into Florida with open arms by the hundreds of thousands. Those Cubans face no Jim Crow (although I'm sure they faced some discrimination) and in fact, are given the keys to the city of Miami (where blacks are heavily restricted) and put ahead of blacks that have inhabited Florida since slavery.
That sir, is called proof of white duplicity on the matter. Blacks cannot afford to get involved in this mess. A mess NOT created by us in the first place. White owned business and corporations brought these people here. Get them to clean it up.
When whites lost millions of jobs in a bunch of industries and watched their cities and towns get overrun with illegal labor, they did nothing. And voting Republican doesn't count as "action." The Republican Party has done nothing about illegals. Reagan signed the first amnesty. Forgot about that? George W. Bush wanted to come up with a plan for them to stay too. And why not? Texas is a sanctuary state.
Sorry, but we'll sit this one out.
President Obama...... just who is bringing immigration in by land and sea, would it be Hillary and Obama!
Actually, what has Bill Clinton( except to claim he was the first black President) Hillary or President Obama done to help blacks, rather than focusing on immigration?
Actually, I seen a lot of whites change job careers, many became entrepreneurs and trying to make it like everyone else.
We don't care about getting respect from Hispanics. Hell, we weren't getting any respect from whites either and we've managed to survive. You're right...there is no black-Brown coalition and one isn't needed anyway.
Fact is, whites have always preferred Hispanics over blacks and will always continue to do so.
We should leave things the way they are. Regardless, blacks need to stay out of this whole illegal immigration mess. It's not our fight. This is a fight between people who are descended from immigrant groups, which is why they're so touchy on this issue.
Blacks are not the descendants of immigrants. So we aren't nearly as touchy feely on the issue.
I get your bitterness & don't necessarily disagree with you philosophically. I do disagree that it's all a wash for Blacks though. No, illegal or even legal immigration hurts Blacks far more than the status quo does. Your stance seems to be "we're f'd anyway, so who cares". That would make perfect sense if the Black population was going to remain static at 13% of total population. However, with the Hispanic population projected to double in 4-5 decades, while Whites and Blacks remain relatively static, that means any political power or momentum currently enjoyed by Blacks becomes diluted and irrelevant. Basically it ensure Blacks go the way of the American Indian, in that their population is so small that they have no voting power or political voice.
We don't care about getting respect from Hispanics. Hell, we weren't getting any respect from whites either and we've managed to survive. You're right...there is no black-Brown coalition and one isn't needed anyway.
Fact is, whites have always preferred Hispanics over blacks and will always continue to do so.
We should leave things the way they are. Regardless, blacks need to stay out of this whole illegal immigration mess. It's not our fight. This is a fight between people who are descended from immigrant groups, which is why they're so touchy on this issue.
Blacks are not the descendants of immigrants. So we aren't nearly as touchy feely on the issue.
The Mariel Boat Lift and Cuban immigration was one of the most contentious mass immigration issues in our history. The idea that Whites greeted the Cubans with open arms as equals is nonsense. Never mind the crime wave they brought with them. You're way off base.
In the present day, the economy is not firing on all cylinders. What seemed to work in the past is no longer working. The faith based 'trickle down' concept is punctured by present day reality. 'A rising tide lifts all boats' has morphed into 'A falling tide sinks all boats'.
Immigration is only one factor. I watched the discussion cited in the OP & found very few points of disagreement.
True.
As I see it, if people don't want to lose their jobs to illegals, then get trained in jobs that can't be as easily taken by them.
There is no other solution. Petitioning to have illegals deported won't work. They aren't gonna leave
the DNC and the general polices have not helped Black America. Sharpton ,Jackson and most recent Obama has not significantly improved American Blacks. Why do you think there is so much unrest in cities ,like Ferguson ,Mo, Philly and Detroit?
Is call real jobs and it has bottom out the lat8years of Obama. Every is feeling the bad economic polices of this President.
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.
Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
DNC since LBJ
