Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
These discussions have to deal with Rates of crime, not totals. Just as with welfare. Sure, more whites than blacks receive welfare, but as a % of their relative populations, blacks receive welfare at a higher Rate. The stats are provided over and over.
Whether the causes are slavery, racism, absentee fathers, the justice system, etc.., let's not dance around the facts.
My discussion remains, I do not believe that "black on black crime" exist, this is something mentioned by the OP so I am not "dancing around" any "facts."
The fact of the matter is that both the OP and I are correct in that crime is crime no matter who commits it against whatever person of another or the same heritage/skin color.
In regards to the "facts" that are often ignored is the fact that over 95% of black people do not commit violent crime.
In regards to crime I do not think slavery is an issue (I read the OP and didn't see where he even mentioned slavery, usually slavery is brought up by white people in these sorts of discussions, as are unconnected things to crime like "absentee fathers" FYI being born out of wedlock does not mean a father is "absent" and while out of wedlock births increased for black people, the "fact" of the matter is that both educational achievement has increased during that period AND crime has DECREASED during the same period. Anyone can use stats to "dance" around and prove a point and especially so in regards to attempting to prove that black people are inferior to other groups, which is what many of the posters do on this forum).
Clearly you didn't read my initial post. And I made this post so people stop posting the same old derivative garbage. Time to change the discussion.
Read it? It was overly-wordy and didn't seem to make any points, and if there was any (points), they were lost in a forest of excess words.
The only part I seemed to have an understanding was that it was not reasonable to expect blacks to stop committing violence against other blacks since they aren't the police.
Try again, but use 25% of the words you used on the first try and possibly it will get read.
Here is the question. Why are those stats brought up, often ad nauseam? What is the purpose. A statistic is that, numbers. It is why it gets brought up that counts. If the reason is to complain about Blacks, then there is nothing that can come out of that except stirring up more anger and resentment.
Probably because EVERYTHING in this country is delineated along racial lines.
What is your purpose in denigrating statistics or numbers as you say? NUMBERS answer all kinds of questions. They elucidate all kinds of situations.
Should the DOJ cease collecting and analyzing crime statistics because you and others find them embarrassing?
The NUMBERS are evidence to a very drastic problem. It gets brought up because that is what you do with problems- you bring them up so that they get discussed honestly with hope of forging a solution.
If that makes black people angry and resentful, then you can add denial to the array of issues that includes an out of proportion propensity for violence.
Probably because EVERYTHING in this country is delineated along racial lines.
What is your purpose in denigrating statistics or numbers as you say? NUMBERS answer all kinds of questions. They elucidate all kinds of situations.
Should the DOJ cease collecting and analyzing crime statistics because you and others find them embarrassing?
The NUMBERS are evidence to a very drastic problem. It gets brought up because that is what you do with problems- you bring them up so that they get discussed honestly with hope of forging a solution.
If that makes black people angry and resentful, then you can add denial to the array of issues that includes an out of proportion propensity for violence.
Either you didn't comprehend what I was saying, or you don't care. Statistics are statistics. Why people bring them up is what matters. It is not statistics that angers alot of Blacks. It is the fact that alot of people bring them up as a reason to attack Black people and complain about them. What part of that did you not get?
If I knew nothing about the situation, I could look at the numbers and think "Oh, those are the stats. It doesn't apply to me. I'm not doing the killing or getting killed, and I don't see any of it happening around me". Instead, I have to worry about "all you do is complain about Black people".
Either you didn't comprehend what I was saying, or you don't care. Statistics are statistics. Why people bring them up is what matters. It is not statistics that angers alot of Blacks. It is the fact that alot of people bring them up as a reason to attack Black people and complain about them. What part of that did you not get?
If I knew nothing about the situation, I could look at the numbers and think "Oh, those are the stats. It doesn't apply to me. I'm not doing the killing or getting killed, and I don't see any of it happening around me". Instead, I have to worry about "all you do is complain about Black people".
No, I comprehended everything and answered your question. Clearly, it is not the answer you want, but that's the one you get.
One more time:
People bring them up because they are evidence of a serious problem.
Recently, it has been used as a rebuttal to some things said by BLM and others. While they are different topics, it is a legitimate response when it is stated that cops killing black people is the MAIN ISSUE affecting African-Americans.
This is of course nonsense and the stats tell us why. Gangbangers and thugs have killed more black people than the KKK and the police combined. Black people are mostly killed by other black people.
Now, if that fails to answer your question, you should not be addressing this subject.
No, I comprehended everything and answered your question. Clearly, it is not the answer you want, but that's the one you get.
One more time:
People bring them up because they are evidence of a serious problem.
Recently, it has been used as a rebuttal to some things said by BLM and others. While they are different topics, it is a legitimate response when it is stated that cops killing black people is the MAIN ISSUE affecting African-Americans.
This is of course nonsense and the stats tell us why. Gangbangers and thugs have killed more black people than the KKK and the police combined. Black people are mostly killed by other black people.
Now, if that fails to answer your question, you should not be addressing this subject.
On the red, how are they evidence of a serious problem when crime rates have gone down over the past 30 years to historic lows. Also how are they a serious problem in relation to violent crime when less than 5% of black people commit any crime at all in a given year??
On the blue, neither BLM nor black people as a whole have ever said that police killing black people is a MAIN ISSUE affecting us. We have said it is an issue that needs to be reformed.
On the black, white people are mostly killed by other white people as well. That is the point. Crime is predominantly intra-racial no matter the ethnicity and there are only about 10,000 murders per year in the country. About 4500 of them are of black people. There are about 40 million black people in the country. Even though I am saddened when anyone, regardless of race is killed statistically 4500 out of 40 million is not as "serious" as you and others want to make it out to be if all you are looking at is the numbers themselves.
Like green_mariner said, people can use statistics to prove any point they want to make. I can take all the statistics provided by the DOJ and make black people seem docile because I can always compare them to the population of blacks at-large (similar to how you do for welfare recipients) and show that in comparison to the population at-large of black Americans, violent crime is actually quite rare. Just using murder/homicide for example, on an annual basis 99.9999998875% of black Americans are not murdered or affected by murder/homicide.
On the red, how are they evidence of a serious problem when crime rates have gone down over the past 30 years to historic lows. Also how are they a serious problem in relation to violent crime when less than 5% of black people commit any crime at all in a given year??
On the blue, neither BLM nor black people as a whole have ever said that police killing black people is a MAIN ISSUE affecting us. We have said it is an issue that needs to be reformed.
On the black, white people are mostly killed by other white people as well. That is the point. Crime is predominantly intra-racial no matter the ethnicity and there are only about 10,000 murders per year in the country. About 4500 of them are of black people. There are about 40 million black people in the country. Even though I am saddened when anyone, regardless of race is killed statistically 4500 out of 40 million is not as "serious" as you and others want to make it out to be if all you are looking at is the numbers themselves.
Like green_mariner said, people can use statistics to prove any point they want to make. I can take all the statistics provided by the DOJ and make black people seem docile because I can always compare them to the population of blacks at-large (similar to how you do for welfare recipients) and show that in comparison to the population at-large of black Americans, violent crime is actually quite rare. Just using murder/homicide for example, on an annual basis 99.9999998875% of black Americans are not murdered or affected by murder/homicide.
On the blue, shrugged shoulders is not a response that can be taken seriously.
On the black, oh of course it is. There are demonstrations going on and the President himself has repeatedly addressed the issue. Yet there are no demonstrations against violence in the black community, which as proven, slaughters more blacks than the Klan could ever have.
And if the stats are as you claim, then none of this is an issue and one wonders why you are commenting on it. Your group has a problem. A big one. Blaming it on mine is not a proper response.
On the blue, shrugged shoulders is not a response that can be taken seriously.
On the black, oh of course it is. There are demonstrations going on and the President himself has repeatedly addressed the issue.Yet there are no demonstrations against violence in the black community, which as proven, slaughters more blacks than the Klan could ever have.
And if the stats are as you claim, then none of this is an issue and one wonders why you are commenting on it. Your group has a problem. A big one. Blaming it on mine is not a proper response.
On the black, none of the demonstrators, nor the president has said that police killing is the MAIN issue facing black Americans today....
On the red, just because you don't know about demonstrations/rallies about violence in majority black neighborhoods doesn't mean they don't occur. We just had one where I live a couple weeks ago and a major rally is held here every year and there is a coalition of individuals and organizations that work to curtail violent crime especially in black neighborhoods. This is commonplace in practically all cities with a large black population that deal with crime. Black people also have a high degree of involvement in neighborhood watch and block club programs in urban areas where they work together and with police to make their communities safer. This a major reason why crime has decreased in black neighborhoods.
I'm commenting to you specifically because you are attempting to tell me as a black person what my main issues are and what affects me and that something is a "serious" issue to me when it is not a serious issue to me. Hopefully the discourse will allow you to think more thoroughly about what you are saying and not to make generic statement about a demographic in our country which has population of 40 million persons who are all unique individuals and who have various types of life experiences based on various factors of their lives.
ETA: I also never "blamed" anything on your "group." I only stated that all demographics in this country have an experience with crime.
Here is the question. Why are those stats brought up, often ad nauseam? What is the purpose. A statistic is that, numbers. It is why it gets brought up that counts. If the reason is to complain about Blacks, then there is nothing that can come out of that except stirring up more anger and resentment.
I never bring up the stats unless someone else tries to avoid Rates of black against black, white against white, etc.., whether in crime, welfare, absent fathers.
I don't care why the topic in general is brought up. Maybe because it's an important social policy question.
When Obama recently called the Rate of black men killing other black men wacky, he mentioned 'investing' more in urban areas, after school programs, and other social policies. etc.
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.
Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
Your group has a problem. A big one. Blaming it on mine is not a proper response.