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The same could be said about Trump supporters so, at best, that is already baked in. The point is, Trump pardoned a man that was responsible for the deaths of many, who punished innocent people and delighted in the pain and torture of those he deemed to possibly be illegal immigrants. To say, "yes, that's terrible but Trump supporters don't like his detractors so they overlook that whole death thing" just shows the callousness of Trump supporters who only care about the deaths Trump tells them to care about.
Best way to make an argument for something is to argue against it incompetently. That's true in general. You're right on this one. You do a reasonably good job of laying out the facts here. Absolutely people would listen more to you individually than to the case against this in the thread as a whole (earlier, at least, not so much in the last few pages). You can call that callousness or just take it as a given -- how you deliver a message matters and someone doing it poorly next to someone doing it well will suck up all the oxygen.
Joe Arpaio was convicted of the highest level of misdemeanor before it becomes a felony. Many of the cases were settled for millions of dollars:
A federal investigation found that deputies had used stun guns on prisoners already strapped into a “restraint chair.” The family of one man who died after being forced into the restraint chair was awarded more than six million dollars as the result of a suit filed in federal court. The family of another man killed in the restraint chair got $8.25 million in a pre-trial settlement. (This deal was reached after the discovery of a surveillance video that showed fourteen guards beating, shocking, and suffocating the prisoner, and after the sheriff’s office was accused of discarding evidence, including the crushed larynx of the deceased.)
Best way to make an argument for something is to argue against it incompetently. That's true in general. You're right on this one. You do a reasonably good job of laying out the facts here. Absolutely people would listen more to you individually than to the case against this in the thread as a whole (earlier, at least, not so much in the last few pages). You can call that callousness or just take it as a given -- how you deliver a message matters and someone doing it poorly next to someone doing it well will suck up all the oxygen.
This is not about the likability of Trump supporters or Trump detractors. Arpaio was pardoned by Trump when people died. Arpaio was told to stop and he continued and has shown zero regret for it. The same people that screamed Benghazi for years have zero issue with Arpaio.
Not the point. If a family is found, however they are, car accident, visit to the ER, whatever, having committed no crime, should they be thrown in jail for having entered our country illegally, and likely dodged paying taxes as well? Yes or no.
But when ICE raids a construction job in TX, they aren't looking for illegal white Germans or illegal black Kenyans. What color do you think ICE looks for when raiding employers businesses?
If you go to the ER there is no law requiring that you have proof of citizenship and under those circumstances it is unlawful for law enforcement to detain you to investigate whether or not you are a citizen. If you are in an auto accident inquiries as to your legal status can only be made if there is probable cause to believe that you are in the Country illegally. (that part of AB1070 was upheld by SCOTUS with the stipulation that the individual cannot be detained during a car stop for a prolonged time for not carrying immigration documents)
Arpaio wanted all brown people stopped all the time no matter if they were suspected of being in the US unlawfully or not and he pursued that policy in spite of a Supreme Court decision nullifying that part of the law.
As far as ICE raids, the employer is required to provide a copy of documents proving legal status for all employees, they don't just scrutinize the ones for people who "look illegal".
This is not about the likability of Trump supporters or Trump detractors. Arpaio was pardoned by Trump when people died. Arpaio was told to stop and he continued and has shown zero regret for it. The same people that screamed Benghazi for years have zero issue with Arpaio.
More broadly, of course. This issue is the issue, not how people on //www.city-data.com/forum/ are talking about the issue. More narrowly, read the earlier thread and you'll see what I mean
edit: the 30's precisely. I read those initially and holy heck are a couple of the individuals posting there bad at convincing rhetoric. The thread isn't so bad before or after.
Correct and Obama pardoned hundreds of Drug dealers, a terrorist and criminals.
Like attracts like.
Not in his first year and none of them were sheriffs in positions with that level of authority, violating the US Constitution and depriving citizens of their civil rights.
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This is not about the likability of Trump supporters or Trump detractors. Arpaio was pardoned by Trump when people died. Arpaio was told to stop and he continued and has shown zero regret for it. The same people that screamed Benghazi for years have zero issue with Arpaio.
Exactly.
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