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its not just the 1% that gets clobbered by the estate taxes
follow me for a minute:
YOU are a 18year old only child in his last year of high school
you father and mother bought the house you live in( a small typical long island house about 2000sf on a 60x100 piece of property) house in Massapequa in 1995 for $130,000....today its worth 600,000(according to the state for property tax purposes)...its paid for..no mortgage..but the property taxes are 12,000 per year (1000 per month)
you father a mechanic by trade, took over (bought) a shop in 1998 (year before you were born)
the taxed value of his shop is as of today 12 million
your mother does mary kay and has put every dime she has made over the last 20 years in the bank for your education...she was able to make about 15k a year (so about 300k plus what ever in bank interest)
so again you are 18( officially an adult) and still in HS....your father and mother are the same age of 50.....
today you get word, that a tragic car accident has happened and they are both dead
the estate is deemed to be worth about 13 million
FEDERAL says they will tax at a 40% rate anything over 5.45 million...so 13 million - 5.45 mil is 7.55 mil, and 40% of that is 3.02 million
NYS says they will tax of 402,800 plus 12.0% of anything over 5 million so 12% of 8 million is 960k...plus 400k...total NYS ET 1.3 mil
so you as a 18 year old high schooler are going to get hit with a 4.32 million dollar tax bill....DUE WITHIN 90 DAYS
so you are going to have to do a short sale on the business and HOPE you can get at least 5 million (hopefully a little more) so you can atleast keep the house and finish HS and hopefully college.....if you cant dump the shop for that amount..then you will have to dump the house to...just to pay the thieving governments taxes......if that is the case...now you are homeless
and everything your father and mother worked for is gone....
so do you actually think the estate tax is fair?????
And that is because DOD didn't create a corporation or share the wealth as a partnership. This legal entity would infect shield the son from this tax bomb all because his father owned his own business. That is part of the reason that corporations exist in the first place. Tax and survivorship reasons.
Say you have parents who happened to do alright. Not millionaires. But comfortable. They pass away and leave you a beautiful house and some nice items. Could be dad had a numbers matching Chevelle or GTO or Mustang. His pride and joy. Mom could have had a few pieces of jewelry.
Mom and dad paid tax on the property. They weren't behind on taxes.
Mom paid sales tax when she bought her items.
Dad paid his sales tax when he bought that car.
Why should those items be taxed again?
You don't need to be a millionaire or billionaire to benefit from an estate...
It's obvious in this thread there exists a class of people who never have and never will be, and wouldn't know what do if they did make it big, and those that have and want to protect themselves and their kids.
You called those well to do spoiled? Who's asking for taxes being spent?
Say one of you who are demanding this not be enacted as if you're missing out, say you were some delinquent. Had a drug addiction problem. Illness. Whatever. You're down on your luck. Your only redeeming factor is if/when your parents pass away you get a chance to start over. You're already down on your luck. And opportunity awaits. But you have to pay a tax to inherit what is rightfully yours. Or do you believe the state/government is entitled to those things to be auctioned away at their discretion? I want you to think about that.
I'm 30 years old and I'm working my tail off. No kids. No wife. Let me tell you something. If all goes according to plan I'll be sitting on a huge plot of land out in the boonies where I won't have to worry about a nosy neighbor all the land I could build a nice back yard shooting range maybe even put in a dirtbike or quad track/trails or maybe even a 1/4 mile drag strip. You'd be crazy to suggest I leave what I worked my ass off for behind for the state to reward from. However I set the estate up/trust up. You think I'd let that go to charity?! Ask Bernie how many college kids he let's stay at his houses. He owns 3.
Think about it.
Why pay tax on something that you inherit?
Would you want what little or big you have to be kept from your kids/grandkids? Because they didn't have the money to pay for the estate?
Most people don't have $5.5 in assets as a single individual or a $11m in assets as a married couple though. Even if we God forbid keep but raise it there still won't be a lot of people getting hit with a tax bomb if they handle their businesses not as a sole proprietorship but as a corporation for tax and survivorship purposes.
Say you have parents who happened to do alright. Not millionaires. But comfortable. They pass away and leave you a beautiful house and some nice items. Could be dad had a numbers matching Chevelle or GTO or Mustang. His pride and joy. Mom could have had a few pieces of jewelry.
Mom and dad paid tax on the property. They weren't behind on taxes.
Mom paid sales tax when she bought her items.
Dad paid his sales tax when he bought that car.
Why should those items be taxed again?
You don't need to be a millionaire or billionaire to benefit from an estate...
It's obvious in this thread there exists a class of people who never have and never will be, and wouldn't know what do if they did make it big, and those that have and want to protect themselves and their kids.
You called those well to do spoiled? Who's asking for taxes being spent?
Say one of you who are demanding this not be enacted as if you're missing out, say you were some delinquent. Had a drug addiction problem. Illness. Whatever. You're down on your luck. Your only redeeming factor is if/when your parents pass away you get a chance to start over. You're already down on your luck. And opportunity awaits. But you have to pay a tax to inherit what is rightfully yours. Or do you believe the state/government is entitled to those things to be auctioned away at their discretion? I want you to think about that.
I'm 30 years old and I'm working my tail off. No kids. No wife. Let me tell you something. If all goes according to plan I'll be sitting on a huge plot of land out in the boonies where I won't have to worry about a nosy neighbor all the land I could build a nice back yard shooting range maybe even put in a dirtbike or quad track/trails or maybe even a 1/4 mile drag strip. You'd be crazy to suggest I leave what I worked my ass off for behind for the state to reward from. However I set the estate up/trust up. You think I'd let that go to charity?! Ask Bernie how many college kids he let's stay at his houses. He owns 3.
Think about it.
Why pay tax on something that you inherit?
Would you want what little or big you have to be kept from your kids/grandkids? Because they didn't have the money to pay for the estate?
Except would what you are leaving even qualify as an estate tax. While it varies state to state I believe the fed is at least 5 million. Does not sound like your dream even qualifies. As I said before only 5,5000 tax filers even get affected by the estate tax.
Sure, it's fair that low income people who are forced to spend every penny they earn on necessities in order to survive should have to pay tax on it all. Consumption taxes are regressive and punish the poor and lower middle class just for living.
That's why I said I support a progressive consumption tax. Reading is fundamental.
A progressive consumption tax would exempt the first $30K (or thereabouts) of money spent. Your tax rate would increase with the more money that you spend. Most people would likely still need to file a return each year, but it would be a return based on the money you've spent, not the money you've earned.
For those who can read, you'll find more information about it here:
That's why I said I support a progressive consumption tax. Reading is fundamental.
A progressive consumption tax would exempt the first $30K (or thereabouts) of money spent. Your tax rate would increase with the more money that you spend. Most people would likely still need to file a return each year, but it would be a return based on the money you've spent, not the money you've earned.
For those who can read, you'll find more information about it here:
That's all well and good but I doubt the rich and those that fear they will be hit with a tax bomb would be. That is the first issue i see. A second issue I see is with how it is enforceable. Remember having it based on money spent means that it would have to be tracked either by a government card or receipts throughout the year. Mechanically, this proposal would be hard to run.
That's all well and good but I doubt the rich and those that fear they will be hit with a tax bomb would be. That is the first issue i see. A second issue I see is with how it is enforceable. Remember having it based on money spent means that it would have to be tracked either by a government card or receipts throughout the year. Mechanically, this proposal would be hard to run.
There's a massive amount of fraud in the current income tax system. It's based on honest reporting of income and deductions. And for many people, it's a painful experience.
Many people already track their spending in order to itemize and deduct the sales taxes that they pay throughout the year. Most transactions now are electronic, so the money spent is already tracked and recorded. And think about it: If you've ever had to pay the IRS when you file your tax return, you know it's not a pleasant experience, but how often do you think about the amount of sales tax you pay per transaction? You probably rarely, if ever, give it much thought.
I don't think our current income tax system is going to last much longer. It's unwieldy, inefficient, and highly subjective to fraudulent reporting.
There's a massive amount of fraud in the current income tax system. It's based on honest reporting of income and deductions. And for many people, it's a painful experience.
Many people already track their spending in order to itemize and deduct the sales taxes that they pay throughout the year. Most transactions now are electronic, so the money spent is already tracked and recorded. And think about it: If you've ever had to pay the IRS when you file your tax return, you know it's not a pleasant experience, but how often do you think about the amount of sales tax you pay per transaction? You probably rarely, if ever, give it much thought.
I don't think our current income tax system is going to last much longer. It's unwieldy, inefficient, and highly subjective to fraudulent reporting.
I can see that but what I am saying is the issue is the tax rate from say 30K and above being taxed more than the existing rates.
Location: Live:Downtown Phoenix, AZ/Work:Greater Los Angeles, CA
27,606 posts, read 14,610,214 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by branDcalf
They are. All adults and doing fine.
Regardless, this is what I save for and what I want to do with those savings.
Honestly if I'm in that same position, I'm not leaving anyone in my family anything. I will pull a Carnegie and will whatever I leave behind to various charities
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