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Old 06-29-2018, 02:02 PM
 
Location: Washington, DC
4,320 posts, read 5,136,009 times
Reputation: 8277

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jimmyp25 View Post
Well, theres 9 states that dont have any restrictions on abortions. All mostly liberal states Alaska, Colorado, the District of Columbia, New Hampshire, New Jersey, New Mexico, Oregon, and Vermont......

I just dont understand.. You are worried about children at the border, but you support killing babies in the womb?
Then why are you rabid about disregarding a woman's rights, forcing her to have a child she may not be able to love and support but you are against living, breathing immigrant children who may go on to support many of our key industries few natural born Americans can or are willing to do?

Instead you are willing to send them home to countries (mostly El Salvador and Honduras these days) where they might be murdered for having family members too close to a drug cartel? BTW, those drug cartels exist because of American consumption and American law enforcement intervention.
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Old 06-29-2018, 02:04 PM
 
Location: My House
34,938 posts, read 36,245,191 times
Reputation: 26552
Quote:
Originally Posted by randomparent View Post
You cannot be serious with this question. I will repeat: the protocol for late-term abortion is medical termination prior to induction or evacuation. Sadly, I've been through it myself, which I've recounted in many other posts. I know how it works.
I haven't been through this, but I have been through the induction and delivery of a fetus in the 6th month of pregnancy that had died in utero. It's a very difficult thing to go through.

And, no... nobody stuck any scissors in anything. But, my life was not in danger at the time. I would imagine doctors do whatever they have to to remove a fetus when the mother is dying and can be saved if they remove it immediately.

I do have a close relative who had an abortion at 23 weeks, I believe it was. She was 14 at the time and the pregnancy was terminated before she was dilated and delivered the fetus.

The entire fetus. Whole.

Those abortion propaganda films really tick me off because people want to believe that other people are just cruel and doing this stuff legally.

No... they are not cutting up babies for sport... come on.

If it can be delivered and put up for adoption? Of course that is what happens.

Unless you are dealing with a criminal such as has been discussed here. And, the number of those just isn't even remotely a percentage that one needs to go and try to outlaw abortion to get rid of.

The simple truth is that criminals who want to cut viable fetuses into pieces for fun are EXACTLY the type who'd open up back-alley abortion centers if safe abortion ever became illegal.

So... how much do the pro-life crowd love their mothers, sisters, wives, daughters, nieces, and granddaughters?
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When in doubt, check it out: FAQ
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Old 06-29-2018, 02:19 PM
 
Location: The analog world
17,077 posts, read 13,359,835 times
Reputation: 22904
Quote:
Originally Posted by RedZin View Post
I haven't been through this, but I have been through the induction and delivery of a fetus in the 6th month of pregnancy that had died in utero. It's a very difficult thing to go through.

And, no... nobody stuck any scissors in anything. But, my life was not in danger at the time. I would imagine doctors do whatever they have to to remove a fetus when the mother is dying and can be saved if they remove it immediately.

I do have a close relative who had an abortion at 23 weeks, I believe it was. She was 14 at the time and the pregnancy was terminated before she was dilated and delivered the fetus.

The entire fetus. Whole.


Those abortion propaganda films really tick me off because people want to believe that other people are just cruel and doing this stuff legally.

No... they are not cutting up babies for sport... come on.

If it can be delivered and put up for adoption? Of course that is what happens.

Unless you are dealing with a criminal such as has been discussed here. And, the number of those just isn't even remotely a percentage that one needs to go and try to outlaw abortion to get rid of.

The simple truth is that criminals who want to cut viable fetuses into pieces for fun are EXACTLY the type who'd open up back-alley abortion centers if safe abortion ever became illegal.

So... how much do the pro-life crowd love their mothers, sisters, wives, daughters, nieces, and granddaughters?
Yes, I had the same procedure. It was a heart-wrenching experience because my husband and I desperately wanted a baby and had been through several rounds of fertility treatment to conceive. Tragically, my pregnancy was nonviable due to anencephaly. Her heart was stopped in utero, and I was induced. My husband and I had her remains blessed and cremated, and we held a memorial service with our immediate families and our pastor the following week. Eventually, she will be interred with me at my death. I have very conflicted feelings surrounding the issue of abortion, as you can imagine, and like a poster above, I find them hard to articulate. I do not fit neatly into any of the accepted camps, but I do support privacy of medical decisions and the option of abortion should a woman decide it's the best choice for her.
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Old 06-29-2018, 02:26 PM
 
Location: New Mexico
4,794 posts, read 2,798,355 times
Reputation: 4925
Default A matter of timing

Quote:
Originally Posted by HappyRider View Post
What's false? It's a beating heart. What difference does it make how old.
In the US, from a legal POV, the age of the fetus isn't the question. The question is: Is the fetus viable? That is, if the fetus were delivered right now, would it survive? If not, the fetus isn't viable, it never became a person. If yes, it's a child, & the courts recognize him or her as a person, in the legal sense of the word.
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Old 06-29-2018, 02:31 PM
 
17,301 posts, read 12,236,388 times
Reputation: 17241
Why did conservatives vote in someone who supports partial birth abortions?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tsOlXidHXRE
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Old 06-29-2018, 02:37 PM
 
Location: The analog world
17,077 posts, read 13,359,835 times
Reputation: 22904
Donald Trump: "I am pro-choice in every respect..." until of course it is politically expedient to be otherwise.
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Old 06-29-2018, 02:45 PM
 
Location: New Mexico
4,794 posts, read 2,798,355 times
Reputation: 4925
Default Details

Quote:
Originally Posted by itshim View Post
Democrats overwhelmingly supported Partial/Late term abortions until Republicans passed the Partial-Abortion Ban Act in 2003

If it were up to Dems, it would have been legal to have partial/late abortions in the 3rd Trimester.

They voted right down the party line when Rick Santorum introduced the bill.

https://www.congress.gov/bill/108th-.../senate-bill/3


Republicans are the reason why there are no longer late term abortions in America.
No. See https://reason.com/blog/2016/10/21/l...n-america-2016

"Partial-birth abortion" is illegal in the U.S. Politicians who bring up "partial birth abortion" do so because they know it can spur strong and visceral reactions of disgust and moral indignation, not because it's especially relevant to U.S. health care, morals, or laws circa 2016. For 13 years, since 2003, federal law has prohibited physicians from performing D&X procedures, aka partial birth abortions, at any point in a pregnancy. Almost a decade ago, in 2007, the Supreme Court upheld the ban as constitutional. In addition, 19 states have their own laws against these sorts of abortions. While the federal ban does include an exception for situations where the mother's life is endangered, abortion doctors claim they avoid the procedure anyway, as there are other options with less liklihood of legal repercussions. Even before the federal ban, D&X procedures accounted for just 0.2 percent of all abortions, and most of these were performed before the point where a fetus can feel pain or survive on its own outside of the womb.

"Late-term abortion is illegal in most of the U.S. A typical human pregnancy lasts 38 weeks after an egg is fertilized. Only seven states and the District of Columbia allow abortion at any point during a pregnancy, according to reproductive-research org the Guttmacher Institute. In the other 43 states, abortion is banned—with limited exceptions, such as for the safety of the mother—after the second trimester, after the point of fetal viability (when a fetus could live on its own outside the womb), or after a specified number of weeks (generally 20-24). When exceptions are required, many states require two physicians to sign-off on the procedure before it's permissable.

"Very few U.S. women abort after 20 weeks pregnancy. Even with late-term abortion allowed in some parts of the country and under certain circumstances, nearly all abortions performed in the U.S. happen before the end of the second trimester. According to U.S. Centers for Disease Control and Prevention data from 2012, 65.8 percent of abortions took place within the first eight weeks of pregnancy, and 91.4 percent occurred within the first 13 weeks. Just 7.2 percent of abortions were performed between 14 and 20 weeks gestation, which means just 1.3 percent of abortions took place at or after 21 weeks pregnancy. And, from 2003 through 2012, the CDC saw a significant shift toward earlier abortions, with the percentage occuring within the first six weeks up 24 percent during the study period. The percentage of abortions occurring at or after 13 weeks, meanwhile, remained relatively consistently throughout the study period and never rose above 9 percent.

"Late-term abortions are generally a last resort. While abortion opponents push the idea that women get late-term abortions because they change their minds last minute, or just can't be bothered to do it sooner—that they use late-term abortion "as birth control"—getting a surgical abortion is a serious, invasive, and expensive procedure, especially the later in pregnancy it takes place. Pregnancy itself is also quite difficult on women's bodies, and disruptive to their day-to-day lives. To believe there are women routinely putting their bodies through months of unwanted pregnancy, shelling out thousands of dollars, and undergoing serious surgery rather than use condoms or get an IUD or get an earlier abortion or whatever requires believing not just that most women are immoral or irresponsible but also, and simultaneously, wealthy, stupid, and masochistic. But abortion doctors, medical groups, and people who've gotten late-term abortions themselves all attest that these aren't decisions most women or medical professionals take lightly. Abortions procured in the third-trimester generally involve situations where the mother's life or health is in jeopardy, the fetus will die outside of the womb anyway, or the fetus is found to have a severe genetic abnormality that wasn't previously apparent."

(My emphasis - more @ the URL)

So no, late-term (third trimester) abortion was always rare, & will remain so. However, the medical conditions that cause third trimester abortion continue. The GOP has not eliminated an always-rare situation - TMK, the underlying medical causes of late-term abortion are beyond our medical reach. & so the possibility of late-term abortion will continue, as needed, lest we lose the woman's life as well as the fetus'.
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Old 06-29-2018, 03:00 PM
 
Location: Ca expat loving Idaho
5,267 posts, read 4,178,807 times
Reputation: 8139
Quote:
Originally Posted by RedZin View Post
It's beyond the first, but it's not to the point of viability outside the uterus.

Of course, you know that.
When a 17 week fetus is taken away from it's mother (see the correlation?) and killed it's the size of a fist, has eyes, toes, arms, a brain.

But guess you're to ignorant and uninformed to know that.
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Old 06-29-2018, 03:13 PM
 
Location: Ca expat loving Idaho
5,267 posts, read 4,178,807 times
Reputation: 8139
Quote:
Originally Posted by thefragile View Post
Far beyond? Really? Sure about that? You being a med assistant & all, I would think you would know better.
In fetus development it is far apart. And I am sure about that because of ya know being a med assist. The evil and ignorance on this post is astounding
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Old 06-29-2018, 03:37 PM
 
17,273 posts, read 9,553,730 times
Reputation: 16468
Quote:
Originally Posted by Finper View Post
In fetus development it is far apart. And I am sure about that because of ya know being a med assist. The evil and ignorance on this post is astounding
Lol, evil. Explain specifically what is evil about my post. Do you know what evil means?
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