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It’s amusing that some Christians seem to believe “marriage” is a Christian concept. It’s not. It predates Christianity and all religions. Christians can believe they have a lock on the definition, meaning, intent, interpretation of what marriage is meant to be, but that’s not remotely true. They have the right to enforce what they believe about marriage for ceremonies in their churches, but not when it comes to anything that happens outside those walls.
Of course the fight comes over the definition of "their church" . Should government take the Catholic position that a "church" is only their land/building over which certain rituals had been initiated over by a proper man compared to the evangelic position of the church being where any two or three believers gather.
So is adultery and also worth of death. But accusations of adultery didn't keep Trump or Clinton from being president. But in your belief do you think homosexuality is an even worse sin than straight adultery, and so a person married to the same sex should never be president?
Don't forget Joe Biden, who has a propensity for touching both adults and children in inappropriate ways.
Of course the fight comes over the definition of "their church" . Should government take the Catholic position that a "church" is only their land/building over which certain rituals had been initiated over by a proper man compared to the evangelic position of the church being where any two or three believers gather.
Unless the wedding venue has tax exempt status like a Church, they aren’t one. That’s how the Government defines their position.
So if that is who is the owner then hopefully whoever my friend was that had inadvertently booked with them would say “Up yours, I’ll never give a dime to you!”, tear up any contract, and skedaddle down the street to a different venue that aren’t lowlife bigots.
Listen, I’d way, way, way rather they say they have an issue with my skin, enough that they really don’t want to serve me, than them to be silently seething with resentment because they are forced to serve me food and/or drinks, therefore are entertaining the idea of spitting in, urinating in, or putting laxatives in something they serve me.
That aside, it has to be a service they don’t provide, not a person they refuse to serve. For equivalency in your scenario, it might be we don’t do Kwanza, MLK, or Juneteenth parties but we will happily rent a room to you, serve you meals, or allow you to host a birthday party. I do suppose they might be able to convince the courts that prohibition of mixed race marriages are a sincerely held belief of their religion if there are supportive, established texts, there is a formed group that has these tenants as established norms, and they can show a past pattern of sacrifices to preserve religious adherence. But, yeah, if it meets the definition of sincere belief, there is ease of redress, and it is a privately owned small business, so be it. And, if they do really feel that way, well, see the above paragraph.
I do think it needs to be clearly stated in any advertising that there are specific types of services they do not provide and whatever prohibitions they have ought to be clearly stated, with a spot for customer initialing, in all their contracts.
Fair enough. Slippery slopes are always so . . . slippery, but there is a logical structure to your view.
Well, that's a lot of questions. Let me start by saying I'm a devout Christian, the kind that loves others. The kind that says those who are without sin should cast the first stone.
I'm also the kind of Christian who knows Jesus Christ never said one word about gay people. That was old testament. The testament that said stuff about not working on the Sabbath, women not wearing the clothing of men, and not having leavened bread during Passover.
Additionally, I have a very close family member who is gay and I'm sick up to here with businesses discriminating against them and haters hating.
So. Yes. I think businesses who deal with the public should have to do business with every person who is pursuing a legal transaction, that they would happily provide for other customers, regardless of whether that business likes that customer personally or not.
As a devout Christian, do you always say Yes to those you love ? Of course not.
As a devout Christian, you must know Jesus spoke favorably in the New Testament of the Genesis verses concerning God creating man and woman and a man cleaving to his wife.
I'm not a religious person, but I know marriage has a [theoretically] special role in Christian teachings and many Christians use those passages to validate refusal to provide services to same sex marriages.
Unless the wedding venue has tax exempt status like a Church, they aren’t one. That’s how the Government defines their position.
The religious beliefs of a person does not stop when they leave the church building. You are confusing 'the church' with houses of worship, the worshipers with where they worship. It is the 'house of worship' that is tax exempt. The house of worship houses the church. The church is made up of individuals within who are free to live their biblically supported convictions in their daily life without government interference. To give the same meaning to 'houses of worship' and 'church' is a misnomer, albeit a common one.
The religious beliefs of a person does not stop when they leave the church building. You are confusing 'the church' with houses of worship, the worshipers with where they worship. It is the 'house of worship' that is tax exempt. The house of worship houses the church. The church is made up of individuals within who are free to live their biblically supported convictions in their daily life without government interference. To give the same meaning to 'houses of worship' and 'church' is a misnomer, albeit a common one.
Bingo. And, even then, tax exempt status is available to houses of worship if they meet certain requirements. Houses of worship do not have to apply for or be granted tax exempt status to enjoy the constitutional benefits afforded to religious institutions.
Sadly for many, Chistianity is just a convenient excuse to practice discriminatory bigotry.
I don't disagree with you.
However, Christians and religious people aren't the only ones who discriminate against others. Some forms of discrimination are more acceptable to some vs. others, and vice versa.
I don't try to impart my values on others, and don't want others trying to force theirs on me.
Sadly for many, Chistianity is just a convenient excuse to practice discriminatory bigotry.
"Discriminatory bigotry" is a subjective term that has no permanent home. It can be claimed anywhere "your" view conflicts with "mine".
ie: Even if I don't agree with same sex marriage, I won't tell a same sex couple they can't get married. Don't tell me I have to perform the ceremony.
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