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Old 04-30-2021, 01:27 PM
 
19,966 posts, read 7,881,487 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lilyflower3191981 View Post
They should win. It’s an easy, slam dunk case. According to our federal law, race cannot be a factor in making these decisions. If this is okay, rejection of loans by banks based upon skin color is okay.
It should be but I wouldn't be so sure though. Liberal judges have upheld unconstitutional laws that discriminate against whites before.
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Old 04-30-2021, 01:28 PM
 
Location: deafened by howls of 'racism!!!'
52,697 posts, read 34,579,481 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by midnight_thunder View Post
You have no understanding of Constitutional law. This is not a slam dunk case in the slightest. Also, the Constitution doesn't prohibit banks from discriminating against borrowers, that's from a separate law entirely.

I agree this is discriminatory. HOWEVER, policies that are discriminatory on the basis of race are not per se Unconstitutional. A policy that is discriminatory on the basis of race is subject to "strict scrutiny review". In layman's terms, this means, "the government needs a really really good reason to enact this policy". There are many elements, but, suffice to say, government spending programs often have raced-based policies that courts find to be Constitutional (the Federal government has plenty of minority set-aside programs that were in place even through the Trump administration). In fact, based upon a lot of the responses in this thread, I'm pretty confident this policy survives.
i'm not seeing a lot of wiggle room here:
Quote:
Federal laws prohibit discrimination based on a person's national origin, race, color, religion, disability, sex, and familial status. Laws prohibiting national origin discrimination make it illegal to discriminate because of a person's birthplace, ancestry, culture or language. This means people cannot be denied equal opportunity because they or their family are from another country, because they have a name or accent associated with a national origin group, because they participate in certain customs associated with a national origin group, or because they are married to or associate with people of a certain national origin.
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Old 04-30-2021, 01:33 PM
 
5,097 posts, read 2,316,736 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by midnight_thunder View Post
You have no understanding of Constitutional law. This is not a slam dunk case in the slightest. Also, the Constitution doesn't prohibit banks from discriminating against borrowers, that's from a separate law entirely.

I agree this is discriminatory. HOWEVER, policies that are discriminatory on the basis of race are not per se Unconstitutional. A policy that is discriminatory on the basis of race is subject to "strict scrutiny review". In layman's terms, this means, "the government needs a really really good reason to enact this policy". There are many elements, but, suffice to say, government spending programs often have raced-based policies that courts find to be Constitutional (the Federal government has plenty of minority set-aside programs that were in place even through the Trump administration). In fact, based upon a lot of the responses in this thread, I'm pretty confident this policy survives.
So what's the "really really good reason" to enact this policy? Anything that a judge makes up to justify this will be as much horse$h!t as the "benefits of diversity" argument to justify racial preferences in universities.
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Old 04-30-2021, 01:34 PM
 
962 posts, read 541,357 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by uggabugga View Post
i'm not seeing a lot of wiggle room here:
You're comparing apples and oranges.

What you need is a primer on Strict Scrutiny.
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Old 04-30-2021, 01:37 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by uggabugga View Post
i'm not seeing a lot of wiggle room here:
The strict scrutiny basis is the wiggle room the Court fabricated for the purposes to justify discriminating against whites. A conservative judge rightly wouldn't see a compelling reason to discriminate against whites, but an anti-white liberal judges would.
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Old 04-30-2021, 01:37 PM
 
962 posts, read 541,357 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fat lou View Post
So what's the "really really good reason" to enact this policy? Anything that a judge makes up to justify this will be as much horse$h!t as the "benefits of diversity" argument to justify racial preferences in universities.
I could go on for hours, and, yes, conservative judges and liberal judges often fall on different sides of a case, so with a 6-3 SCOTUS who knows, but you need to be able to prove certain things:

1) the group receiving the benefit was discriminated against in the past by the government (either directly or indirectly, lot of wiggle room there)
2) the policy is "narrowly tailored" (surely wiggle room there) to address the past discrimination
3) race neutral approaches have been tried and were unsuccessful

Look, one person can see a constitutional policy and another might disagree. That's what lawyers do. But to say this policy is Unconstitutional or illegal is just plain incorrect.
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Old 04-30-2021, 01:39 PM
 
5,097 posts, read 2,316,736 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by midnight_thunder View Post
I could go on for hours, and, yes, conservative judges and liberal judges often fall on different sides of a case, so with a 6-3 SCOTUS who knows, but you need to be able to prove certain things:

1) the group receiving the benefit was discriminated against in the past by the government (either directly or indirectly, lot of wiggle room there)
2) the policy is "narrowly tailored" (surely wiggle room there) to address the past discrimination
3) race neutral approaches have been tried and were unsuccessful

Look, one person can see a constitutional policy and another might disagree. That's what lawyers do. But to say this policy is Unconstitutional or illegal is just plain incorrect.
No, it is unconstitutional, but left-wing judges will make something up to claim that it isn't. Just as they made up the benefits of diversity in education in racial preference cases.
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Old 04-30-2021, 01:40 PM
 
29,939 posts, read 39,477,016 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tall Traveler View Post
This is an important precedent to see if the Left's justification of racial spoils is going to get past the Supreme Court. I agree that there was racism in the past against blacks but hard to now go back and try to racially discriminate to adjust perceived past wrongs.
That’s the long and short of it. Federal laws cannot discriminate based on national origin, race, color, religion, disability, sex, and familial status.

What is the left’s answer to that? Pack the court and/or change “White” to “white.”

Quote:
Real opportunities in the lives of more Americans – Black, white, Latino, Asian American, Native American.
~Joe “Bernie Lomax” Biden~
https://www.whitehouse.gov/briefing-...n-of-congress/

Quote:
6. I use "Black" and "African American" interchangeably throughout this article. I use “Black" because "Blacks, like Asians, Latinos, and other 'minorities,' constitute a specific group and, as such, require denotation as a proper noun." Crenshaw, supra note 3, (citing Catharine MacKinnon, Feminism, Marxism, Method, and the State: An Agenda of SIGNS 515, 516 (1982)). By the same token, I do not capitalize "white," which is not a proper noun since whites do not constitute a specific cultural group. For the same reason I don’t capitalize "women of color."
https://edspace.american.edu/cultura...he-Margins.pdf

Bam, now white is not a protected class and can be legally discriminated against. At least I believe that’s where they’re going with that. I could certainly be wrong, but not about packing the court though. They know they’ll never pass “proper” discrimination laws with 6 center to center right judges on a 9 judge SC.
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Old 04-30-2021, 01:43 PM
 
Location: deafened by howls of 'racism!!!'
52,697 posts, read 34,579,481 times
Reputation: 29290
Quote:
Originally Posted by midnight_thunder View Post
You're comparing apples and oranges.

What you need is a primer on Strict Scrutiny.
okay. what is the 'compelling state interest' in discriminating against white farmers?
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Old 04-30-2021, 01:47 PM
 
962 posts, read 541,357 times
Reputation: 1043
Quote:
Originally Posted by fat lou View Post
No, it is unconstitutional, but left-wing judges will make something up to claim that it isn't. Just as they made up the benefits of diversity in education in racial preference cases.
I mean the conservative SCOTUS keeps upholding affirmative action policies so I'm not sure you're right.
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