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What do the anti-vax, anti-maskers of the world not understand about covid. It will NOT go away by covid deniers infecting and potentially murdering millions more people by not getting with the program. Each time you catch this, perhaps it will destroy your lungs or other organs. The RNA vaccines provide a different level of antibody resistance from the infection.
Maybe instead of allowing the deniers to infect disease and misery upon the world, maybe it is time to consider such people a worldwide deadly threat to humanity and the laws of self defense should apply. Does it matter if someone tries to murder you with a hammer, a gun or a bio weapon? It's still murder... no, actually it is genocide to allow this to continue.
At what point will governments say, "we've had enough" and start putting the infected into camps, where they can be "concentrated," inoculated, and reeducated prior to release back into society, if ever. The despotic President of the Philippines seems on board with this. I'm pretty sure North Korea is already solving their problem with a bullet. Just offering an alternative solution.
Vaccinated are infecting others and are a host for mutations. I guess they had better increase capacity for those camps you like. You’re going too so get packing.
There is no certainty about the durability of immunity acquired from a prior infection, especially to variants.
There are indications those previously infected are more vulnerable to the delta variant.
Intentionally infecting masses of humanity is unsound.
About natural immunity, aka durability of immunity from a prior infection:
QUOTE:
“It appears that natural immunity is better against the Delta variant. When you get infected with COVID, your body’s immune system develops antibodies to the entire surface of the virus,” Makary said. “Not just the slight protein that the vaccines gives you, but the entire surface. And so you get a more diverse antibody portfolio in your system.”
Makary said data from Israel revealed that natural immunity appears to be 6.7x more effective than being vaccinated when it comes to fighting off COVID-19.
I understand. I wasn't directing my comment at you, but just as a general comment. I read (most) of the UK report, so I understand what you are saying.
But I disagree, look at the news, populations are "revolting" all over. The isolation and financial impact is driving people crazy, worldwide. The anti-vax/mask movement seems to affect the supposedly more educated populations in greater porportion.
I DO agree however that we could be on track toward an extreme variant, even so far as a near extinction event. I know we have upgraded our "bug out" location in the event we have to abandon our home in town for an extended period. We can ride out nearly anything there. But at some point you have to ask, "why bother?"
We COULD stop this with a draconian isolation response, ZERO movement beyond one's home / town with limited exceptions. TOTAL lock down. The military tossing MRE's onto your driveway. ALL commerce and travel stopped. ZERO contact outside your family group.
We've had nearly two years to figure this out. The world has a bunch of ignorant dum basses for "leaders." And millions are already dying as a result.
I agree with all that you said. Only thing I have issue with is perhaps not wanting to let the virus rip because its almost like rewarding the anti vaxxers.
I am in a pretty isolated town. And working on another stealth van I can take ever farther away if I need to get even farther away. At this point I consider anything is possible.
About natural immunity, aka durability of immunity from a prior infection:
QUOTE:
“It appears that natural immunity is better against the Delta variant. When you get infected with COVID, your body’s immune system develops antibodies to the entire surface of the virus,” Makary said. “Not just the slight protein that the vaccines gives you, but the entire surface. And so you get a more diverse antibody portfolio in your system.”
Makary said data from Israel revealed that natural immunity appears to be 6.7x more effective than being vaccinated when it comes to fighting off COVID-19.
I have heard experts who disagree as to whether or not natural immunity is better for Delta. I say any immunity is better than none at all and the faster we can get everyone to have some sort of immunity it will slow the virus down, how much who knows. The slower it replicates the less likely more variants.
We are at 15% vaccinated in the world. More sure that have acquired natural immunity. But not nearly enough to stop the next variant from occurring. At this rare we will be jabbing and masking and hiding from it for who knows 5 or 10 years more as some say? Enough is enough I say.
So should the UN with some money from different countries pay people in poorer countries to host giant super spreader events? $50 or $100 a person. We infect billions in a very short time and with a little luck slow the virus down enough where we can get ahead of the mutations. Yes people will die. But they probably will at some point from the virus anyways. And even more of some more deadly variant occurs that is say 30% fatal like some past viruses. That is something we want to avoid at all costs.
So should the world let it rip? I am thinking Africa, India, South America and anywhere else that is 3rd world with lower vaccination rates.
With 7.8 billion people on the planet, about 6.6 billion currently unvaccinated, with a death rate of approximately 1.8%, you seem to be willing to let about 119 million people die. Maybe more, because if entire countries get infected simultaneously the death rate may be higher because of lack of medical care.
That body count instantly catapults you to the head of the line, ahead of any genocidal general/president/prime minister/fuhrer.
With 7.8 billion people on the planet, about 6.6 billion currently unvaccinated, with a death rate of approximately 1.8%, you seem to be willing to let about 119 million people die. Maybe more, because if entire countries get infected simultaneously the death rate may be higher because of lack of medical care.
That body count instantly catapults you to the head of the line, ahead of any genocidal general/president/prime minister/fuhrer.
Look you would need most of the world leaders to sign off on it. That is not going to happen. Just throwing it out there as a possible extreme move and it would probably only happen if say a very deadly variant was out but not dominant. It was killing 10-35% of those infected but the vaccine and natural immunity stops it. You could not do anything and let it kill 1 or 2 billion people or super-spread everyone and kill 100 million or more. Two really bad options.
And the UK SAGE report states that normally a virus like covid-19 should have a 10-35% fatality rate and could mutate into a more deadly form. So who knows.
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(set 11 days ago)
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Do you think these poorer countries would go for this? Sacrificing their people so the haves in the world would live longer lives?
Geez. We're not more valuable than they are. There's no reason to treat poorer people like virus fodder.
I do think what MIGHT be a good idea, is let everyone gather in huge crowds all they want. Let them catch the virus, and die if they want. Anyone who wants to, in the world. And let the pieces fall where they may.
Do you think these poorer countries would go for this? Sacrificing their people so the haves in the world would live longer lives?
Geez. We're not more valuable than they are. There's no reason to treat poorer people like virus fodder.
I do think what MIGHT be a good idea, is let everyone gather in huge crowds all they want. Let them catch the virus, and die if they want. Anyone who wants to, in the world. And let the pieces fall where they may.
We have already been doing this throughout the pandemic. Look where the vaccines went first. The wealthy countries got the good ones and the poor countries got nothing or the chinese or russian ones. I don't recall any bleeding hearts saying give them to the poor people first, I can wait.
Status:
"I don't understand. But I don't care, so it works out."
(set 11 days ago)
35,637 posts, read 17,994,810 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Oklazona Bound
We have already been doing this throughout the pandemic. Look where the vaccines went first. The wealthy countries got the good ones and the poor countries got nothing or the chinese or russian ones. I don't recall any bleeding hearts saying give them to the poor people first, I can wait.
That is life. Lets stop pretending its not.
That's different from paying people to gather in groups and contract the virus, sacrificing their health for what we would spend on a night out at a restaurant.
Yes. People and countries who can pay for stuff get it first.
But to pay someone a pittance to surrender themselves to a potentially deadly virus is as horrible as the underground practice of buying vital organs for a modest price (or grabbing people off the street and stealing their vital organs, which does happen).
That's different from paying people to gather in groups and contract the virus, sacrificing their health for what we would spend on a night out at a restaurant.
Yes. People and countries who can pay for stuff get it first.
But to pay someone a pittance to surrender themselves to a potentially deadly virus is as horrible as the underground practice of buying vital organs for a modest price (or grabbing people off the street and stealing their vital organs, which does happen).
Soulless behavior.
Higher risk people stay home. Younger healthy people who have a very low chance of dying from it take part. I am not saying drag grandma out of the house and get her infected. There should not be that many dead people if only lower risk people do it. Other alternative is our current half baked response and a much deadlier variant in which all bets are off.
And yes we are selfish. I don't recall any sort of effort by anyone to donate their vaccine to poor people in other countries. Most people were only thinking about when they could get it and were upset if they did not qualify yet. Lets embrace being selfish instead of pretending we are not. Sure we are willing to help others but only after we have been taken care of.
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