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Originally Posted by Redshadowz....
Why don't we arm the Ukrainians so they can take Moscow as well?
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Originally Posted by Hesychios
Why?
Hyperbole continues to be the default position of those with little information to share. The "6000 nukes" position along with the "billions dead", "trillions of dollars", "Nazi", and "last Ukrainian" is the stuff of movies, not reality.
I think Ukraine has been active in Russia, but no more than what would be expected.
The "6000 nukes" position along with the "billions dead"
How many would die?
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Originally Posted by Listener2307
"Nazi", and "last Ukrainian" is the stuff of movies, not reality.
You do realize that prior to the war, every news agency complained about the "Nazis" in Ukraine. Just go to youtube and type "Ukraine Nazis". The Nazis didn't run the government, but the government liked them because they were highly motivated soldiers willing to die to kill Russians(they even funded their little far-right camps).
As for the "last Ukrainian", that is what Lindsey Graham said. Regardless, it doesn't take a genius to realize America is just using Ukraine, and doesn't care how many Ukrainians die as long as Russia loses. Why would we possibly care whether Ukraine fights to the last Ukrainian any more than if Syrians, Libyans, Afghanis, or Iraqis fight to the last man? The more Ukrainians, Syrians, Libyans, Afghanis, and Iraqis die the better for us.
America only cares about itself. Just like every other country.
So, you're willing to fight to the last Ukrainian, eh? If Pootin follows through on his threat to start dropping nukes into Ukraine, you still don't want to find a way to de-escalate leading to possibly all our nuclear war destroying civilization.
What is foolish is to keep pushing Pootin's buttons to escalate. You can't intimidate a country with 6,000 nukes into submission.
The armchair generals on this forum are telling us that they are not functional..
Whose estimates? Kiev? How would they even know? You realize Ukraine is a bunch of liars, right? Some Ukrainian officials even claim 87,000 civilians died in Mariupol.
Especially when you look at the number of Civilian deaths in the Iraq War. Which is officially about 100k, some claim as high 600k just from violence, and the total "excess deaths" was a million(caused by displacement, lack of clean water, food insecurity, etc).
Afghanistan has been in a near-famine since the war ended, and the United States is doing everything we can to punish the Taliban by making the Afghan people suffer.
Solovyev is not afraid of calling the special operation a war with NATO, points at 'conceptual' mistakes in military planning. The kind of language that would be unimaginable just a year ago.
You do realize a third of Ukraine is Russian-speaking and pretty much everyone in Eastern Ukraine hates the coup government in Kiev. From the perspective of Russia, this is a war of liberation, not conquest.
The main problem with Kherson is that it is west of the Dnieper River, and Ukraine blew up the bridges with American Himars. Russia could simply abandon everything west of the Dnieper, blow up all the bridges from Kiev to the Black Sea, then split Ukraine in half.
But one of the most important objectives for Russia is securing water to Crimea. Ukraine claims Russia intends to blow up the Kherson dam. Which is actually the Nova Kakhovka dam, northeast of Kherson City.
I can say with 100% certainty that if Russia pulls back across the Dnieper, the dam will be blown up, by Ukraine. That dam is what allows water to flow into the canal that brings water to Crimea. In fact, pretty much all of the farmland in the Kherson Oblast, south of the Dnieper, depends on irrigation channels from the Dnieper River.
Everything south of the Dnieper would turn into a wasteland. The water problem Russia aimed to solve would become twice as bad. Ukraine already blew up one dam at the start of the war, and they're already preparing us psychologically to blame it on Russia.
In Putin's deluded mind they hate Kiev. But that is only his delusion. There are some areas in the 2014 occupied places where they are more sympathetic to Russia, but that has declined with time and them turning the Donbass over to corrupt warlords.
In any event, that is Ukraine's decision, not Russia's.
here's what a poster on quora thinks is the likely scenario for this war..
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Option 1. Russia grinds Ukraine down and eventually takes over the entire country. Now, Russia has 40 million very unhappy, very hostile people inside it’s borders who have guns and trained to fight. Not a good outcome for the Russian people.
Option 2. Ukraine grinds down Russia and Russia eventually pulls out entirely. Russia has now depleted most of its army of resources and must re-arm, but do so under sanctions. Putin will probably have to purge the army to maintain his own grip on power and probably crack down on protestors. Not a good outcome for the Russia people.
Option 3. A stalemate occurs and Russia maintains its hold on eastern Ukraine and Crimea. Sanctions remain in place, there is growing social instability in Russia, and Russia faces the prospect of long-term military action in the area. Not a good outcome for the Russian people.
The only good option is for Russia to simply withdraw, say “My bad!” and beg the West to go back to the way things were before the war. Not likely.
In a nutshell, there are no good options and no good outcomes. It’s a mess and will continue to b ea mess for … decades.
You do realize a third of Ukraine is Russian-speaking and pretty much everyone in Eastern Ukraine hates the coup government in Kiev.
So? If they speak Russian, and hate their government, an easy solution is to leave Ukraine, the place that you say they hate, and move to Russia. Im not understanding the problem.
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