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Old 08-16-2022, 07:53 AM
 
Location: Sector 001
15,946 posts, read 12,293,021 times
Reputation: 16109

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Quote:
Originally Posted by InformedConsent View Post
Little hope? Or little effort? Poor money management results in a poor lifestyle. Even 70% of rich families lose their wealth by the 2nd generation, and 90% by the 3rd.
There's a reason the ruling class and wealthy often are multigenerational families that go back hundreds of years. To a degree, I give them credit for their ability to accomplish this. Too often the kids will blow all the money the instant they get any inheritance... there are two types of people.. producers and consumers. Produce more than you consume, and you will accumulate wealth.

To grow one's net worth takes self discipline. Almost everyone I work with simply blows every cent they have on experiences the instant they get any money in the bank. They have no right to complain they are living paycheck to paycheck when they blew $237 on a bar tab last weekend, and the weekend before.

Most "poor" in america do okay, though that will change if we don't start building more real estate to ease the demand for it. The black hole of trillions of wasted QE dollars used on pork programs could be used to build affordable housing, though if we did that the left would just let in more illegals and fill the housing up with criminals and parasites, so maybe not.

Last edited by sholomar; 08-16-2022 at 08:03 AM..
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Old 08-16-2022, 07:58 AM
 
26,694 posts, read 14,572,795 times
Reputation: 8094
Quote:
Originally Posted by sholomar View Post
There's a reason the current ruling class often are multigenerational families that go back hundreds of years. To a degree, I give them credit for their ability to accomplish this.

To grow one's net worth takes self discipline. Almost everyone I work with simply blows every cent they have on experiences the instant they get any money in the bank. They have no right to complain they are living paycheck to paycheck when they blew $237 on a bar tab last weekend, and the weekend before.

Most "poor" in america do okay, though that will change if we don't start building more real estate to ease the demand for it. The black hole of trillions of wasted QE dollars used on pork programs could be used to build affordable housing, though if we did that the left would just let in more illegals and fill the housing up with criminals and parasites, so maybe not.
Could you please name the current ruling class?
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Old 08-16-2022, 08:26 AM
 
Location: Southeast US
8,609 posts, read 2,310,456 times
Reputation: 2114
Quote:
Originally Posted by AfricanSunset View Post
Trickle down economics is a scam. When the government decides to redistribute wealth, it says it will give it to the richest Americans first (instead of the poorest or middle class) mainly in the form of tax cuts, loans, what name you, and then this money will trickle down to the middle class and poor.

Of course some trickles down! But just a trickle. Meanwhile the debt increases, infrastructure crumbles (as someone who flies 100,000 miles + a year around the world, I really notice the sorry state of American airports) and the middle class continues to flounder in the USA. Middle class standards are declining.

I see you guys complaining about inflation, most of you need to work to maintain your SOL, some of you are just 1-2 wages away from going into debt. It’s called wage slavery.

It’s not like there isn’t rich people in other countries you know!
"When the government decides to redistribute wealth" ...

Right there is your main issue, and the other issue is those who believe the government can or should do so.

The "government" has no "wealth" beyond the value of Federal lands and Federal buildings, and any military equipment it could sell off. And even all of the military equipment we have wouldn't sell for $2T.

The government doesn't give me any money, and thus it doesn't give me any wealth. It provides me no basic asset that through my efforts can become more valuable or be used to create something of value that can be sold for more than the cost of inputs.

If the government did own and control every dollar, and gave every single American $12,000* - real "wealth redistribution", a real UBI - but then charged people who didn't produce $12K of GDP - which would be the low-skilled labor input, then we could talk about fairness.

But a person who doesn't pay income taxes but gets direct payments, or any person whose direct payments exceed their income taxes ... that IS income/wealth redistribution. That is what taxation is - income redistribution.

*the Federal budget should be $4T to be balanced. Give them $16B to hire people to process the checks out. You have $12,000 for every single American. And the bottom half would run over each other for a $12K/per check.
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Old 08-16-2022, 08:34 AM
 
Location: Texas
37,949 posts, read 17,875,145 times
Reputation: 10371
Quote:
Originally Posted by workingclasshero View Post
uhm...

our poor have free healthcare (medicaid)..can get section 8

and the difference between France and the USA in longevity is a whopping 18 months


and they are healthier due to LIFESTYLE... less junk food, they actually walk to the market
"Our lower life expectancy is not attributable to poor U.S. health care. It stems from the higher U.S. rate of homicides and the death rate from transportation accidents.

The Business of Health,” Robert Ohsfeldt and John Schneider explain that the U.S. homicide rate of 7.3 per 100,000 population is eight times the rate in France. The U.S. death rate from transportation accidents is also higher than in other countries. When life expectancy data are adjusted for differences in homicide and transportation death rates, U.S. life expectancy is slightly higher than for all other countries."


https://southcarolina1670.wordpress....d-health-care/


other factors
Opioid overdoses are death overall is low, it is the cause of death of 1.6% of Americans) but these deaths affect life expectancy because many victims are relatively young.
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Old 08-16-2022, 08:36 AM
 
Location: Southeast US
8,609 posts, read 2,310,456 times
Reputation: 2114
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lycanmaster View Post
That in itself is a major problem.

A lot of these pension funds, annuities and other retirement accounts used to be able to rely on traditional savings accounts/CDs when we had "normal" or high interest rates.

With the Federal Reserve and Central Banks the world over keeping interest rates low or even negative for decades, they have nearly forced most of these funds and people in general to invest into the much riskier stock market in order to get any kind of returns on money/ROI.
another with a fundamental misunderstanding of how "investing" works.

On a CD or savings account (for 95% of consumers) your principal is 100% guaranteed, as is the stated interest rate. There is as close to 0 risk as you can get. The "savings rate" is only supposed to pay you enough so that a) you're about the rate of inflation or b) so the financial institution can lend your money out at a margin above your rate that they can pay the bills and make enough profit to ensure they "keep the lights on".

Feel free to see how CD rates generally track along with the inflation rate:

https://www.bankrate.com/banking/cds...nterest-rates/ (sorry, you have to scroll past ads)

https://fred.stlouisfed.org/series/FPCPITOTLZGUSA
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Old 08-16-2022, 08:37 AM
 
Location: East Coast of the United States
27,575 posts, read 28,680,428 times
Reputation: 25170
Quote:
Originally Posted by lifeexplorer View Post
Could you please name the current ruling class?
I think the name that pops up in people’s minds is Rockefeller.

But I doubt that young people nowadays even know who they are.
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Old 08-16-2022, 08:42 AM
 
Location: Retired in VT; previously MD & NJ
14,267 posts, read 6,960,270 times
Reputation: 17878
Quote:
Originally Posted by lifeexplorer View Post
Could you please name the current ruling class?
Lol.
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Old 08-16-2022, 08:45 AM
 
26,694 posts, read 14,572,795 times
Reputation: 8094
Quote:
Originally Posted by BigCityDreamer View Post
I think the name that pops up in people’s minds is Rockefeller.

But I doubt that young people nowadays even know who they are.
How is Rockefeller a ruling class? Does that family control more votes?
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Old 08-16-2022, 08:46 AM
 
Location: Arizona
6,105 posts, read 2,728,554 times
Reputation: 5884
The only ones who it gets trickled down to are millionaires and billionaires.
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Old 08-16-2022, 08:50 AM
 
Location: Southeast US
8,609 posts, read 2,310,456 times
Reputation: 2114
Quote:
Originally Posted by AfricanSunset View Post
Governments deciding to give the wealthy money back from shared taxes paid, is of course redistribution of wealth. The wealthy make most of their money (generally speaking) through dividend payments from corporations or stocks they own. This is taxed at a much lower rate than regular salaried income. Then there are all kinds of write-offs that effectively you need to be wealthy to be able to take advantage of. Government loans etc.
well, finally - finally! - we're getting somewhere. So what you would propose is changing certain capital gains so they're treated as ordinary income. And presumably, you'd make some threshold on it where say the first $100K annually or so was exempt - so the lower/middle class retired folks aren't paying taxes on their meager dividends or sale of portfolio to generate cash to live.

Is this correct?

And maybe you'd also end any loophole/deduction/favorable tax treatment that is only available to large investors?

See, these things are worth discussing. "Wealth redistribution" like some Sanders/Warren wealth tax on unrealized gains just shows their idiocy or sinister ideas.

Quote:
Instead the government could invest this in infrastructure, which would also create jobs FYI. Or national healthcare, or something like this that improves the lives of the majority of Americans. Or they could lower the burden the middle class pay in taxes.
The majority of Americans have healthcare they are happy with. The quality of the care they receive does not need improvement. Last I saw, the uninsured was down to ~10%.

The government could also determine what the infrastructure need was, and generate usage taxes based upon that need.

What ALL liberals, including you, seem to misunderstand - they could generate $500B a year from additional taxes on "the rich", and we'd still be spending us into a bottomless pit. Other than about 1% of the deficits generated over the next 10 years, the Congress is spending 99% of ALL the taxes they expect to generate from the "Climate & Energy Bill".
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