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So how does that indicate that we can stop terrorism by not bothering them further. Our very existence bothers them and I believe that their hatred of our way of life goes beyond cold war politics.
You make a logical leap here that is not supported by facts.
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No, I think we should focus on those who attack us. If the Tamil Tigers carry out terrorist attacks on America then yes by all means we should deal with them.
Identify our "enemy". Can you do it?
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Perhaps, but it beats the alternative. If we hadn't fought WWII for example, then we would be living in a National Socialist state right now.
First of all, the threat during WWII was identifiable. Secondly, you have no proof that we would be a national socialist state if we had not entered WWII. That is your own self serving assumption.
Location: Midessa, Texas Home Yangzhou, Jiangsu temporarily
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Originally Posted by LeavingFlorida05
You make a logical leap here that is not supported by facts.
I am only going by their own stated position. They insist that they want to destroy America and Western civilization. I am sure that they will not be successful, but they dangerous none the less.
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Originally Posted by LeavingFlorida05
Identify our "enemy". Can you do it?
You are right, I cannot identify "our" enemy because you do not believe the enemy exist. My enemy is anyone who would attack my country and the ones who would give them material aid and comfort.
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Originally Posted by LeavingFlorida05
First of all, the threat during WWII was identifiable. Secondly, you have no proof that we would be a national socialist state if we had not entered WWII. That is your own self serving assumption.
You are right it is an assumption, but it is a good assumption. If no one had stood up to the Nazis then what would have been the outcome? Would they have just decided to stop invading other countries? If there was no price to pay for agression, would they have abandoned it?
I don't think they would have stopped until they were forced to. That is what we did, we forced them to stop and we'll do the same with radical Islam.
I am only going by their own stated position. They insist that they want to destroy America and Western civilization. I am sure that they will not be successful, but they dangerous none the less.
There are loons everywhere. Do we start wars to stop all of them? What about seperatist groups within this country?
The stance against Middle Eastern terrorists is hypocritical. A vast majority of Middle Easterners have nothing to do with any of this, but you gladly make them pay for it. And in the end, you make your enemies stronger because of your failed tactics.
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You are right, I cannot identify "our" enemy because you do not believe the enemy exist. My enemy is anyone who would attack my country and the ones who would give them material aid and confort.
That's so ambiguous. That could mean anyone. With that statement, you basically say the world is your enemy. Nice...
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You are right it is an assumption, but it is a good assumption. If no one had stood up to the Nazis then what would have been the outcome? Would they have just decided to stop invading other countries? If there was no price to pay for agression, would they have abandoned it?
Yes, let's forget what the Russians and Chinese did. The US did everything themselves!
Regardless, I'm not saying we shouldn't have gotten involved. I just believe you are exaggerating the circumstances, trying to make some sort of connection to current events that doesn't exist. There is no Hitler. There is no Hirohito. There is no Mussolini. You believe there is, because you've been told there.
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I don't think they would have stopped until they were forced to. That is what we did, we forced them to stop and we'll do the same with radical Islam.
Of course you think that. That's what you've been told your entire life.
Location: Midessa, Texas Home Yangzhou, Jiangsu temporarily
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LeavingFlorida05
There are loons everywhere. Do we start wars to stop all of them? What about seperatist groups within this country?
The stance against Middle Eastern terrorists is hypocritical. A vast majority of Middle Easterners have nothing to do with any of this, but you gladly make them pay for it. And in the end, you make your enemies stronger because of your failed tactics.
Only the ones involved in terrorism and its support structure.
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Originally Posted by LeavingFlorida05
That's so ambiguous. That could mean anyone. With that statement, you basically say the world is your enemy. Nice...
That right, it COULD mean anyone, such is the world we live in. But it currently doesn't mean anyone, it basically refers to Al Qaeda and their sympathizers right now.
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Originally Posted by LeavingFlorida05
Yes, let's forget what the Russians and Chinese did. The US did everything themselves!
No let us not forget. The Russians and Chinese are also having problems with Islamic terrorist right now. The best thing for us to do is support them in this fight.
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Originally Posted by LeavingFlorida05
Regardless, I'm not saying we shouldn't have gotten involved. I just believe you are exaggerating the circumstances, trying to make some sort of connection to current events that doesn't exist. There is no Hitler. There is no Hirohito. There is no Mussolini. You believe there is, because you've been told there.
Do mean to say that there was no Hitler, Mussolini, or Hirohito? I would disagree. Or do just mean that Bin Ladin is no Hitler? Either way, Bin Ladin is a real threat, he has already murdered 3000 Americans in New York City. What more do you need to consider him a threat?
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Originally Posted by LeavingFlorida05
Of course you think that. That's what you've been told your entire life.
So I am just brainwashed then? Ok, I can explore that possibility. Please explain to me the situation as you see it ( the truth ) and please be as specific as possible so that I can compare it to observable reality. Assume that I am an alien and know nothing about the situation and give me as much detail as possible.
Only the ones involved in terrorism and its support structure.
And how do you determine this? There are well over 1 billion Muslims on this planet. Are we going to question each one? Or are we just going to drop bombs on them and hope they go away? To this point, it seems like we've chosen the latter.
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That right, it COULD mean anyone, such is the world we live in. But it currently doesn't mean anyone, it basically refers to Al Qaeda and their sympathizers right now.
What about Hezbollah and Hamas? What about Jaish-e-Mohammed or Jemaah Islamiya?
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No let us not forget. The Russians and Chinese are also having problems with Islamic terrorist right now. The best thing for us to do is support them in this fight.
Hahaha, the Russians have problem because they've done the same thing the US has done. In fact, they're currently engaged in genocide against the Chechens.
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Do mean to say that there was no Hitler, Mussolini, or Hirohito? I would disagree. Or do just mean that Bin Ladin is no Hitler? Either way, Bin Ladin is a real threat, he has already murdered 3000 Americans in New York City. What more do you need to consider him a threat?
Yes, I mean that bin Laden is no Hitler. If he's so dangerous, why haven't we captured (or killed) him? Hmmm.
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So I am just brainwashed then? Ok, I can explore that possibility. Please explain to me the situation as you see it ( the truth ) and please be as specific as possible so that I can compare it to observable reality. Assume that I am an alien and know nothing about the situation and give me as much detail as possible.
This will require me to write a pretty long post. I can't do that right now. I'll do it later.
Location: Midessa, Texas Home Yangzhou, Jiangsu temporarily
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LeavingFlorida05
Yes, I mean that bin Laden is no Hitler. If he's so dangerous, why haven't we captured (or killed) him? Hmmm.
Ok, just for fun I will take a page from your playbook.
You have fallen for the propaganda. Clearly there was no Hitler or at least not as the propaganda would have you believe. Hitler was actually a Jewish artist and comedian but he was set up by the CIA and KGB so that the U.S. and the U.S.S.R. could divide Germany between themselves. The "Nazis" were just normal Germans defending their country against this evil plan. If we would have just left Germany alone there would have been no war at. We could have drank beer with Germans and laughed at Hitler's jokes.
I can't believe you fell for the propaganda, you are a cannibal and a hater of baby animals.
Wow, that felt really good. I may defect to your side.
I don't think much will change. We're going to continue down this path we're currently on. We're progressively becoming more totalitarian. Corporate control is our future, unless we do something to stop it. Unfortunately, people are too busy watching American Idol to be bothered with politics.
Hell just froze over! I actually agree on something with LeavingFlorida!!!
Yes, corporations will dictate how America will be. As he points out, Americans are just too naive and too disconnected to realize what is going on.
Let's look at some instances where corporations dictate what happens in American politics:
- Illegal alien amnesty. The corporations and the corporations alone are THE ONLY part benefiting to an amnesty. The government will be overwhelmed by illegal alien care and costs; the people's wages will be severely depressed, as the surplus of people will continue to lower US wages.
- Open borders. This is a no-brainer. Terrorists can cross over undetected with no problems at all. Hezbollah agents have already done so and some got caught and were prosecuted later for rasing funds to a terror organization. And yet DC doesn't do anything about it because the corporations demand cheap labor, so they need the border open for anyone and everyone to come across.
-Free-Trade agreements that ONLY benefit foreign countries. OK, we all know that trade is very good. But when we have monsters like China pumping out stuff 100x faster than we can, for a 10th of the price, then it is clear trhat the US will be in a trade deficit with China. So why make such bad agreements?? Because the large corporate conglomerates want it, that is why!
All in all... a very bad situation. I think the future is very gloomy.... it is almost like we are back in the pre-1930's when Corporations literally owned the US congress (specially the railroad companies and Pan-Am). Americans broke free from corporate rule and now we are going back to the days when corporations openly own DC. Just see the Democrats in 2006... massive donations that used to go to Republicans. Both parties are in corporate hands now.
Hell just froze over! I actually agree on something with LeavingFlorida!!!
Yes, corporations will dictate how America will be. As he points out, Americans are just too naive and too disconnected to realize what is going on.
Let's look at some instances where corporations dictate what happens in American politics:
- Illegal alien amnesty. The corporations and the corporations alone are THE ONLY part benefiting to an amnesty. The government will be overwhelmed by illegal alien care and costs; the people's wages will be severely depressed, as the surplus of people will continue to lower US wages.
- Open borders. This is a no-brainer. Terrorists can cross over undetected with no problems at all. Hezbollah agents have already done so and some got caught and were prosecuted later for rasing funds to a terror organization. And yet DC doesn't do anything about it because the corporations demand cheap labor, so they need the border open for anyone and everyone to come across.
-Free-Trade agreements that ONLY benefit foreign countries. OK, we all know that trade is very good. But when we have monsters like China pumping out stuff 100x faster than we can, for a 10th of the price, then it is clear trhat the US will be in a trade deficit with China. So why make such bad agreements?? Because the large corporate conglomerates want it, that is why!
All in all... a very bad situation. I think the future is very gloomy.... it is almost like we are back in the pre-1930's when Corporations literally owned the US congress (specially the railroad companies and Pan-Am). Americans broke free from corporate rule and now we are going back to the days when corporations openly own DC. Just see the Democrats in 2006... massive donations that used to go to Republicans. Both parties are in corporate hands now.
Now we are gfoi
Sadly, you are correct.
People need to realize that each political party is controlled by special interests and lobbyists, and that is who they work for.
Its silly to think, "now that a Democrat/Republican is in power, we will see change, or that life will be better now." People are so naive.
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) and please be as specific as possible so that I can compare it to observable reality. Assume that I am an alien and know nothing about the situation and give me as much detail as possible.
