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You cite a lot of things in which you call me a supposed fool, but then you apparently lack the capacity to tell me how or why I'm wrong.
Let me attack your rather pathetic speaking points:
quote: There are many white women that are getting pregnant young with the father of the child wanting nothing to do with the mother or the baby also. Just watch a week of Maury and you can see this. Divorce rates across all races is 50%, therefore there are many of every race that don't have the father in the home. Just because the father isn't in the home, doesn't mean that they are not a part of the childs life.
I don't know what reality you come from, but the fatherless black child is rather well known in the reality I live in. These children are not from broken homes, they simply never have a father to start with, their mother is unwed. The process of abandonment begins before the child is born. If your rebuttal is a selection of white trash from 'Maury' I suggest you turn off the tv, pay attention to the real world and do some research.
quote: You are basing someone being better solely off of what you consider to be socially better. But on the same hand, what you consider to be better dressed or better articulation and a dignified manner may not be the same in another part of the country. What you are saying is that hey, I am going to judge you, because you don't look or talk the way I do. Why should anyone have to conform to your idealogy of standards?
My father was in the Air Force, I've lived in a variety of places across this country and I'm sorry to tell you that you're perpetrating a fantasy to simply disagree with me. The standards of socially acceptable forms of dress, behavior and speech do not vary across this country as they might across Europe, which has a wide array of cultural norms. Yes, people should conform to standards in which their clothes fit, they speak appropriately and respect others. This is not in question, and deviation from such basic acceptable standards is why our country is heading down the toilet. Stop making excuses for such behavior.
quote: (regarding black children being more likely to be distracted in class) No real response to this, you are just making ignorant statements on this one.
Perhaps you can educate me as to how I'm wrong? I've observed this myself a multitude of times. Perhaps you can more fully explain why black children continue to score below their white counterparts in any age group across the country? The truth is that black children need a firmer hand with steady direction to ensure they get the most out of educational experiences.
quote: You can also find 40 old white men with monster truck tires on the trucks, and after market spoilers put on their cameros etc... you can find older white guys that are wearing leather biker jackets, jeans way way too tight etc... You can also find white people that let their kids play outside with no supervision, or let their kids run in the parking lot etc... Everything that you are saying here you can find the same basis in white people.
Sure you can, but those men generally are fathers to their children, at least in the early stages of life, even if they eventually divorce. You can find fools in any group, I didn't state otherwise. The problem is that black men tend of be foolish at the complete expense of any redeeming family life or steady job.
quote: I think you are trying to talk about the Honor Roll teenager that was beaten to death in Chicago, not Detroit? If that is the case, honestly you can't speak of it, because you have no idea of any of the facts of what happened. So you will make yourself look more like a fool.
Chicago and Detroit are both **** poor hell holes, forgive me for forgetting which one it was. After watching multiple interviews with the student's grandfather describing the matter I'm just as versed as anyone else outside his immediate family to interpret the situation as I did. Again: You call me a 'fool' yet offer no other facts about the case or information of value. I've seen the interviews, I've seen the video of the poor guy getting beaten to death. It was a horrible scene.
Just a notation here as well: your little insult did not address my complaint that blacks refer to those among themselves who try to study and achieve as "acting white", instead of "acting right".
Okay, you want to know about Albert Derrion, which is the honor roll kid that was beaten to death. He was not beaten for not joining a gang, it wasn't even a gang fight, the gangs had nothing to do with it what so ever. Derrion jumped into the fight, he threw a punch before anyone else touched him. The inital reports that went out on tv outside of the Chicago channels made the fight sound like something that it really wasnt. The media was embelishing the truths.
The trying to act white thing, isnt about one who studies and achieves, it is about the one, that wants to pretend, he is not who he is. you know kind of like when white people use the term wannabe
The trying to act white thing, isnt about one who studies and achieves, it is about the one, that wants to pretend, he is not who he is. you know kind of like when white people use the term wannabe
Blacks are the first people to shout 'racism' yet the mentality exists that they are somehow different or have to act different than whites, asians, indians, etc.
What is 'pretending he is not who he is'? Acting decent, being respectful to others, learning enough to present good arguments and opinions, dressing well and speaking clearly?
Those are things everyone should aspire to and aren't limited to or characterized by race.
When you go to your doctor, do you want him to come to you with his pants falling down, speaking gutter lingo and throwing gang signs, or do you want someone who is properly dressed, and speaks and acts appropriately?
Every other race in this country adheres to a baseline standard model of intelligence and refinement. We have people below that level in every race, but even gutter trash hookers, pimps, and lowlife criminals can point out the individuals they see on the street who meet the criteria that we all know reflect competence and intelligence. If the black man refuses to acknowledge that simple truth, he should not wonder why other races think less of him.
What is destroying the black community is we pay too much attention to this thug culture crap. I don't just mean the admirers, either.
Instead of sitting here beating your own drum, OP, why aren't you out there actively promoting a more positive image? Give me an effing break with this thug/hip hop culture crap. It means something to you when you ALLOW it to mean something to you. Just as you aren't out there participating in this culture, you shouldn't buy into the majority of the next generation admire this garbage.
I'd like to see more religious schools for all grades in the ghetto and more successful black men come back to teach programs as mentors. Too much good talent wasted.
Can't wait for the falling down pants fad to end in both black and white kids. Makes you want to yank them down the rest of the way.
In the reality that I live in, the exact same problems that are present among urban black people who have problems with substance abuse are the same ones among rural white people who have problems with meth. This is well documented. Dropping out of school, teen pregnancy, crime to in support of habit are all part of the rural meth problem. Coincidentally, the parts of the country with the highest white teen pregnancy rates and drop out rates are also in the South. I'm not saying that that is the South's fault, but rather there is something there that is correlated with those things. I personally think it is a lack of sex education. Others agree.
Meth isn't the 'crack of the south' people make it out to be. It's an over emphasized problem by a tremendous degree. I do actually live in the south, guess what the crack of the south is? It's crack. I can't speak to regional teen pregnancy rates because I haven't looked into those numbers. I do know that in racial groupings whites have roughly 1/3rd the pregnancy rates of black teens. Nationally high school graduation rates are only ~ 70%, but that number drops to ~20% in some cities like detroit. I imagine the pure drop out rate widely reflects nearly these kinds of figures.
Quote:
Originally Posted by diva360
Look, I've lived in four areas of the country, and people dress significantly different there. In Manhattan, people do not dress the same way they do in, say, Mobile AL. I have seen this with my own eyes.
I believe many of you are somehow reading my mention of dress and not understanding it. Regardless of what minor differences you see in those places, you notice professionals, people with taste, and those who present themselves well. I don't know what fantasy land you folks are living in if you expect me to believe otherwise. These are universal norms in American society.
Quote:
Originally Posted by diva360
Are you a teacher? What makes up this data set you keep referring to? I am a teacher, and some of my best students have been my black students. Some have been slackers. Same as my brown, tan, and beige students.
Simple, look into achievement and standardized scoring at various age ranges between races. I'm sure as a teacher you will be able to find more than enough information. These are not new issues. If I were to give you links you would balk at them with one excuse or another, so investigate for yourself.
Quote:
Originally Posted by diva360
I wouldn't be so sure about that. In the part of the country where people tend to deck out their cars in the manner that the OP describes, divorce rates are very high, as are teen pregnancy rates, low levels of education, and so on. In fact, the states with the highest rates of these things also happen somehow to be in the Bible Belt.
I find it interesting that you keep referring to the bible belt as having these problems but your home state (was it NJ? I can't look while replying) is immune in your mind?
Quote:
Originally Posted by diva360
Urban Detroit is kinda empty, and I wouldn't call Chicago what you did. I'd call it the cultural jewel of the Midwest. Cities like Minneapolis and Chicago fertilize the economies of MN, WI, and IL. I used to live on the I-90/I-94 corrider and had to deal with the truck traffic bringing things back and forth between places. I guess there are some people with money in Chicago who buy stuff. If you walk down Michigan Ave., you will see stores (think Prada, Dolce & Gabana, Gucci) with very expensive things in them. I love Chicago's museums, colleges and universities, and I'll admit it, shopping. Also I love the variety of ethnic eateries of all sorts, including eastern European ones. Man, those Polish pickles are good, and don't get me started on the fresh, authentic Polish sausages.
Urban Detroit is empty because it's had what? Almost two million people and now has less than a million. It's a wasteland. I've been told living in Detroit is much like being in the movie 'I Am Legend'. You see the sun going down and think 'oh crap'.
I'm not going to deny Chicago has 'stuff'. Having 'stuff' to buy or do doesn't mean a place is cultured or safe. Washington DC has 'stuff' but also has a tremendous crime rate coupled with a staggering level of hiv infection in the general population.
Quote:
Originally Posted by diva360
About the "acting white" thing: I'm pretty sure black people know about this and talk about it. In fact, several of them have written books about such things. They don't tend to agree on everything. But why should they? You and I are both white, and I bet we would have a hard time coming up with something that is both consequential and controversial that we agree about. I just wanted to let you know that your points are really not universally shared among white people. My thoughts about the issues you raise are pretty much the opposite of yours.
Yes, my thought is that they need to stress achievement and education as worthwhile goals, not something to generate hostility toward. How this could be disagreeable to anyone is beyond me.
wethrowpie...did you just join CD to rant & rave against blacks?
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