Had a not so pleasant debate with a swinger/open sex marriage person (separate, kids)
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He is more of a acquaintance in music circles than a friend, I wouldn't allow such a debate to happen with a friend nor would I say something I knew would be taken as a offense if it were a friend. I'd keep my thoughts to myself.
Yeah I know, but it messes with my mind. It has for a long time. As the years go by and I see it even more it just reinforces my fear. And I am typing all this in my thread because this week for whatever reason it has been on my mind and making me down and maybe typing it will make me feel better.
meh.... he's right in a sense though, I live in my own world where the shade is purple and I don't want to grow up and come out to the real world where everything is just grey.
Got to get out of this self-pity and self hurting phase I am in this week
So I know this guitar player. Had a conversation with him recently where the fact that he and his wife swing and it kind of got ugly at moments when we shot back at each other view points that don't agree.It started and progressed because we were talking about the fact that I am single and have nobody I am seeing at the moment. I mentioned that the last couple times I have been out at the bars watching bands, one time his, the women that flirted and came on to me turned out they had husbands at home. I was just drinking at the bar next to them and talking and they got all flirty with me. I wasn't looking for anything with them.He said , "well they know what their doing why didn't you go for it"? I said I don't respect people who have made a vow and are married who cheat or have sex even if it is open sex outside the marriage like even swingers. I knew he and his wife are, so I knew that was opening a can of worms with my comment.And it did, because his over tone got nasty, and he said " you are in for a big surprise when you finally discover the real world out there and how the world is gonna dump on you if you don't grow up and how he hates attitudes like mine that demand everybody be the one and only to each other", "What century do you think this is?" he said.
I told him do what you want but don't tell me it is some enlightened attitude, to separate sex from marriage, to think that having their commitment in just emotion but leaving open sex as some separate thing is enlightened because that is a cop out for the fact that you can't commit or stand up to a promise all the way.He didn't like what I said, and it may be judgmental but that is what I think. And frankly those married women that flirted with me that openly suggested leaving together I see with a bit of disgust. I don't care what people do if single, I am no poster boy for morality myself, but if people want to mess around get single or stay single.But all this has been messing with my mind recently, depressing me a bit. What happened to me at the bar, that guys viewpoint , and how so many people get divorced now and how they f... around. I know several people after years of marriage, it falling apart or where one of them cheats. It is more normal than not now.It is all I see out there. And it scares the crap out of me and enforces my fear of even trying to find a long term commitment anymore. I am NOT gonna be the guy who's wife is trying to get some strange while I am at home. And I am not going to the guy who lets his woman get open sex from others in order to save their marriage. I am not going to be the guy who after 20 years of marriage has his wife leave him to reunite with a long lost from facebook.I cannot understand how a guy would be alright with his woman doing other guys, even if it is supposedly that he has her heart and those other guys are just sport.Yeah I am judgmental that way, I think those guys are loosers....He said the world will take a dump on me if I don't grow up, I think it already has.......
Hoooray for you; a guy who knows what commitment means! My ex LOVED me and all other women who crossed his path and I am here to tell you the consequences of his infidelity were dire to say the least. While pregnant with his son, I ended up with vaginal warts a wonderful STD that could have seriously harmed my child when I delivered. He swore he wasn't cheating..OK and I am an alien. NEXT, we moved to Maine to try to save our marriage..this was after the baby and he kept right on cheating...I had crabs, clamidia (sp?) and something that was so serious I had to see a doctor for some pretty strong antibiotics..never did find out what that one was. I was left sterile from his escapades and could not have anymore children. He remarried with all his COOTIES and his second wife has had cervical cancer which can be traced back to his past and the Papaloma (sp?) virus he carries. He is a walking germ who could possibly end up with brain destroying syphillis at some point. I don't think "swingers" are totally awake when it comes to safe sex and trust that most people are "clean" when it comes to swinging. Men and women who can't be content with one partner are a HUGE risk to ones health. I so agree...I was so hurt with my first husbands escapades and couldn't get away from him fast enough. It was disrespectful, hurtful and dangerous as his wife now has found out. Bravo to you for taking a stand on this one!
Last edited by Pammyd; 07-12-2012 at 04:36 AM..
Reason: Spelling error
Hoooray for you; a guy who knows what commitment means! My ex LOVED me and all other women who crossed his path and I am here to tell you the consequences of his infidelity were dire to say the least.
Sorry to hear this. However it is worth noting that this thread is about Swinging and Open Sex. This is not the same as infidelity. The latters is about dishonesty, cheating, lying and more. The former is about open and consensual sex among all parties concerned.
There is no comparison therefore and the fact that some guys cheat on their wife should in no way be used to attack those who are in Open relationships or who Swing.
I agree with monumentus, there are indeed some very happy couples out there who both equally enjoy the lifestyle while remaining very much in love with each other. Not here to debate or defend the lifestyle, but regarding the OP, you need to chill out and employ the live and let live motto. Also, loosen up a bit and the "right" girl may appear in an unexpected setting. what ferretkona said......
There are couples who interpret marriage as a fluid relationship. Primarily as friends, lovers, and family unit. That is not threatened by "unimportant" sexual relationships. That is how some, "modern" egalitarian marriages are comprised. I don't see this as an issue if both parties agree. It can work...but it is not for everyone.
So....understand his point of view....and your own. They are just different perspectives on the continuum of interpreting relationships and marriage. Neither one is "wrong" or "bad ". I have friends who have had an "open" marriage for years..they have a great relationship. But....it is not for everyone.
This.
Personally, I am a one man type of woman. If I wanted to be with multiple guys, I wouldn't try to make any kind of commitment to anyone. However, I do have friends that are swingers and have been trying to get me involved with them for years. But I won't do it. While I understand the idea behind it, I just don't agree with it. They have a happy marriage and a close knit group of couples and friends they "play" with. It's just not for me.
However, I do have friends that are swingers and have been trying to get me involved with them for years.
See, this is why I could never be friends with swinging couples. One "no" or even the absence of a "yes" should be their clue to back off and never bring it up again. Friends don't pressure friends to do something they're neither wanting nor needing to do.
Sorry to hear this. However it is worth noting that this thread is about Swinging and Open Sex. This is not the same as infidelity. The latters is about dishonesty, cheating, lying and more. The former is about open and consensual sex among all parties concerned.
There is no comparison therefore and the fact that some guys cheat on their wife should in no way be used to attack those who are in Open relationships or who Swing.
Was not attacking ANYONE just letting people in general know what can happen with multiple partners. Have your open sex if you want..I find it rather repulsive and am entitled to my opinion. If your marriage was happy in a NORMAL way, then the extra marital activity would not be a necessary thing for you. Also, in my opinion...one partner is enough for most people so SWING ON if that's what you desire.
It is interesting, however; occasionally you can ask someone "Why are you a swinger/in an open relationship?" and they'll start talking about how they theorize that people cheat because they need to be a swinger/in an open relationship. And in general, I've been given the attitude that a monogamous, committed relationship to one person is either unnatural or too much to ask.
Of course, I disagree. While I can admit I certainly see the FUN in it*, I wouldn't be a swinger or in an open relationship.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Vic 2.0
If both people agree to it, then swinging = fidelity.
But I'll go ahead and make the claim that (true) monogamy is somewhat more honorable, sure. It's being more responsible than tacking on additional risks (every person adds risk, theoretically) for a little extra sexual pleasure. Whether it be the fact that you're adding at least one additional person who can contract and bring an STD into the mix, or the added chance of someone getting hurt emotionally, it's adding considerable risks in order to fulfill an already questionable desire.
The proof of it is in how people explain the perceived "need" for open relationships. I've heard it in every thread on the subject so far: "Better for a man to be able to have sex with another woman with his wife's consent than for him to cheat on her!" Like a man just can't resist the urge to have sex with another woman. Can't help it. Nothing honorable about this sort of weakness, imo.
*I see the fun in LOTS of things, including things we would ALL acknowledge as wrong or over the line. Like punching my boss in the mouth for micromanaging details that make no difference!
See, this is why I could never be friends with swinging couples. One "no" or even the absence of a "yes" should be their clue to back off and never bring it up again. Friends don't pressure friends to do something they're neither wanting nor needing to do.
Those aren't true friends IMO. I have friends that live this lifestyle. I personally don't agree with it, but am really surprised how many participate. Some have ended in divorce due to jealousy and one part of the couple not being able to handle it.
Was not attacking ANYONE just letting people in general know what can happen with multiple partners. Have your open sex if you want..I find it rather repulsive and am entitled to my opinion. If your marriage was happy in a NORMAL way, then the extra marital activity would not be a necessary thing for you. Also, in my opinion...one partner is enough for most people so SWING ON if that's what you desire.
You appear to have jumped the gun somewhat there as I at no point indicated that I myself engage in anything of the sort. My relationship is slightly unusual yes - but it is not an "open" relationship and we are not swingers.
The reason for my reply is that you appear in your post to have acted like being against swining and open relationships is somehow synonymous with being "a guy who knows what commitment means" and this is disingenuous. People in open and swining relationships can be every bit as committed and honest - sometimes more so - than anyone in relationships you crassly define as "normal".
You find such relationships repulsive - that is great - simply do not engage in that kind of relationship yourself. Job Done. The issue however is that you do not just stop there but openly wander around suggesting such people are not committed - not honest - not "normal" - not "happy" - repuslive and more. The fact you wander into a thread about open relationships and go on a tangent about infidelity is to equate the two in ways they are not equivalent.
Someone cheated on you and that is awful - and it makes the person who did it an awful person. You have my sympathy and he has my ire. None of that has anything to do with this thread or the kind of lifestyles being discussed within it and my reply to you was intended to do nothing but highlight the distinction between the two.
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