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Anti-social personality disorder, not narcissistic personality disorder. He's got the superficial charm, a manipulator, doesn't care at all about how others feels other than getting joy out of making people feel bad by making hateful comments and spreading rumors about them, completely irresponsible and a total parasite, emotionally and financially.
I would agree that seeking out a different dance group could well be worth the relief.
Yah, when I said NPD, I was giving him the benefit of the doubt. I'm inclined to agree and it's crazy b/c I was all read up on ASPD, being as I have a sis with one and you'd think if anyone could have spotted it, it would be me. But no, these things are hellishly hard to spot and part of the reason is b/c we want to believe people are basically good but truth is, some aren't. Just before all this happened I went to a farm auction with him and one thing I noticed was that no one talked to him and I thought that was kind of strange considering that he had lived there over 20 years and the auction was less than 2 miles from his home. It was one of those things that I noted as something to keep an eye on.
Trouble with the advice to get another dance hall is that I'd have to move to find one. They're few and far between in MO but I guess I could take up another form of dance. I'm inclined to agree that he won't quit. If he finds out I"m going to another dance place though, he'll just follow me there. He's already emailed some of my friends in StL looking for a place to stay.
Quote:
Originally Posted by krieger00
I have 55 gallon drum and duck tape .
Love you all for this kind of stuff--gives me a giggle when I'm upset about it.
Kin Atoms, I was making nice in Scotland--I didn't want to pay a bunch of money to go on a trip and have it ruined but darned if I was going to pay his way. Do you think I deserved this? I'm just curious. I don't think I did but I was stupid for overlooking a few things but they were so subtle--things like the inflection of his voice sometimes rang false with me. Not stuff you'd break up with someone over and esp when things seem to be going well, but things that will make you hesitate to get married.
Oh, gotta tell you all something else he did in Scotland. We had been traveling all day and though he was doing his best to be pleasant, he was severely grating on my nerves and esp after I knew he had no money. We stopped at a food place and he told me what he wanted and offered to stay outside and watch the bags. At this point I had zero trust in him so we sat and watched him in the window where we could see him but he couldn't see us. I swear to God, he stood out on the sidewalk talking to himself and complete with gestures! It was so creepy that we right there and then made our decision that starting the next day after we got to a good stopping point, he was not going along. The next night after we traveled a few hours by train to a different place from what we told him, we saw him and he had managed to rent a car. He was following us and I was really getting creeped out at that point.
Stephie, usually the American Legions or VFW, in many states have a band & dancing on Fri, Sat nights. Maybe a Jam Session on Sunday. You can go in as a guest.
To the OP: I don't think you deserved this; it is nevertheless a train wreck and with so many early warning signs, you will know where you went wrong so it is likely to never happen to you again. There will never be enough explanation to those who know you and him, for them to ever think there was something more you're not sharing about the relationship. It will be suggested how does anyone get to a certain age and not know/look/sense something is not right, but just move on in to the danger zone. It's kind of like the assertion in a court of law for a finding of not guilty - it never says your innocent.
I would absolutely assert he is likely an amalgam of Cluster B. ASPD will only look at stepping stones and will not waste time on one-up-manship, while NPD will have the wound and desire for vengeance. I am thinking a milder, non-murdering version of Andrew Cunanan (see also Andrew Cunanan - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia) or like Damon's character in the movie, "The Talented Mr. Ripley."
Back to the OP, you should clearly make some moves elsewhere. Not physical relocation, but staying out of his ever-widening circle. Until he finds someone else, you will be it. This won't be about finding fun in your dance group, it will be about him clearing his nose of you and never sniffing you out again. He won't continue to go if you are not there. Take a sabbatical after telling those close to you about him and about your need to leave. That may be the only damage control you can do at this time. Follow what others are saying about diverse venues, but for now, call it quits.
I would absolutely assert he is likely an amalgam of Cluster B. ASPD will only look at stepping stones and will not waste time on one-up-manship, while NPD will have the wound and desire for vengeance. I am thinking a milder, non-murdering version of Andrew Cunanan (see also Andrew Cunanan - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia) or like Damon's character in the movie, "The Talented Mr. Ripley."
Yes I've done a lot of reading since this all happened and I'm constantly switching back and forth from ASPD, NPD, and borderline so I think he has the whole cluster. He threatened suicide right after I broke it off and before the trip. He lied all over the place. The night he said the bad thing and I was leaving early, he insisted on me kissing him goodbye though I was quite upset and then he started to stagger around like he was ripping his hair out. (and I thought, oh brother!) Oh, the talking to himself episode. And one day when I went over to his house he was pouting about something and I couldn't imagine what it was and he said that he had perseverated on the idea that I might leave. (Yes I know, red flag but this was several months in) and another time I got there and he was really strange and I remember wondering if he'd got drunk but when I looked around for signs of excessive alcohol consumption I couldn't find any. Then I thought that he might have overdone the pain meds for an operation he'd had over a year ago but still took sometimes but my thought now is that he was dissociating? I'm not sure what that looks like, but I can imagine it after that episode.
Except for those last two things though, everything else came out after the break-up and he kept his PD pretty well hidden before that. I can imagine why he wanted to hurry up and get married--he was getting tired of putting on the act. The other two things that happened earlier and the incident about the auction were things that didn't show up until well after we started dating and I'm embarrassed to admit it, but once I was sleeping with him I was more reluctant to leave. Stupid I know but the sex was good. Well you know what they say about crazy people--they're great in bed!
I really am going to lay low for awhile though and stop trying to date. No more OLD. I think that's where I get myself in trouble and need to stop--in thinking that I need to be with someone. This one seemed so great at first though--we could talk about anything--shared interests in common that I can't imagine anyone else having. I thought he was delightfully eccentric but not crazy. Boy was I wrong.
He he. New news. I went to the dance tonight and he was there with his new gal friend and she seems nice enough. I was a bit calmer this time b/c at least I expected it. I went up and introduced myself to her and her friend and they looked a little weirded out so who knows what they've heard. I had a great time dancing with everyone and made up my mind what to do. Maybe I shouldn't have done it , but it was my good deed for the day. When the ex walked away to get a drink I ran over to the new girlfriend and said "Listen to your intuition if something feels wrong!" That's all I said--decided not to talk bad b/c she wouldn't have believed it anyway but later I looked over and I could tell the dynamics had completely changed between them. I almost felt bad for ruining her evening but I was doing her a favor in the long run. He sat out the rest of the dances and towards the end of the night they were turned away from each other. I also had a long talk with one of the men who is a retired counselor--he was the one they called when someone threatened to shoot someone or themselves so he was a very good listener and he was also very concerned, and suggested that we tell the man who is in charge so we did that and they will be helping to keep an eye on things. The counselor told me he saw the ex talking to himself too so he does completely believe me and that I'm not just trying to make trouble. So I have a strong feeling this was his last hoorah with us or it will be over shortly. I have no idea why I'm such a magnet for crazy people!
He has a good thing going and you spit in his soup. If you let them be, the natural course of the relationship would have spiraled downward; like you, she would have caught on to what was really going on, and he would be chasing after her, wherever she went. Now he can only come after you. This didn't save the day for anyone, and it will likely come back to you. That really wasn't nice. It doesn't matter if she 'listened;' you had a back door exit, and you made sure to let her through first. Who got the benefit? No one won. You should have a long talk with someone. That was not a good deed.
and I realize I can't make him stop going but man I'd like to say something that would sting him to the core but I think he's got a personality disorder. I also think he's going b/c he sees it as a prime opp to pick up women--he messaged half the women in the group looking for a date after I dumped him and some of them were over 30 years younger! I am just mortified that I ever fell for this man and need suggestions. What would you do? Oh yeah, this is the man who swore undying love and was ready to get married. TG I'm not that dumb.
Google borderline personality disorder.
Well, you are not "DUMB", BPD sufferers are usually very charming, attractive people. It is when they "split" - view you either as all good or all bad, they become completely different people.
He has a good thing going and you spit in his soup. If you let them be, the natural course of the relationship would have spiraled downward; like you, she would have caught on to what was really going on, and he would be chasing after her, wherever she went. Now he can only come after you. This didn't save the day for anyone, and it will likely come back to you. That really wasn't nice. It doesn't matter if she 'listened;' you had a back door exit, and you made sure to let her through first. Who got the benefit? No one won. You should have a long talk with someone. That was not a good deed.
I disagree. This man could actually turn out to be dangerous...I think the OP did that woman a favor...if the other woman's radar had not already been picking up something, the OP's comment to her wouldn't have ruined the evening and changed the dynamics between those two.
I think the OP used exceptionally good language -- she didn't badmouth that man, she simply warned the other woman to listen to her intuition. How would OP have felt if she hadn't said anything and this other woman turned up beaten to death because the man's behaviour escalated?
I disagree. This man could actually turn out to be dangerous...I think the OP did that woman a favor...if the other woman's radar had not already been picking up something, the OP's comment to her wouldn't have ruined the evening and changed the dynamics between those two.
I think the OP used exceptionally good language -- she didn't badmouth that man, she simply warned the other woman to listen to her intuition. How would OP have felt if she hadn't said anything and this other woman turned up beaten to death because the man's behaviour escalated?
I appreciate your disagreement, but having read the full thread, he did not escalate his behavior in the time he was following stepka towards violence, just towards being even more clinging. He's simply been as annoying as gum on your shoe. The new woman may or may not have appreciated that, but stepka's real question was how do I get this man to stop following me. She was given an answer (let him find another love interest) and interestingly enough, made herself available (again) to be followed. I think she protests too much, as Shakespeare stated.
I appreciate your disagreement, but having read the full thread, he did not escalate his behavior in the time he was following stepka towards violence, just towards being even more clinging. He's simply been as annoying as gum on your shoe. The new woman may or may not have appreciated that, but stepka's real question was how do I get this man to stop following me. She was given an answer (let him find another love interest) and interestingly enough, made herself available (again) to be followed. I think she protests too much, as Shakespeare stated.
Maybe but he didn't show up to the last dance and I had a nice long talk with the folks on the board. I honestly don't know if he would escalate or not but I have felt afraid since I broke up with him and realized he was nowhere near the person I thought he was. That's what's scary about these things--you don't know what the person is capable of but I don't think he's as harmless as the gum on my shoe--for one thing, he has enough guns to stock a compound. For another thing, he's crazy enough to sit and talk to himself and laugh and make gestures--in public, and as far as I know those with PD don't generally talk to themselves so he has several PD's plus lord knows whatever else. Also he's made several comments in emails to me that frightened me, b/c they were vaguely threatening. I know it's hard to get enough info to assess in a short post so I'm not irritated, but he is not gum on my shoe. More like borderline diabetes or something.
FTR--I am not a fearful person--have pretty much always gone and done what I've wanted to do. Another thought about this, is that if he were so into her then why was he bringing her around to a social activity that his ex was sure to be at? I really don't care if he's into her--that is so far off my mind it's gone like a poof, but he wasn't bringing her b/c he was crazy about her--he was bringing her, he hoped, to rub her in my face.
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but this was several months in) and another time I got there and he was really strange and I remember wondering if he'd got drunk but when I looked around for signs of excessive alcohol consumption I couldn't find any. Then I thought that he might have overdone the pain meds for an operation he'd had over a year ago but still took sometimes but my thought now is that he was dissociating? I'm not sure what that looks like, but I can imagine it after that episode. 
TG I'm not that dumb.
