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Well obvious, your son grew up in a different environment than I did. I was too busy worrying about survival and getting backstabbed by folks I thought I could trust to worry about being nice. I believe in self-reliance and not expecting people to do for you so you have to make your own way without any expectancy of help.
No you don't. You believe in slamming everything that requires an effort from you, or that does not provide immediate satisfaction. My son and his crown do believe in hard work and self-reliance - they were absolutely raised that way. I don't have any idea how you were raised, all we can go by is the constant stream of frustration and bitterness that you post here.
1. 22 year old men don't act or speak the same way they do around their mothers as they do around their friends.
2. He and his friends are young, and perhaps haven't been burned...yet.
3. I know in my early 20's my worldviews and the things I notice around me were not the same as they are now. Eventually, most guys come to notice the egregious double standards that are applied to men.
Well, since my son and his friends attitudes reflects pretty much all the males that I personally know, including those that are older, I would have to disagree with you.
1. 22 year old men don't act or speak the same way they do around their mothers as they do around their friends.
2. He and his friends are young, and perhaps haven't been burned...yet.
3. I know in my early 20's my worldviews and the things I notice around me were not the same as they are now. Eventually, most guys come to notice the egregious double standards that are applied to men.
And? Not like women don't face double standards as well, but you don't see countless threads complaining about it. The loser guy whining seems to happen alot more often.
For women
1. Men can sleep around with no problem. And while women can do that freely these days, still many women and men alike will call them sluts and whores, and dehumanize them as something to be slept with only, and not taken seriously for a relationship - girlfriend or wife. Even guys on here stating they would never date women who had a high number of sex partners. You see, in many cases, guys are ashamed of being virgins, or having a low number of partners, they may even lie and increase their number when talking about it. Whereas women are the opposite. To avoid being judged, they have to decrease their number, if it's over 15.
This is one women still have to deal with, and the way it's done is they have to abide by the standard, and not have much sex too many different partners. Or, they sleep around as they please, but have to learn to ignore or not care for the judgement they'll receive. So, same for men with chivalry> Men don't have to be chivalrous. But women wanting chivalry is no different than a man who doesn't want a woman that's had alot of sex partners. Chivalry doesn't make a man weak or women horrible. And having a few partners doesn't automatically make a woman a worthless *****.
But it seems like this forum invites all the guys out of the wood work to whine and complain . I have never seen so many bitter men in one place, other than on Yahoo Answers lol where tons of guys ask the same question "Why do women like jerks who treat them bad" And the question never sounds any less clueless and stupid when it's asked.
Sigh....this is the biggest problem with relationships. Everyone wants to keep score, and see who did more for the other, instead of doing nice things because they are the right thing to do, and to show that person how much you care about them. I'm not saying let someone walk over you, and if you are doing nice things for that person and they are not reciprocating, then STOP BEING AROUND THAT PERSON! Don't say all people are selfish and wouldn't appreciate the nice things you do for them because that isn't true. I know this saying is corny, but it's very true in this case, "You will attract more bees with honey". It's a shame that people are so afraid of just being nice and doing nice things, because they fear of being taken advantage of. I speak from personal experience, that if I am a gentleman towards a woman, even women where things didn't work out in the end, they responded favorably in kind. Yes People can be a-holes, but you can't focus on those people. Focus on those who love you, and want to be around you. Then you would have no problem being a gentleman or a lady.
A friend posted this list on FB about gentleman/chivalry and associated . After reading that list, good God! I've never seen such desperate thirsty crap all to please a woman in my life. Thank God this stuff is dying. Most of the list just screams thirsty and desperate.
.....desperate and thirsty , you say? Well, I was brought up on this etiquette, and still believe in it, strongly. My Mom taught me as much about it as my Dad, as well. My lady gets treated thisaway. And then some. I'd stand in front of a bullet for her, without even having to think about it.
You see, I believe you are taking things a bit ...out of context. Perhaps, in this modern age, some of this would be somewhat over the top for a woman that you don't know well. Some of it ain't, as well. Depends on the man. Nevertheless, it is NOT dead. Rumors of its demise are greatly exaggerated.
It did take my lady some vetting used to on a couple of the things. Walking to the outside of her on the street confused her, at first. I would always shift to make sure I took that position, out of habit ( my Mom drilled it into me at a young age) . My girl gets it now. Along with everything else.
She is a fiercely independent and self reliant little . She was ...resistant..to some things at first, that whole "anything you can do I can do better, go go Girl Power" bit. She likes it now. Its not like I'm her man slave. Hardly. I am her protector and HER Man, however. Believe it or not, its a two way, multiple lane, street, as well. Verily, I do not understand your vehemence as to a man treating his woman this way. If you REALLY love her, methinks he should.
OK, as I said earlier, for a woman you have just met or even on a first date, from 21st century views, yes. Over the top for some of it. But none of it is set in stone, and it can be modified to suit any occasion. But to say that being a gentleman of old school provinces is "desperate and thirsty", to my mind, is a bit ..prejudiced. Meaning pre-judgement before you have all the facts.
Sigh....this is the biggest problem with relationships. Everyone wants to keep score, and see who did more for the other, instead of doing nice things because they are the right thing to do, and to show that person how much you care about them. I'm not saying let someone walk over you, and if you are doing nice things for that person and they are not reciprocating, then STOP BEING AROUND THAT PERSON! Don't say all people are selfish and wouldn't appreciate the nice things you do for them because that isn't true. I know this saying is corny, but it's very true in this case, "You will attract more bees with honey". It's a shame that people are so afraid of just being nice and doing nice things, because they fear of being taken advantage of. I speak from personal experience, that if I am a gentleman towards a woman, even women where things didn't work out in the end, they responded favorably in kind. Yes People can be a-holes, but you can't focus on those people. Focus on those who love you, and want to be around you. Then you would have no problem being a gentleman or a lady.
You said it better than I did - and maybe some of the men on here will listen to you because you're a man! But I completely agree! I love it when my husband does nice things for me - and I love doing nice things for him, too. I love it when he makes me feel special and I love making him feel special. When you stop thinking about "ME ME ME" all the time and "WHAT ARE YOU GOING TO DO FOR ME?" - you find out that doing things for others can be it's own reward - and often leads to others doing things for you.
And? Not like women don't face double standards as well, but you don't see countless threads complaining about it. The loser guy whining seems to happen alot more often.
For women
1. Men can sleep around with no problem. And while women can do that freely these days, still many women and men alike will call them sluts and whores, and dehumanize them as something to be slept with only, and not taken seriously for a relationship - girlfriend or wife. Even guys on here stating they would never date women who had a high number of sex partners. You see, in many cases, guys are ashamed of being virgins, or having a low number of partners, they may even lie and increase their number when talking about it. Whereas women are the opposite. To avoid being judged, they have to decrease their number, if it's over 15.
This is one women still have to deal with, and the way it's done is they have to abide by the standard, and not have much sex too many different partners. Or, they sleep around as they please, but have to learn to ignore or not care for the judgement they'll receive. So, same for men with chivalry> Men don't have to be chivalrous. But women wanting chivalry is no different than a man who doesn't want a woman that's had alot of sex partners. Chivalry doesn't make a man weak or women horrible. And having a few partners doesn't automatically make a woman a worthless *****.
But it seems like this forum invites all the guys out of the wood work to whine and complain . I have never seen so many bitter men in one place, other than on Yahoo Answers lol where tons of guys ask the same question "Why do women like jerks who treat them bad" And the question never sounds any less clueless and stupid when it's asked.
So I mention the long-term decline of men in both education and economic opportunity, that is only ever mentioned as a problem because women don't have men to marry, and you mention $*#t-shaming.
Case in point.
And want to point out again, I'm not whining. There's very little or nothing I can do about the general decay of Western "culture." Quite the opposite, I'm feeding off of it. That doesn't mean I don't find it regrettable.
The Roman empire collapsed under the weight of its own hubris, hypocrisy and decadence. It's what happens to all great empires, and it's what's happening in the West.
Location: Huntersville/Charlotte, NC and Washington, DC
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ChessieMom
No you don't. You believe in slamming everything that requires an effort from you, or that does not provide immediate satisfaction. My son and his crown do believe in hard work and self-reliance - they were absolutely raised that way. I don't have any idea how you were raised, all we can go by is the constant stream of frustration and bitterness that you post here.
I know g$&damn well what I believe, thanks very much. I'm studying for a masters degree. Talk about effort and delayed gratification now eh.
You said it better than I did - and maybe some of the men on here will listen to you because you're a man! But I completely agree! I love it when my husband does nice things for me - and I love doing nice things for him, too. I love it when he makes me feel special and I love making him feel special. When you stop thinking about "ME ME ME" all the time and "WHAT ARE YOU GOING TO DO FOR ME?" - you find out that doing things for others can be it's own reward - and often leads to others doing things for you.
Indeed. As I said earlier, this is a multiple lane two way, street. I waste zero chance to show my lady how precious she is to me, and what I get in return is more precious than a mountain of platinum. Can't put a value on it. When I move to the outside of her on the street, and she reaches out and holds my hand, I feel like I'm bathing in lava. Its the little things.
I know g$&damn well what I believe, thanks very much. I'm studying for a masters degree. Talk about effort and delayed gratification now eh.
LikeI said. All I can go by are the posts you make.
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for you so you have to make your own way without any expectancy of help.
.....desperate and thirsty , you say? Well, I was brought up on this etiquette, and still believe in it, strongly. My Mom taught me as much about it as my Dad, as well. My lady gets treated thisaway. And then some. I'd stand in front of a bullet for her, without even having to think about it. 
