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The "insta wife" or "instra girlfriend" is something I've noticed with dating too. Basically, it's the men who are quick to name you their girlfriend or start talking marriage (even before you know their last name!) It's kind of crazy and counter-intuitive to what you think of when you think of men and commitment (the cliche being the women want to rush to the alter and the men are wary of commitment). It happens a lot with men who were married and now divorced. At least, they are the ones I noticed who seem to think this way. Also, it's almost ALL of the men I've met though things like OLD, speed dating, singles events, etc.
For me, that's been the hardest obstacle with men to get around and I have yet to meet a man who was interested in me and just dating to get to know each other. A man who wasn't interested in something committed (for the sake of being committed) within the first month of meeting him.
Then we have to relax our criteria. At some point, so many criteria have been foregone, that the resulting prospects become unappealing. Just before that, is the equilibrium point at which relationships form.
Agreed. Validation is actually MORE important than sex, or a domestic servant, or arm-candy at social functions, or any other menial role to which women might get relegated by chauvinistic men. Validation is ultimately the entire point of a relationship. It isn't so much that person XYZ feels sexually frustrated or lonely. Rather, he lacks validation. And I say "he", because women are generally more adroit at providing validation for each other. Men instead derive their validation from their girlfriends and wives.
I'm not necessarily condoning this behavior, or regarding it as "boys will be boys". No, I'm not doing that... but history essentially is! It's no outlandish claim, by my reckoning, that until comparatively recently, a woman's traditional role was to "validate" her husband. A husband (or a bachelor) could hire a maid, a cook or possibly even a prostitute. But only a wife could provide validation. This was her indispensable role, especially for older men, who were done fighting the career-fight.
If modern women are looking for men who can already validate themselves, but men remain stuck in a mindset that their prospective girlfriend should validate them, then we have an impasse with modern dating!
Good post, ohio. I always enjoy what you have to say.
But, you know, it's not only men who need validation. Everyone does. My point is that MY purpose, as a woman, in being on date #1, or #2, or perhaps #3, is NOT to provide Man X with validation so that he can feel better about himself.
I'd like to think that, as adults, we are both there to simply have respectful dialogue to hopefully get to know each other. That's all.
My point is simply: If the first few dates, you are getting "bad matches or bad men", then perhaps it is their problem...or bad luck, or what-have-you.
But if after the tenth or twentieth date, you are still getting "bad matches or bad men", then perhaps it is time to take a hard look in the mirror?
While I think the person can dating can be part of the issue (I've admitted this myself/asked "what am I doing to find these guys?"). I also have to wonder if the venue in which we find people is part of the issue as well. In the past three years, I've dated a lot of men. Most want a serious commitment or marriage (that's my biggest deal breaker) and ALL of the ones I've met though dating "products" want this deal breaker. By dating products I mean online dating, speed dating, singles events, etc.
Of all the men I dated in the past three years, one didn't want marriage and such. He was also the one I dated the longest. We dated for about nine months and it was great. He broke it off with me though because (he said) of distance and his age (he was over 12 years older than me). Honestly, he's fallen for another women closer to him (both in distance and age). We are still great friends though and I still see him and we do things together. We just don't date or sleep together anymore. But key here, he didn't want the deal breaker for me and I didn't meet him though these dating products.
I really think I need to meet more men like I met him, but the problem is, men over 40 are mostly married. So it's hard to find the dingle ones "out in the wild." It's easier to find them though dating products, but the type I am looking for (the type who wants to date, have fun, and not settle down... at least not have an agenda for it) just don't seem to be there or if they are, they are buried.
But that's just it. Very often, the men giving women attention are NOT attractive. And the minority that are attractive sometimes have other issues that undermine their attractiveness.
It is VERY difficult to find an attractive, reasonably fit, intelligent, stable, emotionally available man over 40 who's a good conversationalist, possesses some humility (isn't a complete narcissist), and who's not looking for an insta-wife or insta-girlfriend. And who isn't carrying a ton of baggage (we all have some). And who's actually interested in someone besides himself.
I just had a conversation about this very thing with another CD poster, who's also a 40-something, attractive, fit woman. We've both tried online dating with little luck. I said that my experience has been that, no matter how eager they were to meet and go on dates (they often want too much, too fast), the men didn't seem to have any real interest in me as a person. They dominate the conversation, which is usually about them, and they have poor listening skills. The other CD poster said her experience has been identical to mine.
It seems that what some (many?) men want is simply any good-looking female to be with them and to sit and listen to everything they have to say. Who she is doesn't matter. No matter how much they claim to want a relationship, and, unfortunately, how much they want to want to rush things, all they really want isvalidation. Everything, really, is about them.
But I guess I should "stop moaning" and consider myself lucky?
* Now would be a good time for me to stress that I know there are women like this, too, but women aren't my thing.
Agree with all of this. I wasn't the one who spoke to NewDixieGirl about this but it was my experience with online. I either seemed to attract men who wanted to date/marry anyone, men who had so much baggage (even though I am 43 I have little baggage), very unattractive men who were nasty people on top of it (they weren't nasty because of their looks, they were nasty and happened to be unattractive). Many others seemed to be interviewing for a maid as they asked about my cooking and cleaning. Many more were looking for a woman to support them (often they expected her to support him and cook and clean).
The 40 year old attractive, good career, no baggage, good conversationalist, sensitive yet outgoing, mysterious yet fun guy isn't anywhere found because he is busy with the 25 year old gal?
And what you have leftover on POF are the guys who are NOT the above.
Where did I say "no" baggage? Where did I say anything about a good career? Once again, you assume a lot.
Anyone over the age of, say, 25 has baggage. I accept that, and as I always say, we're all walking wounded, And, as jilla says, I WANT a man who's lived some of the ups and downs of life. I wouldn't have anything in common with a guy who hasn't endured any kind of hardship.
But I don't want to date a man who's got a ton of baggage because of one bad decision after another that he's made (ie. multiple marriages).
Yes, you perceive your sexual market value higher than it actually is, while ignoring men who would likely be compatible dating prospects. Don't worry, you aren't alone. There are millions and millions of ladies with this exact problem. hope this helps.
And there are many of men who have high standards too, like the unattractive middle aged man with an average career who thinks he can attract a 20 year old because of this warped view that younger women are attracted to him. I used to have a profile on a religious site and the amount of these delusional men never failed to amuse me.
Where did I say "no" baggage? Where did I say anything about a good career? Once again, you assume a lot.
Anyone over the age of, say, 25 has baggage. I accept that, and as I always say, we're all walking wounded, And, as jilla says, I WANT a man who's lived some of the ups and downs of life. I wouldn't have anything in common with a guy who hasn't endured any kind of hardship.
But I don't want to date a man who's got a ton of baggage because of one bad decision after another that he's made (ie. multiple marriages).
Jillabean asked: Hey! If it is so easy to get hottie 25 year old, then why are so many men on POF messaging me??
I replied: Perhaps it is because that the guys who can attract hottie 25 year old are out there attracting hottie 25 year old, and the guys who are leftover are on POF messaging people.
Hence people seem to get many "unqualified guys". The "qualified guys" are busy with 25 year olds or in relationships perhaps?
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