Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
You don't seem to grasp what I'm saying, do you? If it's your opinion, or my opinion, or anyone's opinion, then how is it authoritative? Maybe I think it's GOOD to harm someone else. Should YOU accept my opinion because I declare it to be good?
You keep looking for authoritative. What does that mean? I suspect that the only answer you will accept as authoritative is god.
Sorry, that is silly. God doesn't exist, nor is god a good moral figure. We established that several pages ago.
Utilitarian morality is a practical system because it works. It functions pretty well. It is not perfect, nor does it need to be perfect. It is a good moral system because we understand it (unless you are a particularly obtuse Christian). It is based upon a common human understanding. That is it. There is no more. It is not objective, nor does it flow from a divine being.
The story of Abraham and Issac is a perfect example of how the measure of morals will fail us.
Morals are only the surface of the ocean. if you dive to the depths there will be monsters that Only God can fish out. You must go deeper to the Spiritual matter. Principle.
God saw something in Abraham's heart that needed to be addressed. If it was not, Abraham would of passed it down to Issac. What God saw in Abraham's heart was fear and doubt. But still faith. Abraham learned a hard lesson. A lesson that would not be forgotten for many generations. Because along with this lesson God gave him the covenant of circumcision. And this was to be performed on the eighth Day. The eighth Day is the significant Day of resurrection.
Sorry, I'm quite confident that your black and white system would quickly meet gray areas. For one thing, define "harm". Only causing physical pain? In that case, it would be immoral to spank your children. Does it include emotional distress? In that case, it would be immoral to stop your child from doing something they wanted.
Then you have conflicts of two harms. Abortion is harmful. You are ending a life and causing the mother emotional distress vs the harm of denying a woman the freedom to choose. Hey let's bring back prohibition since alcohol is quite harmful as well.
Harm is many things, and you well know it. It is a mix of physical, emotional, mental, and financial. It is a mixture of short and long term, major and minor. Harm to one person may be balanced by a gain to others.
We will make mistakes when trying to make decisions, either because we weight things differently, are poor judges of consequence, or.are not fully informed of the consequences.
So what? It is an imperfect morality, but better than any arbitrary list of rules in the bible. Particularly when those rules support slavery and discrimination.
You keep looking for authoritative. What does that mean? I suspect that the only answer you will accept as authoritative is god.
Sorry, that is silly. God doesn't exist, nor is god a good moral figure. We established that several pages ago.
Utilitarian morality is a practical system because it works. It functions pretty well. It is not perfect, nor does it need to be perfect. It is a good moral system because we understand it (unless you are a particularly obtuse Christian). It is based upon a common human understanding. That is it. There is no more. It is not objective, nor does it flow from a divine being.
Yep.
But some truths escape certain folk.
ETA: Fine series of posts fishbrains. Too soon to rep.
The story of Abraham and Issac is a perfect example of how the measure of morals will fail us.
Morals are only the surface of the ocean. if you dive to the depths there will be monsters that Only God can fish out. You must go deeper to the Spiritual matter. Principle.
God saw something in Abraham's heart that needed to be addressed. If it was not, Abraham would of passed it down to Issac. What God saw in Abraham's heart was fear and doubt. But still faith. Abraham learned a hard lesson. A lesson that would not be forgotten for many generations. Because along with this lesson God gave him the covenant of circumcision. And this was to be performed on the eighth Day. The eighth Day is the significant Day of resurrection.
This story is a perfect example of biblical morals being rather depraved. Do insane, sadistic things because an authoritarian figure tells you to do it, regardless of common sense or any positive human emotion.
God never Objectified us he created us out of love. And love submits to love.
Slavery still exist. It just has another name. Currency.
God tells us to love our neighbors. But yet we still have a world that measures the value and worth of his neighbors based on how God created them. The problem lies in the justification of an action. Regardless of someones faith i will love them If I see them harming someone or themselves I will intervene. If I am judged by man so be it. But I know that my father in Heaven judges righteously.
I speak openly with my heart on my sleeve.
For example. I ran into a dispute at work concerning a superior. This superior spoke in the hearsay manner. Telling me fellow employees said i said. When I asked her to speak with us all together she avoided the request. This gave away her spirit. She was trying to cause strife. Wittingly or not I aired it out. When the Holy Spirit is with you a light shines forth.
...snip...
For example. I ran into a dispute at work concerning a superior. This superior spoke in the hearsay manner. Telling me fellow employees said i said. When I asked her to speak with us all together she avoided the request. This gave away her spirit. She was trying to cause strife. Wittingly or not I aired it out. When the Holy Spirit is with you a light shines forth.
Your interpretation of her reluctance may be correct.
Or, perhaps she felt a higher calling to respect the confidentiality of those who had a problem with you.
Your interpretation of her reluctance may be correct.
Or, perhaps she felt a higher calling to respect the confidentiality of those who had a problem with you.
Sorry I did not finish the story.
I went above her head. Prayed. Two days later we all convened and when confronted she danced around the subject. Said don't listen to me when I am angry. But she wasn't alone one of the other coworkers had lied in a way to cover herself. And the superior compounded the lie to where it was. The question is what motivated them to do this. The other fellow involved was oblivious to the entire thing. Multiple witnesses. Two against two.
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.
Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
