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Anybody is nice enough until they expect to have some influence on the other person. Regarding the bolded, I have an acquaintance who calls himself a Christian who dislikes religion more than any person I have taken notice of in this subforum. The dislike was deeper than I could have imagined. He tells me one day he will explain things to me, but I think he knows I will challenge him.
I want to clarify that the difficulty in engaging lies with atheists who are under this tension of justifying an untenable position. I am not in anyway dismissing your experience, but i think it sort of proves the point.
I want to clarify that the difficulty in engaging lies with atheists who are under this tension of justifying an untenable position. I am not in anyway dismissing your experience, but i think it sort of proves the point.
So that would be the "bad" side of atheism. Sounds like pretty much most positions that don't allow a middle ground.
I want to clarify that the difficulty in engaging lies with atheists who are under this tension of justifying an untenable position. I am not in anyway dismissing your experience, but i think it sort of proves the point.
Untenable is just another assertion of yours. We have all the evidence, observed natural forces creating complexity with no requirement of an intelligence that the religious only ever assert exists.
Actually an atheist, possibly other atheists as well, has boldly gone forth and lied on this forum about ‘the hard problem†of consciousness as being in the field of philosophy and NOT science. Why would they do that? It could just be just that they do not understand Science, their deity. There is no shame in that, but you cannot make stuff up.
He did not lie, he made a mistake. You, however, should practice what you preach.
And Science (with an unexplained capital 'S'), our deity, seriously, that epic fail ad hominem?
Quote:
Originally Posted by cb2008
Atheism, a denial of non-existence, is an unstable position to hold. If one does not believe in divinity all one needs to do is stop and get on with life. Why is this need to name it and then having to be in this negative position all the time? This must cause terrible tension. I have to rethink my position and declare this fundamental problem of Atheism is the bad and ugly.
We are in a positive position with the negative belief you have once again dishonestly straw manned, because you (plural) can not even decide which of your (plural) many different religions is actually the correct one. Atheism, however, is based on what we do know.
I am not sure trust is the issue here and what trust has to do with numbers. I know a few among the few in real life. They are nice enough until they start talking about their non-belief. And i know the way atheists here in the forum engage, and that is a whole new window on atheism. My opinion about atheism is based on the fundamental lack of logic in its stance and my conclusion that this is the cause of the difficulty in engaging with then in discussions of religion and spirituality.
Shall I post my link again for you to avoid? Because your constant tin can rattling ad hominems makes it seem you can not honestly engage with the actual arguments.
And perhaps the difficulty in engaging is your problem, not ours.
I was raised to always judge a person by what they are doing. List what they have done for the last month. Have them list what they have done for the last month. Compare notes.
A pipe dream, to be sure, but it has meaning. Can you imagine being totally honest what that would do?
Yeah, I was lucky. My theist parents said God doesn't care what you believe. Basically they said they don't really know but treat people they people should be treated. That's good enough.
Most atheist understand that to believe in some thing more just matches observations far better. Far less would deploy political tactic's to hide that in favor of a war.
Well, at least the atheist I know. Once we clarify "Yeah, we all see religious as dangerous sometimes and there aint no deity, lets talk about beliefs.". It goes rather quickly.
Do you know how it sounds when atheist say "Yeah, but we need to be careful how we speak because of religion." in public? I mean like, in some many circles, if we nod our heads, we are culpable.
He did not lie, he made a mistake. You, however, should practice what you preach.
And Science (with an unexplained capital 'S'), our deity, seriously, that epic fail ad hominem?
We are in a positive position with the negative belief you have once again dishonestly straw manned, because you (plural) can not even decide which of your (plural) many different religions is actually the correct one. Atheism, however, is based on what we do know.
All you have is a Non/Dis/Lack of Belief, basically, nuthin' position.
Atheism is really more of a "condition" than anything else (like blindness)...it is really just indicative of a deficiency in the common & normal ability to perceive God.
Because, if you could (like most people)...you wouldn't be Atheist.
It compels you to lash out against those with the standard Theist abilities.
You have my sympathy about this...and I will pray for you.
Atheism, a denial of non-existence, is an unstable position to hold. If one does not believe in divinity all one needs to do is stop and get on with life. Why is this need to name it and then having to be in this negative position all the time? This must cause terrible tension. I have to rethink my position and declare this fundamental problem of Atheism is the bad and ugly.
I think we need to be clear here. Most atheist will believe in some thing more. it will have many ways of presentation, but its always some thing more. Then we can apply a sliding scale of reliability to them.
It just fits observations better.
Yes, the loud barrel atheist here have to avoid that (investing what beliefs match observation) like they avoid religion, for obvious reasons. "It doesn't get them anywhere[politically that is].
They feel it hurts "moving the needle". Its basically blind faith.
That's why we see these atheist strictly enforcing the belief in "no deity type god only". "No god or gods of any type", well, that fails as fast as my-god-only. Its also looking very religious when a group of them form a pack.
All you have is a Non/Dis/Lack of Belief, basically, nuthin' position.
Atheism is really more of a "condition" than anything else (like blindness)...it is really just indicative of a deficiency in the common & normal ability to perceive God.
Because, if you could (like most people)...you wouldn't be Atheist.
It compels you to lash out against those with the standard Theist abilities.
You have my sympathy about this...and I will pray for you.
lol, we differed again.
Like all people with willful blind faith.
They hurt far to many people
when allowed to run around
unsupervised.
I can't pray for them.
They will not sit by and logically think this threw.
I have to prepare for them.
Like all people with willful blind faith.
They hurt far to many people
when allowed to run around
unsupervised.
I can't pray for them.
They will not sit by and logically think this threw.
I have to prepare for them.
You actually understand Theist Beliefs...at the root.
Your recognition that we observe "something more" is actually very similar to God perception...you just don't assign that appellative to it (and not because you have a severe allergy to the term "God"), though that doesn't skew your observations.
If you did perceive "something more" as God to you...you wouldn't be Atheist.
You also don't suffer from the compulsion to bust on those who do have that perception.
***What Belief comports with observations, and provides a mechanism to make predictions off of?***
There is no better standard than that.
Please never stop putting that forth.
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