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\Would you really want to KNOW God? I'm not just saying "know" as in "see" or "pray" too, but on a Human level, would you want to know him and understand him 100%? I would NOT want to KNOW God, because if I knew and understood everything about God, then that would make me just as knowledgeable, if not more, than Himself. So, who are we as humans to question or try to understand a great power. The Bible was written for us to understand how we've came about - it was not written for people to disbelieve or try and disprove the existence of God like we have since the start of times. If we understand the greater power, He is no longer the greater power since we've figured him out.
\Would you really want to KNOW God? I'm not just saying "know" as in "see" or "pray" too, but on a Human level, would you want to know him and understand him 100%? I would NOT want to KNOW God, because if I knew and understood everything about God, then that would make me just as knowledgeable, if not more, than Himself. So, who are we as humans to question or try to understand a great power. The Bible was written for us to understand how we've came about - it was not written for people to disbelieve or try and disprove the existence of God like we have since the start of times. If we understand the greater power, He is no longer the greater power since we've figured him out.
Is this satire? You are suggesting that it is better to not try to understand things. I guess ignorance is bliss for you.
Is this satire? You are suggesting that it is better to not try to understand things. I guess ignorance is bliss for you.
Ignorance also helps to easily disprove the so-called scientific theories like big bang, evolution, etc. Our 6000 years of existence should have taught us that by now.
"Oh come on now, rifleman! Don't be such a skeptic!"
Quote:
Originally Posted by slashsdfz
As I look around these forums, I can't help but notice people pleading for evidence of God's existence. God does not NEED to prove himself. Someone please show me, in the Bible, where it says GOD MUST PROVE HIMSELF. He does not need to. Why SHOULD God prove himself? Even if He DID, the disbelievers would still be...disbelievers - just like those that don't believe we landed on the moon to THIS DATE, they wouldn't believe in God if he appeared before them.
As far as I am concerned, look at your hands, feet, your child. Look at the trees, the sky, the sunset. Drink water, breathe air. That is good enough proof to me that we were created on a planet that we can live on. However, God needs no REASON to prove Himself to anyone. It is your choice to find Him, not for Him to find you.
You're quite right. God doesn't need to prove anything, unless he or his acolytes wish for many to follow him. I'm curious, why does God care if we follow his teachings? We're told by Christians that we are insignificant without God, that he "defines" us. Also, the point of so many of these posts is to argue for the existance of God, so yes, we do need some sort of reasonable evidence.
Hmmm...
I've seen too much evidence, including some of my own biological and geological research, that absolutely refutes the claims of Christianity. What does one (who used to be a Christian) then conclude when faced with such irrefutible evidence? That perhaps the research is wrong?
Fine. We'll do it again. And again, from a different perspective. A hundred times, all with the same concrete results. Then, other skeptical scientists re-do the work, because science allows, even encourages, peer-review and reproducable results. What do we see when this happens? What proof do we gain? Concurrence.
Other results in other critical areas of investigation, from other independant researchers all over the world, come piling in. All refuting such ancient and fabled siiliness as wooden Arks surviving global floods to the height of Mt. Everest; the YEC-claimed 6035 yr-old age of the earth; the planets and the sun orbiting around a flat Earth, and a non-Evolutionary source for the over 30 million different species of plants and animals known, to date, on this earth.
Why does God need to prove himself, indeed? Only if he wishes to have any credibility. Since he hasn't ever shown himself, I can only conclude that he either really doesn't care about his flock, or....
...he doesn't really exist at all. Which would be the logical default position, given the growing massive pile of evidence to that conclusion. Not to mention the hundreds of "gods" that have been postulated over the history of humanity and culturre. Why pick this particular one as the one?
So, no. He doesn't need to prove himself. Just don't expect us rational, curious, questioning and skeptical observers, with the rigorous and proven methods of scientific questioning and conclusions, to buy into the idea that everything we do, as regards religion, is bogus, but when we work to design a better airplane, SUV, hybrid car, Mars Rover & Lander, HDTV, MRI machine, satellite, smart cell phone, Internet, nuclear submarine or laptop computer, suddenly science is valid, with obvious and proven successes.
Now that would be downright illogical, not to mention silly!
Last edited by rifleman; 04-14-2009 at 07:15 PM..
Reason: typos
Is this satire? You are suggesting that it is better to not try to understand things. I guess ignorance is bliss for you.
Can you quote, word for word, where I said I am suggesting not to understand things? I'm waiting..nope, you won't find that, my friend.
God has given us the Bible to READ it and UNDERSTAND it. The Bible, has been tested time and time and time AND time again. It is the most tested Book..wait..most tested THING that has ever been on THIS earth. You would think if the Bible was written by a drunken man, we would have figured this out YEARS ago, right? Wait, I'm sorry, John the apostle was drunk, therefore the Bible is wrong. Right? I've heard that plenty of times.
What I am suggesting is who are we to question our creator? We are here for a purpose whether you like it or not. That's all I need to know. I know my purpose in life and why I'm here. Do you?
You won't like this, but - no, we did not form from ooze. No, we did not form from monkeys. No, "nothing" did not one day appear and POOF, humans, birds, dinosaurs grew. Did you know the Bible mentions dinosaurs PLENTY of times?
Can you quote, word for word, where I said I am suggesting not to understand things? I'm waiting..nope, you won't find that, my friend.
God has given us the Bible to READ it and UNDERSTAND it. The Bible, has been tested time and time and time AND time again. It is the most tested Book..wait..most tested THING that has ever been on THIS earth. You would think if the Bible was written by a drunken man, we would have figured this out YEARS ago, right? Wait, I'm sorry, John the apostle was drunk, therefore the Bible is wrong. Right? I've heard that plenty of times.
What I am suggesting is who are we to question our creator? We are here for a purpose whether you like it or not. That's all I need to know. I know my purpose in life and why I'm here. Do you?
You won't like this, but - no, we did not form from ooze. No, we did not form from monkeys. No, "nothing" did not one day appear and POOF, humans, birds, dinosaurs grew. Did you know the Bible mentions dinosaurs PLENTY of times?
I am just going to say this -- we are on different wavelengths. I mean that in the most ambiguously pejorative way possible.
You're quite right. God doesn't need to prove anything, unless he or his acolytes wish for many to follow him. I'm curious, why does God care if we follow his teachings? We're told by Christians that we are insignificant without God, that he "defines" us. Also, the point of so many of these posts is to argue for the existance of God, so yes, we do need some sort of reasonable evidence.
Hmmm...
I've seen too much evidence, including some of my own biological and geological research, that absolutely refutes the claims of Christianity. What does one (who used to be a Christian) then conclude when faced with such irrefutible evidence? That perhaps the research is wrong?
Fine. We'll do it again. And again, from a different perspective. A hundred times, all with the same concrete results. Then, other skeptical scientists re-do the work, because science allows, even encourages, peer-review and reproducable results. What do we see when this happens? What proof do we gain? Concurrence.
Other results in other critical areas of investigation, from other independant researchers all over the world, come piling in. All refuting such ancient and fabled siiliness as wooden Arks surviving global floods to the height of Mt. Everest; the YEC-claimed 6035 yr-old age of the earth; the planets and the sun orbiting around a flat Earth, and a non-Evolutionary source for the over 30 million different species of plants and animals known, to date, on this earth.
Why does God need to prove himself, indeed? Only if he wishes to have any credibility. Since he hasn't ever shown himself, I can only conclude that he either really doesn't care about his flock, or....
...he doesn't really exist at all. Which would be the logical default position, given the growing massive pile of evidence to that conclusion. Not to mention the hundreds of "gods" that have been postulated over the history of humanity and culturre. Why pick this particular one as the one?
So, no. He doesn't need to prove himself. Just don't expect us rational, curious, questioning and skeptical observers, with the rigorous and proven methods of scientific questioning and conclusions, to buy into the idea that everything we do, as regards religion, is bogus, but when we work to design a better airplane, SUV, hybrid car, Mars Rover & Lander, HDTV, MRI machine, satellite, smart cell phone, Internet, nuclear submarine or laptop computer, suddenly science is valid, with obvious and proven successes.
Now that would be downright illogical, not to mention silly!
So, considering the better airplane, SUV, hybrid car, Mars Rover & Lander, HDTV, MRI machine, satellite, smart cell phone, Internet, nuclear submarine or laptop computer has it ever entered your mind those wonderful inventions didn't EVOLVE on their own? I think you get my point....
So, considering the better airplane, SUV, hybrid car, Mars Rover & Lander, HDTV, MRI machine, satellite, smart cell phone, Internet, nuclear submarine or laptop computer has it ever entered your mind those wonderful inventions didn't EVOLVE on their own? I think you get my point....
You do realize that humans had to evolve in order to invent all those things don't you?
As I look around these forums, I can't help but notice people pleading for evidence of God's existence. God does not NEED to prove himself. Someone please show me, in the Bible, where it says GOD MUST PROVE HIMSELF. He does not need to. Why SHOULD God prove himself? Even if He DID, the disbelievers would still be...disbelievers - just like those that don't believe we landed on the moon to THIS DATE, they wouldn't believe in God if he appeared before them.
As far as I am concerned, look at your hands, feet, your child. Look at the trees, the sky, the sunset. Drink water, breathe air. That is good enough proof to me that we were created on a planet that we can live on. However, God needs no REASON to prove Himself to anyone. It is your choice to find Him, not for Him to find you.
I agree totally with you that God does not have to prove Himself to His creation. Who are we who are created by God, to question Him? God does not have to give us signs and wonders. I use to ask God show me this or show me that, but that was out of ignorance and I reevaluated my relationship with God.
I stopped asking God to show me things and started focusing my attention on Him. Then after I stopped asking God for signs and wonders, God begin to just show me things and show His love to me out of His love.
So, I believe that God will show you things not to prove Himself to you, but will interact with His children out of love. Then you want have to ask God for a sign, because He will interact with His children, even when you don't ask. That is the beauty of having a relationship with your Father. He will just show His love to you, when you allow yourself to see God as He is, and stop asking for things that God will just want to do out of love.
As I look around these forums, I can't help but notice people pleading for evidence of God's existence. God does not NEED to prove himself. Someone please show me, in the Bible, where it says GOD MUST PROVE HIMSELF. He does not need to. Why SHOULD God prove himself? Even if He DID, the disbelievers would still be...disbelievers - just like those that don't believe we landed on the moon to THIS DATE, they wouldn't believe in God if he appeared before them.
As far as I am concerned, look at your hands, feet, your child. Look at the trees, the sky, the sunset. Drink water, breathe air. That is good enough proof to me that we were created on a planet that we can live on. However, God needs no REASON to prove Himself to anyone. It is your choice to find Him, not for Him to find you.
Some of the most flawed logic in the history of this forum.
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Ignorance also helps to easily disprove the so-called scientific theories like big bang, evolution, etc. Our 6000 years of existence should have taught us that by now.
"Oh come on now, rifleman! Don't be such a skeptic!"
Which would be the logical default position, given the growing massive pile of evidence to that conclusion. Not to mention the hundreds of "gods" that have been postulated over the history of humanity and culturre. Why pick this particular one as the one?
but when we work to design a better airplane, SUV, hybrid car, Mars Rover & Lander, HDTV, MRI machine, satellite, smart cell phone, Internet, nuclear submarine or laptop computer, suddenly science is valid, with obvious and proven successes. 
