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This question is directed towards Christians but other folks can offer their input. Does Jesus make the laws of the old testament obsolete, or are Christians still required to try to follow the laws?
Here's a post I made on another thread regarding the same thing you bring up here. Read through it and if it leads you to another question or you need further clarification, just ask. It specifically addressed slavery, but the issue of the Old Testament Law is addressed. See what you think!
GREAT QUESTION!!
Quote:
Originally Posted by Alpha8207
I've been soooo reluctant to even post here again. But this slavery thing just kills me. It's so typical to find one thing, try and dance on it, and when the music changes, you'll pick something else.
Every example of the slavery issue you use is from the Old Testament, the Law, EXCEPT those of you knowledgeable about the teachings on slavery in the New Testament which I don't really see the correlation. Yes there are teachings on slavery in the New Testament but in EVERY case except one, the directive is that the believer is the slave, not the slave owner. So what is your point?? The New Testament teaches me that if I am under authority, I should treat that person a certain way. I AM THE SLAVE IN THESE EXAMPLES!!! That exception I mention is in Ephesians and it's where there are instructions for believing slaves and believing owners and it basically says "Look, we're all under Christ, so we're all under His authority, the cross leveled the field for us all." Is it Galatians that tells that there's no difference between slave and free under Christ? I can't help but think that it was rare for a believer to have a slave, there is, after all, only one example that I know of.
Now I'm trying to keep this short because I really don't think anyone reads the long ones. But let me close by addressing the Old/New stance I take. Let me say, for those that don't understand, CHRIST CHANGED EVERYTHING!! Now those hard lined legalists will say "No, He said he didn't come to change the law but to fulfill it." OK, if I make you a promise and then I 'fulfill' the promise, what condition is the promise now? And, in fact, the same Bible that holds that verse holds this one, "Christ is the end of the law " Romans 10:4, so don't bring me legalism and also, don't bring me free license, but that's another thread, I'm sure.
So, if you want to argue a Christian stance on slavery, please argue it in the light of Christ. I'm not saying the Old Testament doesn't have a place in Christianity, I'm just saying that the Old Testament, particularly when you look at law which is what you ALL are doing, you must look at it through Christ. Otherwise, it's like me saying you condone slavery because you're American and at one time those same types of laws were on our very own books.
When the law was ENDED (Read:Christ) the law was put away. Doesn't that make sense? And I'm not really asking that question to Christians. I'm not asking that you accept the validity of Christ or God or anything else, I'm just saying that IF that's true, does that help with this whole slavery thing?
<CD MEMBER names omitted as irrelevant>, I respect all of your opinions and regard you as obviously knowledgeable folks. I post solely for your consideration.
In Matthew 22, Jesus, being questioned as to which was the greatest commandment, the lawyer said: "Teacher, which is the great commandment in the law?"
Jesus answered, "You shall love the Lord you God with all your heart, with all your soul, and with all your mind. This is the first and great commandment. And the second is like it: You shall love your neighbor as yourself. On these two commandments hang all the Law and the Prophets."
I think Jesus answered the question of which laws we are to follow. As far as the other 600+ laws given to the Hebrews, I don't think God intends for us to follow those. Jesus became the sacrifice...he did fulfill those laws (works). And by his sacrifice, we now have God's grace!
(Ephesians 2:8-9: "For by grace you have been saved through faith, and that not of yourselves; it is the gift of God, not of works, lest anyone should boast.")
In Matthew 22, Jesus, being questioned as to which was the greatest commandment, the lawyer said: "Teacher, which is the great commandment in the law?"
Jesus answered, "You shall love the Lord you God with all your heart, with all your soul, and with all your mind. This is the first and great commandment. And the second is like it: You shall love your neighbor as yourself. On these two commandments hang all the Law and the Prophets."
I think Jesus answered the question of which laws we are to follow. As far as the other 600+ laws given to the Hebrews, I don't think God intends for us to follow those. Jesus became the sacrifice...he did fulfill those laws (works). And by his sacrifice, we now have God's grace!
(Ephesians 2:8-9: "For by grace you have been saved through faith, and that not of yourselves; it is the gift of God, not of works, lest anyone should boast.")
Very well put! I wish they'd let me give ya more rep points, Nana!!
Thank you both for your replies. I understand better now. One can get confused when certain laws are followed to the T while others are completely ignored.
Thank you both for your replies. I understand better now. One can get confused when certain laws are followed to the T while others are completely ignored.
We Christians seem to currently be known more for what we're against rather than what we're for.
Invalidated the Old Testament is a bit harsh and certainly not what I intended to imply.
Also, homosexuality is addressed in the new testament as well as the old.(one place is in Romans 1...think it's around verse 24 or so)
but let's not get back into that.
I think Christians are very distracted by it and, as I said above, we currently are known more for what we don't embrace than what we do.
The OP was on the Old Testament Law, not on any specific aspect of it.
Actually I was thinking of homosexuality and fornication when I posted this topic. I know alot of Christians who condemn homosexuality but will fornicate or commit adultery. I believe all of these "sins" are mentioned in the NT but one is villified more than the others.
I know alot of Christians who condemn homosexuality but will fornicate or commit adultery. I believe all of these "sins" are mentioned in the NT but one is villified more than the others.
One is not villified in scripture more than the other. And I actually made a Christian pretty mad at lunch today. (I am a Christian as well.)
Man looks at various 'crimes' or 'sins' different. I don't think telling a stealing is as serious as murder. (crime) I also don't think a lie is as serious as adultery.(sin)
However, both are totally against the nature of God and he despises both equally, at least in what I glean from scripture. If you know Christians who condemn homosexuality and then commit adultery, it's all sexual sin in the eyes of God. And the same measure they use, will be used against them. That's the Truth.
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