Can Our Grown Children Become Our Worst Enemies? (adults, drug, husband)
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1} he left a pot of water on to boil an egg and went upstairs "to wait while it came to a boil"...HAd MOH NOT gone by for a visit at the time, and found the pot literally melting to the burner {scraping the electric burner did not help to get off the aluminium of the pan off the burner rendering it useless} there COULD have been a fire!
He needs a gadget to tell him the water is boiling, or to tell him a certain amount of time has passed since he turned it on to boil.
2} he had an accident, said he didn't "see the car" in front of him that he T-boned in broad daylight!
He should walk and/or take the bus.
3} he NEEDS the {external to the car} GPS to get ANYWHERE in town {he has lived here for 40+ years}. He NEEDS the GPS to GET HOME from being out in town, as he can't remember the way! He "assigns a spot a name" for the GPS to remember, then FORGETS what name he gave it to get back there. The Dr. has told him "no driving over 2 hours maximum!" IF it weren't for the GPS, he'd be lost every time!
He needs to work out a system of easy-to-remember names.
4} He had to go to a local hospital. He could NOT remember the name of the hospital, nor the street it was on, nor how to get there, {obviously}. Finally he found it on his GPS preset places, and went there.
So the problem was solved?
5} due to construction the updated GPS system took him into unfamiliar territory, he said "I had no idea where I was or how I'd get home". He CANNOT see to drive at night, but does it!!! Amazing he hasnt had a night accident! He thinks those night driving glasses' as seen on TV will keep him from accidents!
Driving is very dangerous. He should be made to understand that, and convinced not to go places by car, but to walk and/or take the bus or a taxi, or go with younger friends, instead of driving. Driving is dangerous for everyone, but hopefully someone his age would be wise enough to understand that.
6}He bought a brand new car instead of fixing his old one. remember it could have been his last car, but instead of repairing it, he bought new, thinking it was "cheaper than fixing the other one"??? {time MAY bear that out, but???}
How is that relevant to his problems? Maybe he was saving up for a new car, or it was his dream car or something.
7} He won't spend a penny on things like a/c and lets it get to about 80F in the house. He only keeps the heat on 72, why not the a/c to 72 instead of overheating?
I agree with him. I don't like A/C either. I get free A/C in my condo, but I turn it off unless it's hot. 80F is not hot unless it's humid.
8} he has plenty of money, but won't pay the phone bill to make calls, the cheap bill costs him $0.10 per call, but the bill is only $25/m. He uses a computer-VOIP system that SUCKS when he calls. He wants us to call him. several time a day. Like we have time.
He needs better friends. If they all died, he needs new ones. Hopefully some sturdy old folks who stay fresher longer than all you frantic young ones who will probably be dead by the time you're his age.
9} he figures since he is retired and has time, we should be able to drop everything to come "help" him, and that USUALLY does NOT mean ME, even if MOH isn't immediately available.
So tell him to dream on. He's probably used to it by now.
10} he bought a chain saw to cut some bushes, ON A LADDER, without supervison! Then CLIMBED part way up another tree to cut a branch off.DANGEROUS for a man who cannot get up off a chair without an aid of some sort!
Being unable to get off a chair is not really related to being dangerous on a ladder. Different muscles are involved. He probably needs a ladder tall enough that he can lean against it while working. But he needs a way to get the chain saw safely up the ladder, and have a place to put it down up there. It needs a safety switch so it can't start by mistake when being held by one hand. If he can't hold it with one hand, how does he get it up the ladder? He sounds to me like he's fairly sturdy for his age.
11] speaking of which, he comes over,and cannot get out of our couch without help as it has no close arms to use for aids.His knees won't let him.
It's not just knees. Getting up from being seated involves a lot of different muscles, some of which may not work as well as others. Leave a chair next to the sofa, so he can use that to get up, by holding the chair and using the arm muscles pushing downward on the chair to help lift.
12] He has lost a LOT of weight as he thinks Ramen Noodles are GREAT, and they are, of course CHEAP! And "easy to cook". IF he remembers he has the water on to boil!!!
It might help to use a microwave, as they shut off automatically when it's time for him to remember something's boiling.
13} MOSt things he does the cheap way..it shocked us when he bough the new car....
Maybe he was being cheap to save up for a new car.
14} he says MOH can "take anything you want in the house" but anything MOH does want to take, he says "no" to.
There is nothing unusual about that, and it has nothing to do with age.
15} I haven't been there in a while, but MOH says the kitchen is A MESS, leftover food on plates days/weeks old and he doesn't do the dishes until he has none to use, and he HAS A dishwasher! MOH doesn't have time usually when there to clean up after the old man.
The world is full of slobs. A lot more of them are young than old. He has a right to be a slob if he wants to be.
16} When he LOOSES something, he calls here to see if we have seen it, or know where he put it or where it went to?????? {Like we'd know???}
So just say you don't know where it is and haven't seen it. No problem.
17} he has a cat, apparently there is stale cat food dried on plates in every room???
Count your blessings. Some old people have 20 cats.
18} HE HAS TO GO OUT for SOMETHING 4 or 5 days a week..in the car...with the GPS to tell him how to get there and home again, he "gets bored" at home.
He needs to get in the habit of walking. It's good for his health in more ways than one. When he drives, it's bad for everyone's health.
19} he stays in his BR with the TV or the computer BR on the floor with the bath,so he has no need ot go anywhere, except to the kitchen to boil a forgotten egg or Ramen noodles. He has chair lifts on the stairs, but rarely leaves the BR floor. Unless going OUT.
What's a BR? I must be senile or something. I thought it meant bedroom, but you seem to be implying it might be a bathroom.
20} he can afford insurance, but goes to the VA and suffers apparently. Because it's cheap.
Insurance for a person that old can be a lot more expensive than most people think. And maybe he likes going to the VA, even if they don't always treat him well. Maybe he meets a lot of his old friends there.
21} he complains of being lonely, but won't go to the Sr center. He figures we {MOH REAlly] should visit every day {we may have to start} to keep him from being lonely.Part of the reason he goes out nearly everyday. With the GPS!
Can he walk to a mall? Lots of old people do that, to be with friends there and to have fun shopping there etc.
22] since his knees bother him, should he be driving?
He should be walking, because if he doesn't use his knees and legs enough, he might lose them.
23] twice recently he ran out of gas , we had to go running to help, as he FORGOT to fill the tank?
Or maybe he wanted to see if empty really meant empty. Or maybe he knew he had a certain number of miles after it said empty, but lost track of how many miles he went. Young people have been known to do that too sometimes.
24} he transfers money to different banks each month, convinced he will 'get a better deal' for his money. He has one bank near him he keeps, but must use the debit card and pay a $2.00 fee each time for 12 times a month to get any interest on his money. The interest he gets is far less than the $24 in fees he spends, but he thinks it is a great deal, ANOTHER reason he goes out nearly every day!
Actually, a lot of those Kasasa types of checking accounts reimburse the customer for the ATM fees. So this might be a misunderstanding on your part.
25} he now has everything he can paid by his credit card automatically so he wont "Forget to pay a bill", then he can't understand the credit card statement, and what is due to pay, so has MOH decipher it each month????
Maybe he needs better reading glasses to read the statement?
~~~Doesn't this sound like we should START thinking about involking the POA? That he is beginning to become incompetent? Like we should at least take away the keys now maybe???
Convince him to sell his car. Convince him he needs the exercise from walking, and that he will soon be too old to keep his car in good condition, and that he would be much better off selling it sooner.
~~~We really don't want to do it, because he will pester us daily for a ride somewhere. BUT maybe it is time!!!
Get him in the habit of walking. Every time he calls, ask if it's because he wants to be lazy and not walk when he should.
~~~Maybe we should take over his banking too?
No. He's a lot better with his money than most people are. That's why he has so much. He probably just needs good reading glasses, and to spend more time reading his statements.
~~~He's not quite ready for a home, but maybe getting there???
Assisted living maybe???
He has a home. He just needs some gadgets and stuff to help him manage.
Just some food for thought from the other side, as we could become the "evil enemy children" of which you speak!
Try as hard as you can not to become those evil enemy children.
best of luck to everyone as they age, may they remain healthy til the pass. WE WILL go through it ourselves!!!
I was thinking the same thing. If you think it is a good idea to try to fool people that you can still hear or see without any problems, that sounds like you are not thinking straight.
Sometimes, even with a hearing aid and eyeglasses, they might have problems. The hearing aid might not work very well, and the glasses might no longer be the right prescription. People tend to have a lot of inertia, and to put things off. It doesn't mean they're senile, because everyone is like that to some extent. Lots of young people put things off way too long. If an old person is planning to get a hearing aid, or a new hearing aid, or new eyeglasses, or anything like that, but puts it off, procrastinating a long time, it doesn't mean the person is senile, but just that they tend to procrastinate, just like millions of other people of all ages. But an older person might tend to procrastinate longer, because the amount of time that's passing doesn't seem like as much to an older person. They might have intended to get a new hearing aid 5 years ago, and not got around to it yet. Just like a lot of young people will procrastinate for six months, which may seem like the same amount of time to a young person that 5 years seems to an old person.
People should also be careful that none of their motives are from bigotry against old people or people with hearing, vision, or mobility problems. Sometimes it's not obvious when we're acting from bigotry we didn't even know we had. We convince ourselves we're doing what's right, while being blind to our own bigotry being the real motivation for what we're doing.
"19} he stays in his BR with the TV or the computer BR on the floor with the bath,so he has no need ot go anywhere, except to the kitchen to boil a forgotten egg or Ramen noodles. He has chair lifts on the stairs, but rarely leaves the BR floor. Unless going OUT."
The reason I misunderstood it was because I thought by "on the floor" you meant literally sitting on the floor instead of sitting in a chair. And from that misunderstanding, I misunderstood the rest of the paragraph. Such as, sitting on the floor with the bath seemed to imply sitting in the bathroom next to the bathtub or something like that. But what you really mean is that he spends time in two different bedrooms, one of which has a computer and the other of which has a TV.
So I sounded confused, just from a simple misunderstanding of something ambiguous. And that kind of confusion gets a lot of old people locked up and their assets seized.
Sometimes, even with a hearing aid and eyeglasses, they might have problems. The hearing aid might not work very well, and the glasses might no longer be the right prescription. People tend to have a lot of inertia, and to put things off. It doesn't mean they're senile, because everyone is like that to some extent. Lots of young people put things off way too long. If an old person is planning to get a hearing aid, or a new hearing aid, or new eyeglasses, or anything like that, but puts it off, procrastinating a long time, it doesn't mean the person is senile, but just that they tend to procrastinate, just like millions of other people of all ages. But an older person might tend to procrastinate longer, because the amount of time that's passing doesn't seem like as much to an older person. They might have intended to get a new hearing aid 5 years ago, and not got around to it yet. Just like a lot of young people will procrastinate for six months, which may seem like the same amount of time to a young person that 5 years seems to an old person.
Just my 2 cents: Regarding vision, I have glaucoma, have had the surgery, see an ophthalmologist regularly, use drops, etc. As much as I hate admitting this, I have to admit I have noticed some changes in my vision. I have not lost any peripheral vision (thank God), but my right eye tends to have low pressure which affects how I see things. So, eok, I totally agree with you regarding the vision changes that people can have happen and maybe not realize it because it comes on gradually, etc.
With the low pressure, I need to sleep with my head elevated and have not done that because I can't sleep that way (or so I thought). Last time I saw the doctor he said something that worried me a bit and I decided I needed to "grow up" about this and get used to sleeping with head elevated. So if some others out there who have glaucoma or some other eye disease and they are not totally obeying all the instructions the doctor has given them, they could become a problem while driving.
At the doc's, my mom was tasked with her knowledge of a clock face. I can't remember the exact questions though.
Mini-cog assessment for dementia:
They give the patient paper and a pencil and ask them to draw a clock face and the hands showing a specified time. Or as in my MIL's case, they ask them to dot in the 12, 3, 6, and 9 positions.
Also they tell the patient 3 unrelated words (example: watermelon, paper, moon) and ask the patient to repeat and try to remember them. Within a few minutes, after conversing with the patient on other topics, they ask them to repeat the words.
Even if told ahead time of time and given opportunities to "rehearse", cognitively impaired persons will not be able to accomplish these tasks, no matter how many chances given.
Last edited by biscuitmom; 08-16-2015 at 10:48 PM..
Sometimes, even with a hearing aid and eyeglasses, they might have problems. The hearing aid might not work very well, and the glasses might no longer be the right prescription. People tend to have a lot of inertia, and to put things off. It doesn't mean they're senile, because everyone is like that to some extent.
I have a congenital hearing loss and have worn 2 hearing aids for 30+ years, since I was in my 30s.
These days there's so much meaningless noise (talk and otherwise) in the world that I find it increasingly less important to wear them. If someone important to me has something to tell me, they know how to get my attention. I usually only wear both aids when I'm out in the woods or the desert, where I can listen to the sounds of nature.
If that means I'm senile, so be it.
Just to be clear, it was entirely a different matter when I was still working and my children were at home. Things are different now that I'm retired.
I usually only wear both aids when I'm out in the woods or the desert, where I can listen to the sounds of nature.
If that means I'm senile, so be it.
What kind of birds can you hear? You have to be senile to want to hear a mockingbird. Or maybe the doctor will ask you to listen to the mockingbird outside his window and tell him how many times it says watermelon, paper, moon.
YOU have NO understanding the situation, NOW DO YOU? YOU DO NOT KNOW us, {OR HIM} nOW DO YOU?
He lives a] on a very steep hill b] off a very busy highway road that is about impossible to cross with a car, let alone walking, c] NOT so near a bus route that he could walk to d] nowhere near a mall, in fact he avoids the mall route roads, which is about 5 miles form his house, NO he cannot walk the 5 miles on another very busy road, now can he?
That takes care of your first brazen suggestions.
~"He needs to work out a system of easy-to-remember names."
A: he can't remember our phone number let alone "easy names" for places. he has our number written by his phone. most of the time he can't remember MY name, after 15 years, I am "the other one" {to MOH} for him.
~"So the {hospital} problem was solved?"
A: barely being able to remember the who, what where of the HOSPITAL is now a VERY Dangerous thing for him. NOT remembering WHERE TO get help iS now DANGEROUS, if he cant remember our phone number or the hospital in an emergency, uh,,, well that should explain my point. Oh ,BTW, he can't remember what a "9-1-1" is!
~"Driving is very dangerous. He should be made to understand that, and convinced not to go places by car, but to walk and/or take the bus or a taxi, or go with younger friends, instead of driving. Driving is dangerous for everyone, but hopefully someone his age would be wise enough to understand that."
A:at least YOU SEEM to understand that.
~"How is that relevant to his problems? Maybe he was saving up for a new car, or it was his dream car or something."
A: hardly. the cheapest car he could find. He was too cheap to spend $600 to fix his car so he spends $18k on a new one? there is no rational to that. He wasn't saving for anything but his funeral.
~"I agree with him. I don't like A/C either. I get free A/C in my condo, but I turn it off unless it's hot. 80F is not hot unless it's humid."
A: JUST because YOU don't like a/c...he LIKES A/c he just won't pay for it! He gets "overheated" and gets dizzy in the heat. He uses a/c in the car {its too hot} He has the money, so that is not the issue. BY your rationale, maybe he shouldn't pay for HEAT {in the NE} either? he HATES the heat bill too.
~He always was a cheap Bas***d to my MIL too, he made her suffer over not spending a penny for her health care! He thought "He could do it cheaper" to take care of her. An agency he finally contacted for help was going to report him and have him arrested for elder abuse!!!! we talked the lady out of it,by reporting we'd keep a closer eye on them/him/herIs THAT 'sane"?
~"He needs better friends. If they all died, he needs new ones. Hopefully some sturdy old folks who stay fresher longer than all you frantic young ones who will probably be dead by the time you're his age"
You sound like a bitter old person yourself. YOU TELL HIM THAT< we have TRIED.We are nOT "frantic" in our mid to late fifties.
~"So tell him to dream on. He's probably used to it by now" {in answer to the fact he thinks he is retired we should have as much time as he does}.
A: YOU TELL HIM, see how far you get.
~"Being unable to get off a chair is not really related to being dangerous on a ladder. ...etc"
A:If one cannot get up off a chair or walk steady, one should NOT be on a ladder hanging out over bushes or trees with a live chainsaw. not without help. At SOME POINT one has to realize they can't do certain things anymore, he survived, but cut his leg with the saw.
~"It's not just knees. Getting up from being seated involves a lot of different muscles, some of which may not work as well as others. Leave a chair next to the sofa, so he can use that to get up, by holding the chair and using the arm muscles pushing downward on the chair to help lift."
A: There is a 30" high TABLE that works just as well, he won't use it.
~"It might help to use a microwave, as they shut off automatically when it's time for him to remember something's boiling.'
A: he has one, doesn't like it, won't use it except on occasion.
~"The world is full of slobs. A lot more of them are young than old. He has a right to be a slob if he wants to be."
A: slob is one thing, we are "clutters' ourselves, but UNSANITARY is NOT being a "slob". it's unhealthy and ONE THING they were going to report him for on elder abuse!!! If a professional agency has evaluated it WHO ARE YOU to evaluate what you haven't SEEN?
...
~"Insurance for a person that old can be a lot more expensive than most people think. And maybe he likes going to the VA, even if they don't always treat him well. Maybe he meets a lot of his old friends there.
A: i am disabled, I PAY for my insurance I am AWARE fully of the costs!! MOH has a HIGH COST/HIGH DEDUCTIBLE insurance< WE ARE FULLY AWARE OF THE COSTS! He has far more money than we do, he can afford it. again, he will sit by candle light instead of turning on a lamp, another fire hazzard i forgot to mention...especially when he falls asleep.
~"He should be walking, because if he doesn't use his knees and legs enough, he might lose them."
On that we can agree, but YOU TELL Him maybe if you are of his age, he will listen to you?
~"Actually, a lot of those Kasasa types of checking accounts reimburse the customer for the ATM fees. So this might be a misunderstanding on your part." AND ~"No. He's a lot better with his money than most people are. That's why he has so much. He probably just needs good reading glasses, and to spend more time reading his statements."
A; WE are the ones he calls to read/understand his banking/credit card statements. GUESS who is aware of what it what in them/about them????? OH FORGIVE mE, I forgot: YOU KNOW ALL ABOUT HIS BANKING/CREDIT business, now DON'T YoU? Huh sorry I FORGOT THAT!
~"Convince him to sell his car. Convince him he needs the exercise from walking, and that he will soon be too old to keep his car in good condition, and that he would be much better off selling it sooner."
A:ON that we agree, but he Just BOUGHT A NEW ONE, what do you think the chances are?
~"Try as hard as you can not to become those evil enemy children."
A; Maybe you've got some of your own you harbor resentment against?
MY father is 83, healthy, cheap- but reasonable, and lives far better off by himself than My FIL does. There is a BIG difference in the difference and the 4 years age difference between them. M father doesn't have such things as heart disease, stents, etc to worry about,My father can remember to take his meds, my FIL cannot!
so it is NOt that we are the "evil children"..we are facing reality! MAybe you Aren't?
and OBVIOUSLY you missed my closing statement:
I said "best of luck to everyone as they age, may they remain healthy til the pass. WE WILL go through it ourselves!!!"
I AM AWARE of that, though with MY health, i don't expect to get that old.
If you are worried about your kids, I'd get to know a worker at your local Area on Aging. That's a PA State agency that provides services to the elderly. But I'm sure every state has its equivalent. If the worker knows you are competent, they will advocate for you when needed. My mother is out of her mind from drug use in the 70's but I take care of her. I volunteered to go through the Area on Aging for help, because I want to do the right thing. They helped me find a senior center so I can work during the day without worrying about her. They also recommend adult daycare facilities, but those are more for lower functioning or physically incapacitated. Anyway, if you are fully functioning, I would call them myself. As to having someone take care of your money, I would do it myself for as long as possible. As a therapist, I had to work with a woman who worked with someone who was supposed to take care of the money and she ended up taking the woman's car. I told my client how important it was to report the woman and she did.
In Pennsylvania they also have payees. Agencies like Service Access & Management or Meca are fiduciaries who pay your bills for you, put some in savings and then give you the rest. There is a monthly fee though of about $20. Many of my clients with mental issues used this service, but this would be a great idea if you questions the motives of children as well. Besides this, they can help you set aside money for funeral expenses. We only go through a fiduciary for the Veteran's money as they owed my mom a lump sum of back money and this set my mind at ease. I just call and tell them what my mom needs the money for and they yah or nay the request. They only refused to pay for her husband's funeral to date. And the rationale was that she is living and needs the money herself. Which makes sense.
Anyway, it's also important to set the terms out at the get go, if you have to go through a relative. For example, my mother gets Social Security and Veterans' which go for the bills, groceries and entertainment, but she also gets an inheritance and that is 100% hers to spend on whatever she wants. If ever she runs out of the that money during the month though, I supplement her anyway from my own money or from Social Security money, as she is elderly and should have fun.
The rules can be changed if you both consent and if it is in your best interest. For example, eating out used to come out of her inheritance money, but I started to take it out of the SS, Veteran's but usually my money instead as it took up too much of her fun money. Now she is able to save money even.
But as I said, if for any reason you suspect that your money won't go for you, I'd contact both the Area no Aging for help with getting set up with a fiduciary. It would also be helpful to contact an attorney for a will so that your things are not sold or discarded. A living will would also be helpful so that your health wishes are also followed while you are still of sound mind to choose.
My dad raised me well, but if it were me and my kids (they are selfish teens now), I'd go through a fiduciary. But who knows how they will turn out as adults.
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