Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
First off I want to say I've been taught not to give people who come up to you and beg, you never know if they're going to go for your wallet once you take it out, or if they're trying to get you distracted so they can hit you and rob your pockets or take your car.
I do give to charities, as generously as I can to causes that help people. Just wanted to state first that I am not anti-poor or anything like that. But I have been taught to not engage with panhandlers.
I'm used to there being some homeless people in the cities, such as downtown Chicago, and downtown Columbus. Every so often a person will start a conversation with the passerby, or even follow you a while. Pretty easy to maneuver around that most of the time. In the city you can always cross the street. Usually you're not the only pedestrian either, so the panhandlers have other targets they can move on to.
I'm a little shaken up because on two recent trips outside the cities, I've had panhandlers come up into my personal space.
I was at a gas station in rural Indiana. A new gas station, nice one, it was about 9 at night, and out of the fourteen pumps there were only a couple people there. Noticed a dualie pickup truck with the engine running, next to the minimart. I start pumping gas, I'm situated between my car and the gas pump island with its brick pillars. A young man comes (maybe 19-20yo), apparently from the pickup truck. Tries to make direct eye contact with me as he calls to me and starts making a beeline toward me. Walks up within a foot of the front right bumper of my car.
So at this point he's in my personal space, I'm alone, he's a bigger guy (over 250#), and there's no other customers within sight range and I'm not within sight of the minimart entrance. (I'm about 140.)
I must have said something that got him to back off, because he did... I've got experience managing 7th graders (including some mean and big ones) and also I grew up in Chicago... I guess I have it in me to give a serious enough look and use my voice to hold my space.
He stopped moving toward me but was still pretty damn close, and didn't back away. I was still kind of trapped between the car and the gas pump.
Anyway, turns out the young man stated he was homeless, and after he talked a bit he got less aggressive and left peacefully. I listened and I was kind, I even tried talking about church with him a little (thought that might change the outcome of the conversation) but I didn't offer him anything. His tone and manner actually softened a lot once our "standoff" ended. In the end, he seemed nice.
I got the impression he might have some social/emotional disorders and maybe he honestly did not realize how intimidating his approach was. Still though, he was a big guy. He walked back to the pickup truck and got in the passenger side.
I was completely caught off-guard by that one. It was a nice, economically developing area, a new gas station next to an Applebee's, on a four-lane state highway about 5 miles from the nearest town. Maybe he was looking for drug money? Drug deal going on in the pickup truck? Only thing I can think of that really makes sense.
In 20 years of travels in Indiana, rural, suburban, and urban, I have never experienced having someone come up to me in my personal space while I was alone. This was a first for me.
Today, another experience similar to the first. Can't really call this one rural, more exurban I guess. Area is a strip of shopping malls in Ohio (Staples and such) and its an area where every building has its own parking lot, there's no sidewalks, its also on a four-lane and it's not a walkable area.
This is a Saturday morning, and when I was leaving a store to walk to my car, a bearded middle-aged man comes off from the roadside (from where, I don't know) and very quickly and aggressively moves into my space, trying to make eye contact and calling to me. My car was toward the end of the parking lot. I could have exited out of that situation by going back into the building. I instead verbally called him off the same way I did the previous time, and he stopped talking and stopped moving toward me, at which point I got into my car.
(Had 5-10 feet of space at most between him and my driver's door. Could have gotten in the passenger door I guess, would have had more space between me and him, but then I would have had to maneuver myself into the driver's seat, could have done it but it would have cost me an extra minute or two and delayed me being able to start the car. Also, thought crossed my mind, the police always say they're at their most vulnerable when they're inside their vehicle because they can't duck, maneuver, etc. in case the offender has a gun. So maybe I should have walked/ran back to the building instead of going in the car at all?)
After I got in to my car and started it up, I saw him swear and mutter something but then he walked away, then he briskly walked on to the other side of the parking lot, got a woman to roll down her window to talk to him, then approached a man putting something in his truck (also got right into the man's personal space, and that poor guy had a little kid with him.) For being an older man who was not in shape, he sure moved fast from one place to another.
So all I can say about this one, is that Ohio people are very nice. Both the woman and the man appeared to have some conversation with him, but I don't think he got anything from them. Both of those people though were in a more populated area so I can imagine they felt more at ease.
When he was approaching me, it was intimidating because there was no one other than me and him within sight and sound. Almost wish I still had my old-fashioned flip phone because on those its very easy to flip open the phone and dial 911 without having to look. On a smart phone, its swipe, unlock, press the right side of the screen, dial, and so on. Not quick or subtle.
Almost wish I still had my old-fashioned flip phone because on those its very easy to flip open the phone and dial 911 without having to look. On a smart phone, its swipe, unlock, press the right side of the screen, dial, and so on. Not quick or subtle.
Thoughts?
"Hey Siri, call 911." Quick, efficient, and no swiping, looking, or pressing required.
"Hey Siri, call 911." Quick, efficient, and no swiping, looking, or pressing required.
That's what I would have done. I would have then gotten back into my car and waited for the police. This man posed a serious potential danger. It certainly would have been a poor idea to leave before the police arrived as he could have attacked someone else. I know that that's what people would have done here.
First off I want to say I've been taught not to give people who come up to you and beg, you never know if they're going to go for your wallet once you take it out, or if they're trying to get you distracted so they can hit you and rob your pockets or take your car.
I do give to charities, as generously as I can to causes that help people. Just wanted to state first that I am not anti-poor or anything like that. But I have been taught to not engage with panhandlers.
I'm used to there being some homeless people in the cities, such as downtown Chicago, and downtown Columbus. Every so often a person will start a conversation with the passerby, or even follow you a while. Pretty easy to maneuver around that most of the time. In the city you can always cross the street. Usually you're not the only pedestrian either, so the panhandlers have other targets they can move on to.
I'm a little shaken up because on two recent trips outside the cities, I've had panhandlers come up into my personal space.
I was at a gas station in rural Indiana. A new gas station, nice one, it was about 9 at night, and out of the fourteen pumps there were only a couple people there. Noticed a dualie pickup truck with the engine running, next to the minimart. I start pumping gas, I'm situated between my car and the gas pump island with its brick pillars. A young man comes (maybe 19-20yo), apparently from the pickup truck. Tries to make direct eye contact with me as he calls to me and starts making a beeline toward me. Walks up within a foot of the front right bumper of my car.
So at this point he's in my personal space, I'm alone, he's a bigger guy (over 250#), and there's no other customers within sight range and I'm not within sight of the minimart entrance. (I'm about 140.)
I must have said something that got him to back off, because he did... I've got experience managing 7th graders (including some mean and big ones) and also I grew up in Chicago... I guess I have it in me to give a serious enough look and use my voice to hold my space.
He stopped moving toward me but was still pretty damn close, and didn't back away. I was still kind of trapped between the car and the gas pump.
Anyway, turns out the young man stated he was homeless, and after he talked a bit he got less aggressive and left peacefully. I listened and I was kind, I even tried talking about church with him a little (thought that might change the outcome of the conversation) but I didn't offer him anything. His tone and manner actually softened a lot once our "standoff" ended. In the end, he seemed nice.
I got the impression he might have some social/emotional disorders and maybe he honestly did not realize how intimidating his approach was. Still though, he was a big guy. He walked back to the pickup truck and got in the passenger side.
I was completely caught off-guard by that one. It was a nice, economically developing area, a new gas station next to an Applebee's, on a four-lane state highway about 5 miles from the nearest town. Maybe he was looking for drug money? Drug deal going on in the pickup truck? Only thing I can think of that really makes sense.
In 20 years of travels in Indiana, rural, suburban, and urban, I have never experienced having someone come up to me in my personal space while I was alone. This was a first for me.
Today, another experience similar to the first. Can't really call this one rural, more exurban I guess. Area is a strip of shopping malls in Ohio (Staples and such) and its an area where every building has its own parking lot, there's no sidewalks, its also on a four-lane and it's not a walkable area.
This is a Saturday morning, and when I was leaving a store to walk to my car, a bearded middle-aged man comes off from the roadside (from where, I don't know) and very quickly and aggressively moves into my space, trying to make eye contact and calling to me. My car was toward the end of the parking lot. I could have exited out of that situation by going back into the building. I instead verbally called him off the same way I did the previous time, and he stopped talking and stopped moving toward me, at which point I got into my car.
(Had 5-10 feet of space at most between him and my driver's door. Could have gotten in the passenger door I guess, would have had more space between me and him, but then I would have had to maneuver myself into the driver's seat, could have done it but it would have cost me an extra minute or two and delayed me being able to start the car. Also, thought crossed my mind, the police always say they're at their most vulnerable when they're inside their vehicle because they can't duck, maneuver, etc. in case the offender has a gun. So maybe I should have walked/ran back to the building instead of going in the car at all?)
After I got in to my car and started it up, I saw him swear and mutter something but then he walked away, then he briskly walked on to the other side of the parking lot, got a woman to roll down her window to talk to him, then approached a man putting something in his truck (also got right into the man's personal space, and that poor guy had a little kid with him.) For being an older man who was not in shape, he sure moved fast from one place to another.
So all I can say about this one, is that Ohio people are very nice. Both the woman and the man appeared to have some conversation with him, but I don't think he got anything from them. Both of those people though were in a more populated area so I can imagine they felt more at ease.
When he was approaching me, it was intimidating because there was no one other than me and him within sight and sound. Almost wish I still had my old-fashioned flip phone because on those its very easy to flip open the phone and dial 911 without having to look. On a smart phone, its swipe, unlock, press the right side of the screen, dial, and so on. Not quick or subtle.
Thoughts?
First of all, I wouldn't consider either of the places you describe as "rural" - sounds like both places were in the exurbs or maybe even the suburbs of a larger town.
I live in an actual rural area about 7 miles south of a small town (pop 8,000) in Colorado's ranching and farming country. The closest town of any size (maybe 70,000 tops) is more than an hour's drive away, and people out here have no love for the drive which can be hazardous, especially come winter when sometimes you just can't get there from here. If some entity put in a badly needed 4 lane highway out here, people would be going around in a state of shock. Nor do we have snappy new gas stations like what you describe. If you want to buy gas around here after 10 pm, you'd better have a debit or credit card on you, since 10 pm is the witching hour when they roll up the sidewalks.
We do have panhandlers, and we've always had them. Alas, this is mostly due to our proximity to several major Native American tribal lands. I have lost track of all the times I've been approached for money that obviously would go toward the cost of the next bottle. However, with few exceptions, the Natives around here are very polite even when drinking and approaching an older lady like me for spare change. A head shake of "no" while walking away usually solves the problem. Non Natives who are not under the influence are generally people with mental issues whom the local police whisk off for mental evaluations. Some are generally down and out and have become stranded out here when their cash didn't square up with the miles they have left to travel. If I have a few spare dollars, I'll go up to the counter at the gas station and tell the clerk to give X amount of gas to the old trunk waiting outside next to a pump.
My old truck has broken down, and I'm trying to put aside the money to get it repaired. This means I must depend on the kindness of others to get a drive into town for groceries, etc. The local City Market (Kroeger's) has become a hang out of sorts for Native panhandlers. City Market has responded by setting up a sort of buffer zone beyond which non-customers may not pass and panhandlers who approach customers get the police called on them, and it's off to county jail they go under a charge of public intoxication. Sometimes my ride is late or I finish my shopping early, and I end up sitting on one of the benches outside the store. Needless to say, I've had many interesting conversations in the neutral zone where the benches are located. I like the Natives very much -especially the Navajo - and it breaks my heart the way alcohol destroys too many of them. Once we're past the no spare change/no cigarettes to bum, we actually sit there peacefully and sometimes they offer to share food with them. If you understand anything about the Navajo, you know that the offer to share food is a request that must be taken seriously. It is very rude to turn down even a bit of taco and such an action is considered very disrespectful. Well, I can take a few taco crumbs and dispose of them on the sly and go sit and try to help improve white/Native understanding. They sometimes pretend to not understand English which they actually speak as well as I do. I go along with the joke and tell them that they must all be offspring of Coyote the Trickster. This observation of mine always brings big grins, even laughter and then my ride finally shows up and I wave goodbye to my new friends who are now doing some pretty good imitations of coyote songs and wishing me well.
That's my experience with panhandlers in the Four Corners - one of the most isolated, most rural areas in the state of Colorado. Ohio sounds pretty sad. I think I'll stay out here and work on the lyrics to everybody's fav coyote songs.
A haunting song written about a different region but fitting for your area, complete with small flutes wailing like coyotes: Welcome Me written and sung by the Indigo Girls.
To the OP, sorry to hear about your bad experiences. I live & work in a major metropolitan area, and have posted regularly on my thoughts/opinions about homeless panhandlers in the "Non Romantic Relationships" forum. Several thoughts re: your specific experiences:
I completely agree that if you're at a gas station, in a parked car, and/or in an isolated area a panhandler is much more threatening, and it's obvious that panhandlers take advantage of this to "corner" you to some extent; very intimidating & sneaky of these people. Once a panhandler quickly approached me while I was in a parked car and I just drove away quickly. Who knows what the hell he was going to do if I hadn't moved the car.
I have been approached a couple of times by panhandlers at gas stations (while getting gas), and did feel a lot more threatened/trapped than if I had just been walking as a pedestrian down a street.
And, no - I never give any of them money.
I was in NYC on vacation over the summer, and it was very easy to just walk away from panhandlers/refuse them - plus, there were always so many people around that it was never a problem. This is obviously a lot easier to do on foot then if you're in or around a car.
Big fan of The Indigo Girls; their song Welcome Me (which I hadn't heard before) is a great one:
I have noticed that panhandlers are becoming more of a problem at gas stations. You're a sitting duck while you're pumping gas. I just tell them "can't today" or something along those lines.
But, I now carry a really loud whistle on my key chain. I used it to train my dog to come to it, if she gets far away from me on our walks, but it doubles as a way to stop any threats. I haven't had to use it yet, but that's my plan if I'm approached and they don't back off when I first ask them to. I'll just blast my whistle really loudly.
The homeless problem is just growing like crazy everywhere. And they appear to be mostly drug addicts. I feel sorry for them, but they're unpredictable. I avoid eye contact, but if that doesn't work, I'll say "can't help today" or say something like, "honey, I'm broke, too," which usually works, as I have a really old pickup.
But, I think if I just blew that super loud whistle, it would stop anyone who had ideas about trying to rob me, etc. So, maybe get a whistle? The one I got was from Walmart in the camping section. It's for survival in the woods, with a compass on it and is really loud so you can blow it for people to find you if you get lost in the woods. It was fairly cheap.
Location: When you take flak it means you are on target
7,646 posts, read 9,956,572 times
Reputation: 16466
Most encounters I've had recently have been at interstate gas stations. There's also a gas station in the bad part of our town that attracts ner-do-wells.
They don't usually mess with me too much because I look menacing and drive a big 4x4. I politely tell them no, or no thanks, once. If they persist or become aggressive I go into a defensive posture and use a "command voice." "BACK OFF." That gets their attention. LOL So far have never had to go beyond that.
If they kept attacking or intimidating the next step would probably be a face full of CS and have them arrested for robbery. No means no, most panhandlers understand that and don't push it.
But then I'm seldom in a big city and when I am I'm not usually where such people congregate.
So, why don't the gas station managers kick them out? They are not only loitering, they are harassing paying customers. When we were kids they would kick us out of the 7-11 parking lot all the time, just for standing there talking after we bought our Mountain Dew and Doritos.
We have a pass through of panhandlers where I am right now up in the mountains, on their way to the west coast. But in Calgary I had a gangbanger panhandle me right at the MCDonals counter and all I got from the manager was excuses. I've never understood panhandling other than immediate gratification, especially in the towns I'm in there's lots of free food and support services.
But yes, I watch my back even inside stores. We've had lots of knife work going on in town, even though we don't tolerate packing guns. Good thing.
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.
Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
