The San Francisco Trash/Needles/Poop in the Streets Containment Thread (San Diego: subletting, warehouse)

[Tulemutt]

Originally Posted by BlakeJones

You should address it, but before you do you need to move them off the sidewalk and stairways.

Agreed. Now, where are you going to move them to ... legally ... at what cost?

[CorporateCowboy]

Originally Posted by BlakeJones

You should address it, but before you do you need to move them off the sidewalk and stairways.

Call 311 - or the HSOC, if someone is on private property or you find yourself in an ‘uncomfortable’ situation. Or are you talking about ‘herding’ all homeless into a specific part of the City (and playing bingo to ‘restrain’ them) so you don’t have to look a homeless person in the eye on a sidewalk? I think your over-the-top comments play to fear more than anything else (and maybe rightfully so) - which is why it’s important to work toward a solution regarding homelessness in SF (and everywhere), particularly those who are mentally ill.

[BlakeJones]

Originally Posted by Tulemutt

Agreed. Now, where are you going to move them to ... legally ... at what cost?

The real solution is for people to leave the city itself. There is no God given right to live in a specific city. There is no shortage of places in this country with ultra cheap housing. The places are less desirable but at least they will have a shot at sustaining a livelyhood. Artificially propping up homeless in ultra expensive cities makes no sense and is completely unsustainable.

San Fran should hand out free one-way greyhound tickets to the US location of their choice

[Tulemutt]

Originally Posted by BlakeJones

The real solution is for people to leave the city itself. There is no God given right to live in a specific city. There is no shortage of places in this country with ultra cheap housing. The places are less desirable but at least they will have a shot at sustaining a livelyhood. Artificially propping up homeless in ultra expensive cities makes no sense and is completely unsustainable.

San Fran should hand out free one-way greyhound tickets to the US location of their choice

They do (hand out bus and air tickets). Most homeless don’t want to move. So back to my question: where will you move them to and how, legally, at what expense since very few want to go?

[BlakeJones]

Originally Posted by Tulemutt

They do (hand out bus and air tickets). Most homeless don’t want to move. So back to my question: where will you move them to and how, legally, at what expense since very few want to go?

You're looking at it from the back end - where do they end up. That doesn't matter from the front end, that they simply can't be HERE. They have to go somewhere yes, but not here. In practice in most cities that means the homeless are just constantly being shifted around until they either find a place they aren't bothering anyone, leave the city, or find a legit shelter

[skygazer1]

Originally Posted by Tulemutt

They do (hand out bus and air tickets). Most homeless don’t want to move. So back to my question: where will you move them to and how, legally, at what expense since very few want to go?

Sure, I too want to live on Pac Heights and pay nothing, get free needles, what a life. Everyone should be afforded that "right", and all of them will be stacked up to the stratosphere on Broadway and Divisedero. LOL.

These people have no legal right to be where they are. Generally, the City land is divided up into private property and public property. If you don't own property, or have permission to be on private property (rent), you are on public property. City ordinances prohibit blocking public areas, and prohibit people residing in public areas. This leaves ZERO land for them to live in the City, in their destitute situation.

So, the SFPD have the legal right to kick them out of the City boundary, because they have no legal right to live anywhere there. Little expense in that, put 'em the back of the white van and drop 'em at the border. Then, Daly City will have to do the same, but that's their problem...

[Tulemutt]

Originally Posted by BlakeJones

You're looking at it from the back end - where do they end up. That doesn't matter from the front end, that they simply can't be HERE. They have to go somewhere yes, but not here. In practice in most cities that means the homeless are just constantly being shifted around until they either find a place they aren't bothering anyone, leave the city, or find a legit shelter

You aren’t making sense or answering the question Blake.

You suggested we bus them out. I answered: we do. If they want to go and can confirm a sponsor at the other end of their journey. Traveler’s Aid organization has been doing this since the late 1800’s. Many other organizations in many cities do it now as well. In fact, some of San Francisco’s homeless arrived here just that way and then didn’t follow through with their sponsored plans.

The question was / is: whatchagonnadoboutit? Most don’t want to leave. What will you do about that?

Facts are: you have no idea what you are talking about. This has been pointed out to you everytime you’ve showed up on this forum in the past. You haven’t been homeless. You’ve never worked with the homeless. You don’t know anything about homelessness economics, health problems, mental health conditions, addictions, related legal constraints ... nothing. Yet here you are pontificating.

[veritased]

Originally Posted by Tulemutt

Well, you don’t understand it ... or much of anything, really. All you do is cling to party line bs.

Tulemutt built some of his boats from scratch. Restored other classics that were derelict throw-aways. None of them are larger than 28 feet ... the majority are 16 feet and under. None are “yachts”. Most are either sail or human powered. All are built or restored by second-hand scrounging. And I rarely sail up and down the coast ... just in and around the bays and estuaries and rivers ... going offshore into the ocean at times for a few hours of lollygagging and fishing for supper. I use less than 8 gallons a day of water compared to your probable 100+. The amount of electricity I consume from the grid is barely measurable. I bike and walk most of my daily travels. My car is a 15-year-old diesel van with 535,000 miles on it unrebuilt.

Equal my efficiencies and lack of consumption and lack of materialism and we can talk further

What’s too thick to cut with a knife around here is your bs whining.

Well golly gee willikers, how impressive. We'd all like to tinker away on our boat, smoke doobs out in San Diego bay, feet up on the tiller, contemplating the sunsets meanings. However, see, some of us have to work, some of us, indeed want to work, because we want to add to society through our vocation. I happen to be in tech, though now fom AZ vs SF Bay, and working to advance a certain field of technology. I can't even contemplate lounging around like you, pontificating about social policies while being exposed to exactly none of them.

Unless of course the homeless are being marine squatters on the abandoned hull mooring nearby ? No ? Yeah, I didn't think so. Oh, I know, you volunteer to help the homeless and vets, which for that I bow down to your goodness. But you don't have to deal daily with the homeless sleeping on your stoop, so to speak, so I prefer to listen to the opinion of those who actually have to live daily side side with the homeless, to see their despair and their effects on local society.

While your economy of water and electrons is impressive, so what ? Should we all move out on the Bay with you? I'll bet the wise and all gracious Tulemutt won't be so wise and gracious anymore, when the social cost of overcrowding and homeless is daily exacted on his port and starboard. The rest of society needs to eat, crap, drive and work everyday, and not out on our yacht on the Bay. BTW, do you think you are paying your fair share of 'rent' out there in beautiful Coronado Bay ? Or are you free riding off our hard earned taxes that maintain and keep California waterways in good shape ? I say raise taxes and mooring fees on all boaters by 100% to help pay for Navigation Centers.

[2sleepy]

Originally Posted by BlakeJones

The real solution is for people to leave the city itself. There is no God given right to live in a specific city. There is no shortage of places in this country with ultra cheap housing. The places are less desirable but at least they will have a shot at sustaining a livelyhood. Artificially propping up homeless in ultra expensive cities makes no sense and is completely unsustainable.
San Fran should hand out free one-way greyhound tickets to the US location of their choice

San Francisco has been handing out bus tickets to the homeless for at least the past 25 years. Those who have rejected the offer of a bus ticket remain are here because they want to be here and there is no constitutional way to remove a person from a given location against their will unless they are in police custody or have been adjudicated as being so severely mentally ill that they are a danger to themselves or others.

[2sleepy]

Originally Posted by veritased

Well golly gee willikers, how impressive. We'd all like to tinker away on our boat, smoke doobs out in San Diego bay, feet up on the tiller, contemplating the sunsets meanings. However, see, some of us have to work, some of us, indeed want to work, because we want to add to society through our vocation. I happen to be in tech, though now fom AZ vs SF Bay, and working to advance a certain field of technology. I can't even contemplate lounging around like you, pontificating about social policies while being exposed to exactly none of them.

Unless of course the homeless are being marine squatters on the abandoned hull mooring nearby ? No ? Yeah, I didn't think so. Oh, I know, you volunteer to help the homeless and vets, which for that I bow down to your goodness. But you don't have to deal daily with the homeless sleeping on your stoop, so to speak, so I prefer to listen to the opinion of those who actually have to live daily side side with the homeless, to see their despair and their effects on local society.

While your economy of water and electrons is impressive, so what ? Should we all move out on the Bay with you? I'll bet the wise and all gracious Tulemutt won't be so wise and gracious anymore, when the social cost of overcrowding and homeless is daily exacted on his port and starboard. The rest of society needs to eat, crap, drive and work everyday, and not out on our yacht on the Bay. BTW, do you think you are paying your fair share of 'rent' out there in beautiful Coronado Bay ? Or are you free riding off our hard earned taxes that maintain and keep California waterways in good shape ? I say raise taxes and mooring fees on all boaters by 100% to help pay for Navigation Centers.

Feel better now that you got that off your chest?