It's real estate bottomed out and rebounding in this area of Florida? (homes, buying)

[nubiwan]

I am a Canadian investor looking at a few properties in Sarasota and thought I'd pitch in a couple of observations. First of all I have looked at about 10 condos in the last few days. I am in the $80 - $100K price range. I was up in Las Plamas this week and looked at 3 units for sale. They were all pretty nice and, to me at least, it would be a desirable place to live, if not close enough to the beach, but handy to the I75 and University. I did however notice in this complex, as well as many others that there were lockboxes and/or 'foreclosure' notices on other doors in the community for homes that were not listed for sale in the MLS? The agent I was with did not have an answer as to why this was the case. We actually pulled up to 3 units with lockboxes, only to realize it was the wrong address, before finding the correct unit. Makes you wonder exactly hhow many units are really in default in the complex, how many the banks are sitting on to avoid a frenzy.

I belong to a very reputable RE investment club in Canada that believes that fundamentals, not just of the property you buy, but the market you buy in are critical to your future success. That is, only buy into an economy that is showing upswing in employment, infrastucture development, and housing. The recommendation in the club as of 2-3 months ago (and remains today), is that of caution in any US market for investment. If you are looking for a second home or vacation property, and paying cash, then fill your boots. If you are looking to mortgage, rent and hold, then exercise extreme prejudice.

My personal take on the matter is that the properties I am looking at would cost me 3-4 times the price they would cost in my own 'ludicrous' Canadian market. If I lived in Toronto or Vancouver, then 6-7 times the asking price. I might never be able to afford a 2/2 condo in Florida again in my lifetime. And you certainly cannot build some of these units at the prices that they are selling for. That is why I am here seriously considering taking this plunge, and the hassle of foreign ownership. Regardless, the question I am finding myself asking is, is this the best use of my $100K cash reserve? Am I willng to risk $100K turning into $75k or even $50K if the US banks are indeed sitting on a bunch of housing product they have kept under wraps because it's an election year, or some other feel good US Federal Gov exercise? Answer is probably not.

[nubiwan]

Originally Posted by Vikingen

We are from Northern Europe, and just bought a house in SW Florida. No matter how you look at it, it was a steal. You can hardly get a lot here in Northern Europe for what we got a whole house for in SW Florida.

We are just sitting in our sun chairs with a big grin - house is already booked for most of the year - making money the first year!!!


There is so much negative focus on the PIGS countries and their influence on world economy. Forget it. Let them bankrupt, go back to drakhmer, pesetas and lire. Doesn't matter - Northern Europe and the US will still prosper.

Well, it works if you have a wad of expendable cash that you can chuck at a property in the US, and do not care if the value drops even lower over the next 12-36 months. Nor does your response answer the topic title as to whether property values are on the increase in Florida?

What if you personally borrowed against the equity in your Northern Euro home to buy a $250K house in SW Florida, and then the value of that house you just bought dropped back to $125K again, because US banks are sitting on a wad of new foreclosures. That's not a very sound investment if you can't get your money back out of it, or it loses 50% of it's value overnight.

What happens if the US economy does not turn around, and the banks are indeed siting on a vast pool of properties in foreclosure, and prices tumble back down? You'll then have a bunch of investors and speculators (like yourselves) upside down on mortgages or in a negative equity position.

What happens if the US Dollar takes a beating and it's not enough to cover your payments on the Line of Credit you set up to buy the house?

What happens if the US GOVT decides to impose stiffer taxes on foreign ownership of US property?

[calico777]

If frogs had wings ....

You can lose your money in the stock market.
You can currently get zip in interest in a regular savings account and in the long run not make or lose any money.
;-)

[gettinoutofjersey]

i think november will be a big turning point. hopefully it gets better, however as bad as it is with expansion on current policies it can always get worse. there will be more "flexibility"

[nubiwan]

Originally Posted by calico777

If frogs had wings ....

You can lose your money in the stock market.
You can currently get zip in interest in a regular savings account and in the long run not make or lose any money.
;-)

And a fool and his money are quickly parted......

[Sunshine Rules]

Originally Posted by nubiwan

I am a Canadian investor looking at a few properties in Sarasota and thought I'd pitch in a couple of observations. First of all I have looked at about 10 condos in the last few days. I am in the $80 - $100K price range. I was up in Las Plamas this week and looked at 3 units for sale. They were all pretty nice and, to me at least, it would be a desirable place to live, if not close enough to the beach, but handy to the I75 and University. I did however notice in this complex, as well as many others that there were lockboxes and/or 'foreclosure' notices on other doors in the community for homes that were not listed for sale in the MLS? The agent I was with did not have an answer as to why this was the case. We actually pulled up to 3 units with lockboxes, only to realize it was the wrong address, before finding the correct unit. Makes you wonder exactly hhow many units are really in default in the complex, how many the banks are sitting on to avoid a frenzy.

I belong to a very reputable RE investment club in Canada that believes that fundamentals, not just of the property you buy, but the market you buy in are critical to your future success. That is, only buy into an economy that is showing upswing in employment, infrastucture development, and housing. The recommendation in the club as of 2-3 months ago (and remains today), is that of caution in any US market for investment. If you are looking for a second home or vacation property, and paying cash, then fill your boots. If you are looking to mortgage, rent and hold, then exercise extreme prejudice.

My personal take on the matter is that the properties I am looking at would cost me 3-4 times the price they would cost in my own 'ludicrous' Canadian market. If I lived in Toronto or Vancouver, then 6-7 times the asking price. I might never be able to afford a 2/2 condo in Florida again in my lifetime. And you certainly cannot build some of these units at the prices that they are selling for. That is why I am here seriously considering taking this plunge, and the hassle of foreign ownership. Regardless, the question I am finding myself asking is, is this the best use of my $100K cash reserve? Am I willng to risk $100K turning into $75k or even $50K if the US banks are indeed sitting on a bunch of housing product they have kept under wraps because it's an election year, or some other feel good US Federal Gov exercise? Answer is probably not.

Las Palmas was a condo conversion from apartments around 2005. Because many of the buyers of the units at that time were doing 100% financing (yes, even investors), when the real estate boom went bust in SW FL starting around 2006 - 2007, many of the owners who personally did not have any cash invested in their condos, stopped paying their mortgages. Las Palmas has had a huge turnover of ownership due to foreclosures and short sales over the past 5 years. People buying the distress properties are paying cash since financing is no longer an option (for a number of reasons). Therefore, the community is becoming more fiancially stable as the number of foreclosures keeps shrinking.

IF your agent can get you a copy of the current year's budget and Rules & Regulations before you make an offer, I would suggest doing so and reading both carefully. If you are looking at short sales, the unit owner is obligated to provide you the condo docs & most current budget within a specific time period per the condominium addendum to the contract. You then have 3 days to review the documents and, if not satisfied with what you read, you can cancel the contract per the specified terms. If you are looking at REO (bank owned) listings, the bank's special addendum to the contract usually puts the burden of obtaining the condo docs & budget on the buyer, at buyer's expense, within a specified time period.

Las Palmas had some problems back in 2009 and 2010 with lots of complaints about both the association board and the management company. They obtained a new management company in October of 2010 and it appears things have improved since then. Grounds maintenance and overall appearance have also improved. Although I have noted some minor maintenance issues with certain styles of townhomes when showing there over the few months, mostly to do with balcony areas and window ledges.

[siestachica]

Interesting article regarding foreclosures.
Lyons: Flood of foreclosures far from over | HeraldTribune.com

Looking into my magic ball.....

Currently sat in Europe for it all to kick off. It seems that Spain have been left off the hook for now, but let's see what happens at the G20 meeting. The Greeks by the skin off their teeth. I've noticed on the attendance sheet a large number of delegates (incidentally -nonelected) from the EU attending. Obviously looking to whisper sweet nothings into the great leaders of the world, to do the right thing and print lots of money......and who will win this juicy pot of money....yep you guessed it the banks, straight into their investment arms. If only the banks would show the breakdown when they show their earnings, retail is losing hand over fist but if you look at the investment side, that's where they are making the money....just watch that oil price rise, not due to fundamentals but to those greedy little s**** in wall street

Got to say though would rather be hanging out in Siesta than freezing over here..

Take Care One and All

[bbronston]

Originally Posted by nubiwan

I did however notice in this complex, as well as many others that there were lockboxes and/or 'foreclosure' notices on other doors in the community for homes that were not listed for sale in the MLS? The agent I was with did not have an answer as to why this was the case. We actually pulled up to 3 units with lockboxes, only to realize it was the wrong address, before finding the correct unit. Makes you wonder exactly hhow many units are really in default in the complex, how many the banks are sitting on to avoid a frenzy.

Right now in Las Palmas, there are more listings Pending (under contract) than there are Active and lockboxes typically remain on doors until the closing. So, it makes sense that you ran into the situation you did. Also, banks will label properties long before they ever reach the market so, again, your experience was typical, not odd. A quick call to the management company can tell you how many units are currently behind.

[Obrero]

Sales figures for May '12

http://www.sarasotarealtors.com/file...2061912248.pdf

[nubiwan]

Originally Posted by bbronston

Right now in Las Palmas, there are more listings Pending (under contract) than there are Active and lockboxes typically remain on doors until the closing. So, it makes sense that you ran into the situation you did. Also, banks will label properties long before they ever reach the market so, again, your experience was typical, not odd. A quick call to the management company can tell you how many units are currently behind.

Yes, it occurred to me later that pending or contracted units would be reasonable explanations.....