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Absolutely never would I get in the car with him...unless my child was in the car already...or toss the keys as far away as I could...that's the NYC girl in me...make them work for it...
Right, you would exit the scene as no car and no groceries are worth being taken hostage.
I am not going to list other possible scenarios where you life or well being would be at risk and where you would have no choice in the matter as an unarmed person but I wont bother. If you are willing to be overtaken, wounded, permanently injured or killed, thats your option.
I would prefer the option to walk away alive and unharmed.
A lot of you are missing the point. He did something to rectify the situation. He did go to someone to make a complaint. He did report the situation and returned to his seat next to his wife. The situation may have been aggravated by the victim after that causing the shooter to exercise his rights.
Frankly, if someone texting their babysitter briefly during the PREVIEWS bothers you that much, tough--get over it. It's not that big of a deal just because you CHOOSE to MAKE it one. Even if it's something more appalling, like texting constantly and during the actual movie itself, the response would be to go to management. It is not your place as a patron to enforce the rules, that right & responsibility rests with the legal system if applicable or, in this case, the property owner. Your role is to REPORT the violation, not to be the self-appointed judge-jury and, in this case, executioner.
Regardless--again, if someone sending a quick text to their child's babysitter during the previews bothers you that much, tough cookies. Stop being so sensitive. YOU'RE the one with the problem, frankly.[/quote]
Right, you would exit the scene as no car and no groceries are worth being taken hostage.
I am not going to list other possible scenarios where you life or well being would be at risk and where you would have no choice in the matter as an unarmed person but I wont bother. If you are willing to be overtaken, wounded, permanently injured or killed, thats your option.
I would prefer the option to walk away alive and unharmed.
I only know the facts that have been given so far in this case...not in every possible scenario...but faced with a few popcorn pieces being thrown my way...my response wouldn't be to take out a gun and kill someone...crazy me!
What you are telling me is that its OK for someone to rob me of my rights and I should not be able to exercise my rights. It doesnt work that way in my world.
Quote:
Originally Posted by vaughanwilliams
And this is why you shouldn't have a gun. The SYG law and the explosion of CW permits have turned people who ordinarily wouldn't dream of getting into a confrontation (especially with someone who'd kick their ***) suddenly feeling empowered and a lot tougher than they are.
Almost without exception, every hard core gun humper, rapid SYG supporter I know wouldn't say **** if their mouth was full without their gun.
It doesn't matter much what I think. Unless there's a huge shift in public opinion gun laws will get looser, more and more CW permits will be issued, the NRA will continue scare the hell out of white people so more and more guns will be sold by their Corporate masters. The school shootings, movie theater shootings, neighborhood shootings, the endless body count of children shooting themselves is just the price America has to pay so all the Walter Mittys and John Wayne wannabes can have easy access to guns. Congratulations-your side won.
Lets say we had a verbal argument. It gets heated. You lunge towards me.
I am going to shoot you.
This is scary, folks.
You have a heated argument and when one person decides to engage, the other person feels the correct response is pulling a firearm and shooting with known consequences of killing the other person.
Why? What is wrong with running or backing away? Throwing a punch? Wrapping up and going to the ground? Screaming for help? Or at the very worst- getting your ass kicked?
The chances of dying from a brawl, especially in the setting of a movie theatre where multiple people are around to get involved...have to be extremely low and likely, if it happened, a freak accident.
There is a term called "imminent danger." Meaning, the chances of your death are very likely in the situation at hand. That is when a weapon should be used. If you aren't smart enough to calculate that (and it should be simple, as we rarely face them in life)...then you shouldn't be carrying a weapon. There was no imminent danger in this situation.
From witness comments I have read so far, it went from a shouting match...to thrown popcorn...to almost immediately afterwards a gunshot. I think we find out that this cowboy was ready to fire given the opportunity. He had an agenda towards people who he felt disrespected his personal atmosphere inside a theater or public setting- as reported in other cases. I think he felt it was up to him to provide a solution.
Again, I know the death penalty here is very unlikely- but my hopes are that it is proven he made a complaint to the staff and then entered that theater again knowing he would be ready to use his weapon to resolve any confrontation that occurred. If so, that would be grounds for death penalty...which I would totally support in his case to show others who carry weapons (which I am one) that guns aren't fun and games and they aren't your personal means of correcting society. This isn't Tombstone, Arizona. We have to make smarter decisions to avoid repercussions like someone losing a life over something so damned silly.
Spring Hillian, I hope you were heated in this conversation and don't really mean what you said. I hope you'd be willing to take an ass whipping, walk/run away, call for help, or even physically engage with that person (if it ever goes that far- which this former officer did not wait to find out) before deciding to end a life and possibly innocent bystanders around you with a weapon you carry.
This country is becoming weaker (mentally and physically) by the day. Even our police officers practice it...they will pull a taser in a second and fire it into someone instead of restraining them with force while the other 5 cops on scene stand around them! I worry in this economic and political era we are in...that the intelligence and decision making skills of licensed gun holders has decreased and replaced with a Wild West "come try to take my gun!" attitude. They ruin it for the real responsible gun owners.
It wouldnt be my reaction to having a few pieces of pop corn thrown at me because I'd reach out and seriously touch someone. However, if I felt that the pop corn tosser had intent to do me bodily harm through his actions or his words, I will do what I have the right to do and stop that dead in its tracks. Of course he would have his rights to use deadly force to halt my attack upon him to.
Its a matter of rights. My rights over someone else's rights. Nobody has the right to attack or threaten to attack another person without being responded to with consequences.
The man had the right to protect himself and his wife. The victim had no right to threaten or attack the shooter.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Irishiis49
I only know the facts that have been given so far in this case...not in every possible scenario...but faced with a few popcorn pieces being thrown my way...my response wouldn't be to take out a gun and kill someone...crazy me!
And this is why you shouldn't have a gun. The SYG law and the explosion of CW permits have turned people who ordinarily wouldn't dream of getting into a confrontation (especially with someone who'd kick their ***) suddenly feeling empowered and a lot tougher than they are.
Almost without exception, every hard core gun humper, rapid SYG supporter I know wouldn't say **** if their mouth was full without their gun.
It doesn't matter much what I think. Unless there's a huge shift in public opinion gun laws will get looser, more and more CW permits will be issued, the NRA will continue scare the hell out of white people so more and more guns will be sold by their Corporate masters. The school shootings, movie theater shootings, neighborhood shootings, the endless body count of children shooting themselves is just the price America has to pay so all the Walter Mittys and John Wayne wannabes can have easy access to guns. Congratulations-your side won.
I carry and it has never made me want to confront anyone. I don't generally like interacting with people I don't know and it certainly doesn't make me want to get in an argument. So I wouldn't say **** to someone whether I have my gun or not. If I felt my life were in danger, really in danger, I'd have no qualms in drawing my weapon though.
Regarding shootings, I definitely wish people would go a lot further to secure weapons since most of these shootings are by criminals who have their guns illegally, whether it be from theft, or buying it off someone who stole it, etc. I really hate going to friends' homes and finding they just leave guns on the night stand or in a display case, etc. One home burglary and now you have an armed criminal instead of just a burglar. My guns are either on me or in the safe when I'm not at home.
Same goes for unintentional shootings; parents who keep guns at home have a responsibility to secure their weapons or teach their kids proper handling at the appropriate age. They should be locked up for doing anything less.
None of that has anything to do with the NRA, SYG or concealed carry.
You have a heated argument and when one person decides to engage, the other person feels the correct response is pulling a firearm and shooting with known consequences of killing the other person.
Why? What is wrong with running or backing away? Throwing a punch? Wrapping up and going to the ground? Screaming for help? Or at the very worst- getting your ass kicked?
The chances of dying from a brawl, especially in the setting of a movie theatre where multiple people are around to get involved...have to be extremely low and likely, if it happened, a freak accident.
Have you heard of the knockout game? It's the one where juveniles who are typically on the low end of the IQ scale randomly batter passers by hoping to knock them out with one sucker punch. That has been known to kill people. I'm a proponent of running away over drawing my weapon if at all possible, but you shouldn't trivialize what one well placed punch can do, and legal gun owners shouldn't have to take their chances on dying from that one punch just so they don't get prosecuted.
No, I am not willing to take an ass whopping. I am not willing to endure bodily harm from someone that attacks me. I have a right to defend myself and I will exercise that right. Too many good people served this country to give me the right to peace, happiness and to live my life without being harmed and I would find it very hard to give up that right. I am not an aggressor. I will not be a victim either.
Quote:
Originally Posted by SeaSpur
This is scary, folks.
You have a heated argument and when one person decides to engage, the other person feels the correct response is pulling a firearm and shooting with known consequences of killing the other person.
Why? What is wrong with running or backing away? Throwing a punch? Wrapping up and going to the ground? Screaming for help? Or at the very worst- getting your ass kicked?
The chances of dying from a brawl, especially in the setting of a movie theatre where multiple people are around to get involved...have to be extremely low and likely, if it happened, a freak accident.
There is a term called "imminent danger." Meaning, the chances of your death are very likely in the situation at hand. That is when a weapon should be used. If you aren't smart enough to calculate that (and it should be simple, as we rarely face them in life)...then you shouldn't be carrying a weapon. There was no imminent danger in this situation.
From witness comments I have read so far, it went from a shouting match...to thrown popcorn...to almost immediately afterwards a gunshot. I think we find out that this cowboy was ready to fire given the opportunity. He had an agenda towards people who he felt disrespected his personal atmosphere inside a theater or public setting- as reported in other cases. I think he felt it was up to him to provide a solution.
Again, I know the death penalty here is very unlikely- but my hopes are that it is proven he made a complaint to the staff and then entered that theater again knowing he would be ready to use his weapon to resolve any confrontation that occurred. If so, that would be grounds for death penalty...which I would totally support in his case to show others who carry weapons (which I am one) that guns aren't fun and games and they aren't your personal means of correcting society. This isn't Tombstone, Arizona. We have to make smarter decisions to avoid repercussions like someone losing a life over something so damned silly.
Spring Hillian, I hope you were heated in this conversation and don't really mean what you said. I hope you'd be willing to take an ass whipping, walk/run away, call for help, or even physically engage with that person (if it ever goes that far- which this former officer did not wait to find out) before deciding to end a life and possibly innocent bystanders around you with a weapon you carry.
This country is becoming weaker (mentally and physically) by the day. Even our police officers practice it...they will pull a taser in a second and fire it into someone instead of restraining them with force while the other 5 cops on scene stand around them! I worry in this economic and political era we are in...that the intelligence and decision making skills of licensed gun holders has decreased and replaced with a Wild West "come try to take my gun!" attitude. They ruin it for the real responsible gun owners.
No, I am not willing to take an ass whopping. I am not willing to endure bodily harm from someone that attacks me. I have a right to defend myself and I will exercise that right. Too many good people served this country to give me the right to peace, happiness and to live my life without being harmed and I would find it very hard to give up that right. I am not an aggressor. I will not be a victim either.
My grandfather was one of the men who served this country and gave you those rights and I can tell you right now he would have never thought of shooting a man in fear of getting his ass whipped. He'd call anyone with that line of thinking an alternative name for a feline. He would have told you how real confrontations are settled- and it wasn't with a gun.
I hate that you feel that way, but it is your right. As long as you are aware that your gun makes you nearly useless or incapable in times of strife...because heaven forbid, you actually take a punch or get your ass kicked and wake up with some bumps and bruises the next day. The father and husband who died in that theater would have loved that alternative. But hey, I guess you feel his life was worth it as long as the former police officer didn't have to endure harm from an ass whipping...since, you know, he was defending his life and all that.
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