Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
I just wish I could have a moment with this darn bird ... "Now see here, Bird. You have had me twisted in a knot ever since that night 10 years ago ...!"
There are photos of something similar to what I saw. I have no way of judging authenticity but the one thing that bothers me ... is that they have obviously been killed. And I don't want my Bird to die:
You say above that the photos show "something similar" to what you saw. Do you mean what you saw is the same as the photos? Or would you say that what you saw was somewhat different than the photos?
With regard to the thing you saw, did it happen during the day? Or was it at night? The sighting happened about 10 years ago, is that correct? The reason I'm asking about night, is because you mentioned something to the effect about standing outside looking at the night sky and wondering if the thing is still alive. Were you hoping to catch another glimpse of it flying over that night?
Just to clear something up about the photos. Don't worry about judging whether or not they're authentic. Below are some links from Cryptomundo, Bizarre Zoology and Mysterious Universe. They contain both of the photos you posted (read the articles) and might help explain what the story is about those photos. Cryptomundo » Civil War Dinos
There are photos of something similar to what I saw. I have no way of judging authenticity but the one thing that bothers me ... is that they have obviously been killed. And I don't want my Bird to die:
You say above that the photos show "something similar" to what you saw. Do you mean what you saw is the same as the photos? Or would you say that what you saw was somewhat different than the photos?
With regard to the thing you saw, did it happen during the day? Or was it at night? The sighting happened about 10 years ago, is that correct? The reason I'm asking about night, is because you mentioned something to the effect about standing outside looking at the night sky and wondering if the thing is still alive. Were you hoping to catch another glimpse of it flying over that night?
Just to clear something up about the photos. Don't worry about judging whether or not they're authentic. Below are some links from Cryptomundo, Bizarre Zoology and Mysterious Universe. They contain both of the photos you posted (read the articles) and might help explain what the story is about those photos. Cryptomundo » Civil War Dinos
I saw it at night, fairly bright/full moon. As I was underneath it that created a very defined silhouette.
But not much detail. At all.
My parameters for being similar are due to: The shape/profile of the head & beak & neck. The shape/outline of the wings.
And I've always thought that what I saw had wings more skin-like than feathered due to the "unfurling" sound it made on the outstretch of the wings combined with the eardrum popping"boom" it made on the downswing combined with the force of air that knocked me backwards.
What I saw was slightly larger than what the pictures represent.
Unfortunately; that one flap/launch/scream(squak? croak? similar to the cry of an eagle but mixed with the croak of a bullfrog) was the first & last that I have ever seen.
In less than a minute it was over & nothing but a punctured/damaged roof to "show" for it. So frustrating.
Editing to add: I have not once in the last 10 years ever stepped outside at night without looking up first. It's a learned response from how intense this one encounter was. But yes, I find myself scanning the skies at sunset & during full moons because I know it's there. Probably a once-in-a-lifetime thing, though.
Last edited by coschristi; 11-23-2016 at 11:49 AM..
Obviously been killed? These photos are from a show called FreakyLinks.
Yeah; I know.
Thats why I didn't post them right off the bat. I'm already on shaky ground here; I didn't want their credibility to impact MY credibility.
I just don't know quite how to explain in words the absolute prehistoric "essence" of what I saw.
The "obviously been killed" statement is in regards to what I'm afraid would happen if somebody were to actually take me seriously. I don't want the next time I get to see him being him on somebody's wall as a trophy or stuffed on display in a Museum.
Thats why I'm reconsidering reporting this formally to the Las Animas County Sherriffs Office. I could care less about the reward they are offering regarding their dead cattle.
There are some very old laws regarding "Rustling" in existence; I'm not so sure thats it's NOT illegal to shoot a human you find stealing livestock, let alone an animal.
One downfall I seem to encounter is that any true history of this bird is in a realm that I am not privy to: The North American Native. A culture that kept history orally vs written. I can "Google" until my fingers fall off, or spend hours at a public library & I'm not going to find what I'm looking for.
"What I am looking for" is an answer as to "Why; is what I saw carved onto the top of your Totem Poles?"
"Was he real to you?"
Initially, I thought Totems were carved with a mixture of real vs supernatural figures. Not neccessarily so:
"... For example, some Kwakwaka'wakw families of northern Vancouver Island belonging to the Thunderbird Clan will feature a Thunderbird crest and familial legends on their poles. Other common crests among coastal First Nations include the wolf, eagle, grizzly bear, thunderbird, killer whale, frog, raven, and salmon..."
Um. Okay; so a wolf, eagle, bear, whale, frog, raven , salmon ... oh yeah; & just one supernatural diety?
Thats inconsistent. I think the bird who's flapping wings sounded like thunder was as "real" to them as the frogs & fish.
And I feel like precendent has been set that "somebody" has come along & put almost every one of those other animals on an "endangered" list. Hence my "obviously been killed" comment. It's been done to them, their land, their bison & we are working our way up the totem pole (pun intended) of other animals as well.
Whats to stop "somebody" from doing it to the Thunderbird too? THATS what scares me.
"... For example, some Kwakwaka'wakw families of northern Vancouver Island belonging to the Thunderbird Clan will feature a Thunderbird crest and familial legends on their poles. Other common crests among coastal First Nations include the wolf, eagle, grizzly bear, thunderbird, killer whale, frog, raven, and salmon..."
Um. Okay; so a wolf, eagle, bear, whale, frog, raven , salmon ... oh yeah; & just one supernatural diety?
Before jumping to that conclusion, I would look in to the linguistics of this. "Thunder Bird" may just be a bad translation for "eagle."
For example, the Kwakwaka'wakw word for "killer whale" translates literally as "blackfish." We all know whales aren't fish, and orcas aren't totally black either. But before we all start decrying the scientific ignorance of the Kwakwaka'wakw language, keep in mind that all languages have their little quirks and ways of expressing things.
I would chase down that answer before I assumed a supernatural explanation.
Before jumping to that conclusion, I would look in to the linguistics of this. "Thunder Bird" may just be a bad translation for "eagle."
For example, the Kwakwaka'wakw word for "killer whale" translates literally as "blackfish." We all know whales aren't fish, and orcas aren't totally black either. But before we all start decrying the scientific ignorance of the Kwakwaka'wakw language, keep in mind that all languages have their little quirks and ways of expressing things.
I would chase down that answer before I assumed a supernatural explanation.
I'm not quite sure if I understand?
If this is a question of linguistics I already know I won't be able to argue at that level but I DO know that the same word of "Thunderbird" was used by more than one Tribe. In fact it was used from the Alaskan indigenous peoples to the nomadic Plains Tribes.
" ...Thunderbird, a supernatural creature prominent in Northwest Coast Indigenous myths. Thunder and lightning are attributed to the thunderbird, which produces thunder by flapping its wings and lightning by opening and closing its eyes. The thunderbird is said to hunt whales, using its wings to shoot arrows. Among some Plains First Nations, thunderstorms are a contest between the thunderbird and a huge rattlesnake. Individuals who had been struck by lightning and survived often became Shamans, for they had received the power of the monster bird..."
All I know for sure is that a bird who's wings went "Boom" when he flapped them & had an almost 30ft wingspan was on my roof in 2006.
And that his wings had the power to knock me off my feet without them actually even touching me.
And; since I've grown up here in Southern Colorado & have a SIL who owns ranches in NM, AZ & TX, I DO know that the cattle mutilations are "real". I do know that they are finding cows on the ground with all their bones shattered & cows draped in tree tops & over power lines.
I WISH I new more about Native linguistics; I find linguistics, especially when it comes to translations, to be fascinating!
I saw it at night, fairly bright/full moon. As I was underneath it that created a very defined silhouette.
But not much detail. At all.
My parameters for being similar are due to: The shape/profile of the head & beak & neck. The shape/outline of the wings.
And I've always thought that what I saw had wings more skin-like than feathered due to the "unfurling" sound it made on the outstretch of the wings combined with the eardrum popping"boom" it made on the downswing combined with the force of air that knocked me backwards.
What I saw was slightly larger than what the pictures represent.
Unfortunately; that one flap/launch/scream(squak? croak? similar to the cry of an eagle but mixed with the croak of a bullfrog) was the first & last that I have ever seen.
In less than a minute it was over & nothing but a punctured/damaged roof to "show" for it. So frustrating.
Editing to add: I have not once in the last 10 years ever stepped outside at night without looking up first. It's a learned response from how intense this one encounter was. But yes, I find myself scanning the skies at sunset & during full moons because I know it's there. Probably a once-in-a-lifetime thing, though.
Thanks for the information. Like you and others, it'd be great to be able to make some kind of reasonable identification of what you saw. You've mentioned that the incident has left a very strong impression on you over the last 10 years with few answers. That would be understandably frustrating.
First of all, Old Guard is right. The photos you posted are not of a real creature. The 'Civil War' photo is from a TV series called "FreakyLinks". The episode was titled "Coelacanth This". It shows the exact same photo of Civil War soldiers posing around the creature. The photo itself was real, but scene isn't. The soldiers were extras dressed in Union Army Civil War uniforms and the creature was just a prop. You can see the episode in the link below that shows the 'Civil War' era photo. The episode is entertaining, kind of like a mix of X-Files and Blair Witch Project. "FreakyLinks" was a short-lived series that was made by 20th Century Fox. There were 13 episodes from 2000 to 2001 before it was scrapped. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/FreakyLinks
However, part of the current problem with the 'Civil War' photo circulating on the internet is that there are numerous websites and forums have posted this photo giving the impression that it's authentic. Maybe some believe that it's true, but it isn't. It's just Hollywood.
Check the video below to see the episode with the 'Civil War' photo. The episode is kind of a mix of X-Files and Blair Witch Project. It's actually pretty entertaining.
I don't recall seeing the "Old West" photo in the Freakylinks episode. I wouldn't be surprised if it might be a photoshop image from Worth 1000.
Second of all, don't worry about credibility. If someone doesn't like it, that's too bad. More important is the interactive learning from others as well as sharing what you know.
Can you describe a little more about the shape of the head and beak?
You've mentioned punctured damage to the roof of the house. Is the roof peaked or flat? How large were the punctures? Did it look like it was done by something standing on 2 feet? Or something on 4 feet? Did the punctures just damage the shingles? Or did they go completely through the wood of the roof?
Someone asked earlier, but I'd like to ask again, did you take any photos of the damage? I'm assuming you have insurance coverage for your house. Did you report the damage to your insurance agent?
I can see you're calling it a "Thunderbird", but how can you be sure that's what it was? The reason I'm asking is because the Thunderbird is not always directly seen because it's often regarded to be a spiritual being or sacred forces of nature and thought to be accompanied by eagles and hawks. However, some consider them to be powerful members of the animal kingdom. Different tribes have different traditions. When it is seen, it seems it's often in 'visions'. Native American Thunder Bird The Thunderbird: Native American Myths and Legends (Thunder-Birds) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thunderbird_(mythology)
Thanks for the information. Like you and others, it'd be great to be able to make some kind of reasonable identification of what you saw. You've mentioned that the incident has left a very strong impression on you over the last 10 years with few answers. That would be understandably frustrating.
First of all, Old Guard is right. The photos you posted are not of a real creature. The 'Civil War' photo is from a TV series called "FreakyLinks". The episode was titled "Coelacanth This". It shows the exact same photo of Civil War soldiers posing around the creature. The photo itself was real, but scene isn't. The soldiers were extras dressed in Union Army Civil War uniforms and the creature was just a prop. You can see the episode in the link below that shows the 'Civil War' era photo. The episode is entertaining, kind of like a mix of X-Files and Blair Witch Project. "FreakyLinks" was a short-lived series that was made by 20th Century Fox. There were 13 episodes from 2000 to 2001 before it was scrapped. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/FreakyLinks
However, part of the current problem with the 'Civil War' photo circulating on the internet is that there are numerous websites and forums have posted this photo giving the impression that it's authentic. Maybe some believe that it's true, but it isn't. It's just Hollywood.
Check the video below to see the episode with the 'Civil War' photo. The episode is kind of a mix of X-Files and Blair Witch Project. It's actually pretty entertaining.
I don't recall seeing the "Old West" photo in the Freakylinks episode. I wouldn't be surprised if it might be a photoshop image from Worth 1000.
Second of all, don't worry about credibility. If someone doesn't like it, that's too bad. More important is the interactive learning from others as well as sharing what you know.
Can you describe a little more about the shape of the head and beak?
You've mentioned punctured damage to the roof of the house. Is the roof peaked or flat? How large were the punctures? Did it look like it was done by something standing on 2 feet? Or something on 4 feet? Did the punctures just damage the shingles? Or did they go completely through the wood of the roof?
Someone asked earlier, but I'd like to ask again, did you take any photos of the damage? I'm assuming you have insurance coverage for your house. Did you report the damage to your insurance agent?
I can see you're calling it a "Thunderbird", but how can you be sure that's what it was? The reason I'm asking is because the Thunderbird is not always directly seen because it's often regarded to be a spiritual being or sacred forces of nature and thought to be accompanied by eagles and hawks. However, some consider them to be powerful members of the animal kingdom. Different tribes have different traditions. When it is seen, it seems it's often in 'visions'. Native American Thunder Bird The Thunderbird: Native American Myths and Legends (Thunder-Birds) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thunderbird_(mythology)
Thank you for your interest!
See; DARN it. I wish I wouldn't have bothered with those dumb photos!
I use the terminology of "Thunderbird" due to a response I received from a Cryptozoologist from the UK who stated "I believe that you saw a Thunderbird."
My own immediate off the cuff terminology was "I think I just saw a Pterodactyl" to a friend of mine. After her BF cracked up hysterically for 10 minutes I NEVER used that word again.
I have spent hours upon hours pouring over pictures of birds. When the option exists I will change my on-line search terms to "silhouette" so that it is most applicable & even have used "in-flight" so I could do the best comparison possible.
Initially I was side-tracked by Owls; due to the fact that I saw him in the middle of the night. Some of the info was helpful, regarding Nocturnal Birds of Prey but the visual presentation was really, REALLY off.
NOTHING about the Head /Neck/Beak of Owls are relevant to what I saw.
The Turkey Vulture comes close:
As to the roof; here is a Google Maps Street View of that house. The red line represents wing-span. The green box represents the area of roof damaged. The damage of deep scratches were on either side of the "peak". The puncture marks were all on the "front" side of the peak. There were 6 punctures total, all approx. 3ft in distance away from each other. My husband is the one that saw them & he described them as being in somewhat a "tripod" arrangement:
I do so wish I had the photos from the pre-sale inspection in 2010 but I don't. I have also tried Google Earth Imagery; they have an image available from 2006 but it is of very poor quality.
Just for "fun"; to show the kind of Urban/Wildlife Interface issues we have, I've included two GE photos. The first is taken from the NE looking West. The large Mountain is Pikes Peak, the red rocks jutting up are the Garden of The Gods Park I mentioned in an earlier post. The white circle is the house:
This one is from directly over Garden of the Gods looking East. Again; the house is the white circle:
Funny fact; two years ago I went with my son's 5th grade class field trip to GOG. One of the kids asked the park ranger "What's all that white stuff streaked on the rocks?" (visible in the pic) The Ranger laughed & said "Thats actually BIRD POOP; we just haven't figured out why there is so much of it right now."
See; DARN it. I wish I wouldn't have bothered with those dumb photos!
There's nothing dumb about the photos. Since you don't have any photos from your own experience, I gathered the pics you posted were to show something similar to what you saw. However, you did indicate that you didn't know if the Civil War pics were authentic or not. As such, it was worth mentioning that they do not portray any such living creature that was killed during the Civil War. It was just a prop. And by posting the video of the TV episode it was from was to show the source, which was done in the early 2000's and not the mid-1800's. But there are people who seem to think those pictures are the real deal, if you see what I mean.
Quote:
Originally Posted by coschristi
I use the terminology of "Thunderbird" due to a response I received from a Cryptozoologist from the UK who stated "I believe that you saw a Thunderbird."
It's a good idea to take certain things with a grain of salt. You're in Colorado. How would a cryptozoologist from England know it was probably a Thunderbird? Are there any real Thunderbirds? It depends on whether they are actual animals or if they are spiritual entities. He could've just as easily have speculated that it might be a giant Roc. What do you think? Do you think it was a Thunderbird? The links I posted about Thunderbirds was to help better understand.
Quote:
Originally Posted by coschristi
My own immediate off the cuff terminology was "I think I just saw a Pterodactyl" to a friend of mine. After her BF cracked up hysterically for 10 minutes I NEVER used that word again.
Regardless of the guy who cracked up, do you think it's possible it might have been a pterodactyl?
Quote:
Originally Posted by coschristi
I have spent hours upon hours pouring over pictures of birds. When the option exists I will change my on-line search terms to "silhouette" so that it is most applicable & even have used "in-flight" so I could do the best comparison possible.
Initially I was side-tracked by Owls; due to the fact that I saw him in the middle of the night. Some of the info was helpful, regarding Nocturnal Birds of Prey but the visual presentation was really, REALLY off.
NOTHING about the Head /Neck/Beak of Owls are relevant to what I saw.
I would agree that it's not likely an owl. There are some large owls. but none even remotely as large as what you saw, based on the width of the wingspan in the photo of your house.
With regard to the head/neck and beak shapes, you seem to think it's somewhat similar to how a turkey looks. So then the beak was not elongated, sort of like an alligator's jaws, and the head didn't have a long crest stretching back?
Pteranodons have a long crest on the back of their heads, and pterodactylus have a short crest. Both have long snouts and could fly. Apparently, pterosaurs with long beaks were usually toothless. Some of those with short beaks did have teeth, but some didn't. There are numerous varieties and sizes of these kinds of creatures, including small one. Some with wingspans as long as 23' to 36'. That's pretty wide. Some may have been as tall as a giraffe. I'm not sure how wide your house is, but probably wider than the pterosaurs. I would think a creature that large would likely cause some serious damage to your roof. Like breaking through the lumber type of damage. Pterodactyl, Pteranodon & Other Flying 'Dinosaurs' https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pterosaur
Quote:
Originally Posted by coschristi
As to the roof; here is a Google Maps Street View of that house. The red line represents wing-span. The green box represents the area of roof damaged. The damage of deep scratches were on either side of the "peak". The puncture marks were all on the "front" side of the peak. There were 6 punctures total, all approx. 3ft in distance away from each other. My husband is the one that saw them & he described them as being in somewhat a "tripod" arrangement:
So the damage to the roof was limited to deep scratches on either side of the peak, but 6 puncture marks on the front side of the peak. Are you saying that each puncture mark went though the lumber of the roof? If they were tripod in arrangement, it sounds like you mean 3 toes of two feet caused the 6 punctures. I'm wondering why 3 toes on each foot? Apparently pterosaurs have 4 toes, two longer ones in the middle and two shorter ones on the sides. There was also webbing between the toes.
Here's something else about pterosaurs. It had been thought that they achieved flight by jumping off cliffs to begin soaring and that they tended to live new oceans. Now, there's some thought that they might have lived farther inland. It's also thought that they might not necessarily needed to jump off cliffs, but could leap into the air from the ground using all four feet, high enough to begin flight. If that's the case, then I would think there would likely be marks from all four feet to maintain it's balance on the roof peak. But then you're roof isn't all that steep. What are those 6 white marks near the peak of the roof? Are they vents?
Too bad you weren't able to photograph the damage. I've done things like that and later think after the fact, why didn't I take some pictures of it?
It's a good idea to take certain things with a grain of salt. You're in Colorado. How would a cryptozoologist from England know it was probably a Thunderbird? Are there any real Thunderbirds? It depends on whether they are actual animals or if they are spiritual entities. He could've just as easily have speculated that it might be a giant Roc. What do you think? Do you think it was a Thunderbird? The links I posted about Thunderbirds was to help better understand.
Regardless of the guy who cracked up, do you think it's possible it might have been a pterodactyl?
I would agree that it's not likely an owl. There are some large owls. but none even remotely as large as what you saw, based on the width of the wingspan in the photo of your house.
With regard to the head/neck and beak shapes, you seem to think it's somewhat similar to how a turkey looks. So then the beak was not elongated, sort of like an alligator's jaws, and the head didn't have a long crest stretching back?
Pteranodons have a long crest on the back of their heads, and pterodactylus have a short crest. Both have long snouts and could fly. Apparently, pterosaurs with long beaks were usually toothless. Some of those with short beaks did have teeth, but some didn't. There are numerous varieties and sizes of these kinds of creatures, including small one. Some with wingspans as long as 23' to 36'. That's pretty wide. Some may have been as tall as a giraffe. I'm not sure how wide your house is, but probably wider than the pterosaurs. I would think a creature that large would likely cause some serious damage to your roof. Like breaking through the lumber type of damage. Pterodactyl, Pteranodon & Other Flying 'Dinosaurs' https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pterosaur
So the damage to the roof was limited to deep scratches on either side of the peak, but 6 puncture marks on the front side of the peak. Are you saying that each puncture mark went though the lumber of the roof? If they were tripod in arrangement, it sounds like you mean 3 toes of two feet caused the 6 punctures. I'm wondering why 3 toes on each foot? Apparently pterosaurs have 4 toes, two longer ones in the middle and two shorter ones on the sides. There was also webbing between the toes.
Here's something else about pterosaurs. It had been thought that they achieved flight by jumping off cliffs to begin soaring and that they tended to live new oceans. Now, there's some thought that they might have lived farther inland. It's also thought that they might not necessarily needed to jump off cliffs, but could leap into the air from the ground using all four feet, high enough to begin flight. If that's the case, then I would think there would likely be marks from all four feet to maintain it's balance on the roof peak. But then you're roof isn't all that steep. What are those 6 white marks near the peak of the roof? Are they vents?
Too bad you weren't able to photograph the damage. I've done things like that and later think after the fact, why didn't I take some pictures of it?
Thank you for the links! I read each & every one.
The reason I chose to communicate with the Cryptozoologist in the UK was based on simple research of credentials & educational status. He holds a Doctorate & I was looking for the most viable expert available.
I believe his use of the word "Thunderbird" was due to a very detailed description I gave regarding the percussive nature of this birds take-off wing flap.
Without a doubt, the single most stunning aspect of this experience was the eardrum popping "Boom" of the wings. His wings did not "bring" the thunder; his wings MADE the thunder.
I can't even begin to explain the roof damage rationally but before I heard the "Boom" I heard the sound of bricks tumbling down. But there were no bricks & not even a tile fell on me. Imagine how it would sound if a large, hooved animal were set down on top of a roof & began scrambling for it's footing. Thats EXACTLY how it sounded!
I'm sure my knee-jerk initial statement regarding "Pterodactyl" was due to the croaking scream it made as it took off. Nothing with feathers has ever made a sound like that. Nothing I have EVER heard has sounded like THAT.
As far as a "crest" I can't be sure as I was underneath it. I found many, many parrallels with the Turkey Vulture.
But there is one problem that I have not mentioned yet which would disqualify both Vuture & Pterodactyl.
Both lack the wing structure to initiate a powerfull take off. Both depend(ed) on wind currents & "Thermals" for flight.
In fact , most birds are not capable of using a wing to generate the vortex needed for the launch I witnessed (and especially due to it's size).
The only thing capable of that in our realm of known species; isn't even a bird at all.
It's a mammal: The Vampire Bat.
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.
Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
