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"“If a thing loves, it is infinite.”"
(set 3 days ago)
Location: Great Britain
27,185 posts, read 13,469,799 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kevxu
This was a very disturbing twist on an already ugly story.
In several accounts I have read or heard that she was "advised" to leave the U.K. I would like to know just who gave her this advice and why, especially if it turns out that the couple did not have immunity. If it was a U.S. diplomatic staff person we shall probably never know, of course.
Not only is this an ugly story, it also sets a precedent.
There are a number of US Spy bases and other bases in the UK, and most locals are not aware that those based there might have immunity to prosecution. Most people think immunity is confined to those who are diplomats based at the US Embassy in London.
The fact that a dependent can just leave the country without even engaging properly in terms of the police investigation is fairly disgusting and it also turns out that Anne Socoolas had previously been before the US Courts in Virginia before in relation to a driving fine for failure to pay full time and attention whilst driving.
As for US Visting Forces (Military), they are usually dealt with in such circumstances by the US Military Courts, indeed there is even a USAF military detention facility at RAF Lakenheath in England for this purpose, with those sentenced for more than a year, inmates are either transferred to Fort Leavenworth, Kan., Miramar Naval Brig, Calif., or Charleston Air Force Base, S.C. However civilian dependents can not generally be tried in military courts, so they usually answer to normal Criminal Courts.
The family are not asking that this woman be given a long prison sentence, they just want her to come back, show some remorse and to apologise and it would then be up to the athorities in relation to any charges. Alternatively she should face the US Courts back home, just as US Visting Forces face US Military Courts. Either way at least justice would be done.
If Anne Socoolas is allowed to just walk away with impunity, most people living near US Military facilities in the UK, Europe and beyond are going to have to live in fear that persnnel based at US Military and Intelligence facilities and their dependents are above national law and they can act and drive as they please with impuninity. This is the message that is being sent out by all of this.
Last edited by Brave New World; 10-09-2019 at 05:57 AM..
Sure, unless that bad actor is the state they're assigned to.
For instance, suppose a UK diplomat has their family in China, one night their son is caught with 1Kg of heroin. Has he committed a crime? Wouldn't that depend on whether he really had that heroin, or whether the police planted it, because I'm sure the Chinese State could come to an arrangement with the diplomat in regards to the arrest and issue, regardless of the veracity of the events.
How do you shield against alleged malicious prosecution, and not against alleged crimes committed?
How? Have U.S. investigators review any evidence and prosecute on U.S. soil if the alleged evidence holds up. After all, it's not as if heroin possession is legal in the U.S. or if planting evidence never happens in countries which respect rule of law.
Quote:
Last fall, the conduct of a group of Toronto police officers was described by an Ontario judge as “egregiously wrongful.”
On Thursday, their alleged behaviour was put in criminal terms: perjury and obstruction of justice.
Four officers — two of them experienced major-crimes investigators — are facing a total of 17 charges stemming from a 2014 drug bust, after which a judge ruled police had “fabricated” a story that involved “planting” heroin in a car to justify a search.
Soberly announcing the charges against his officers Thursday, Toronto Police Chief Mark Saunders said there would be a review of the four officers’ prior cases conducted by the force’s professional standards unit and the Crown Attorney’s office, “to see if there is any other cause of concern.”
How? Have U.S. investigators review any evidence and prosecute on U.S. soil if the alleged evidence holds up. After all, it's not as if heroin possession is legal in the U.S. or if planting evidence never happens in countries which respect rule of law.
You don't understand the concept of compromise of government officials.
Regardless of whether the evidence is real or fabricated, the official has motivations to protect themselves or family from such real or fabricated evidence. Let's be honest, the US or UK is going to investigate or review only such cases as the host country demands they review, if the host country can be pacified by an action of such an official then there is real leverage against that official to pacify the host country.
Diplomats and their families can be shielded from malicious prosecution overseas while still being held accountable for any crimes they commit. It’s not brain science.
While this may be true in the UK , I wouldn't want to test it in China.
You don't understand the concept of compromise of government officials. . .
I'm in trouble then because I'm a permanent resident of Taiwan, own property in Japan, and am going to China on business at the end of this month. On the plus side I speak Mandarin Chinese.
I'm in trouble then because I'm a permanent resident of Taiwan, own property in Japan, and am going to China on business at the end of this month. On the plus side I speak Mandarin Chinese.
Stay tuned . . . .
I’ll bet Taipei has changed a bit since I lived there (1957-59). Actually lived in the rural suburb of Tianmu north of the river.
I’ll bet Taipei has changed a bit since I lived there (1957-59). Actually lived in the rural suburb of Tianmu north of the river.
The old U.S. army base just across the Keelung River is now a park with restaurants and an art museum and Songshan Airport is a regional commercial aviation hub. The MRT system is probably the major change though. World class and gets you anywhere including the airport in Taoyuan with one or two transfers.
I'm in trouble then because I'm a permanent resident of Taiwan, own property in Japan, and am going to China on business at the end of this month. On the plus side I speak Mandarin Chinese.
Stay tuned . . . .
Which means nothing in relation to my point. Do you have security clearance to access information that your government holds classified or above? Are you a primary decision maker or influencer as to the foreign policy of any government or international organization such as the WTO, United Nations, etc.?
Or are you the same as every other ******* who was born in one country, lives in another, and owns real estate in other countries and travels for work?
If the lady in question is not returned to the UK, as appears will be the case, then hopefully all the local businesses should simply refuse to serve US service personnel, not as a personal rebuttal you understand, but as a crystal clear indication to the US that we don not find the US government's actions acceptable.
If the lady in question is not returned to the UK, as appears will be the case, then hopefully all the local businesses should simply refuse to serve US service personnel, not as a personal rebuttal you understand, but as a crystal clear indication to the US that we don not find the US government's actions acceptable.
That's only going to hurt the local economy that typically relies on business with those bases. There is a commissary on base that sells most things service people and their families need VAT free, and much lower cost than the local economy. There's Amazon for everything else.
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