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The first past the post voting system is also as undemocratic as can be.
Don't get me started on that.. It effectively renders my vote as useless, because I live in a commuter belt close to London full of rich city workers, my constituency is often 60%+ conservative so my vote is pointless. Should be every vote for itself.
One thing I disagree with the remain campaign is the fear mongering that we will be alienated if we do leave.. I think if we vote to leave then it is very likely that other countries will follow.. not that I want us to leave mind.
Every single person that I know who supports Brexit only supports it because of immigration. They have not even considered all the side effects of leaving the EU, such as a rise in unemployment, rise in interest rates & likely heading into another recession... It is so frustrating as what they fail to realise is that most immigrants are from other EU countries & they actually add to the economy & fill jobs & pay taxes, the refugees the UK would still have to take in their share of anyway...
I am a Brexit supporter, I know full well that leaving will have negative impacts. I am still prepared to vote leave because I know that Britain is a strong country and will come out the other side doing better.
For me it is a question of sovereignty/immigration/international trade. I don't have a problem with immigrants so to speak, I just don't see why Britain should have unrestricted immigration to mainland Europeans.
We need to introduce a points based immigration system akin to America/Australia.
Don't get me started on that.. It effectively renders my vote as useless, because I live in a commuter belt close to London full of rich city workers, my constituency is often 60%+ conservative so my vote is pointless. Should be every vote for itself.
One thing I disagree with the remain campaign is the fear mongering that we will be alienated if we do leave.. I think if we vote to leave then it is very likely that other countries will follow.. not that I want us to leave mind.
Yeah, I know. The LibDem have suffered a lot with that method, and as you say, your vote is useless if the district is majority Tory or Labour.
I would say that the fearmongers are right. UK will get no mercy from the EU, and some economists say that a Brexit might cost 100 billion £ immediately. I don't think that's an unrealistic figure.
I am a Brexit supporter, I know full well that leaving will have negative impacts. I am still prepared to vote leave because I know that Britain is a strong country and will come out the other side doing better.
For me it is a question of sovereignty/immigration/international trade. I don't have a problem with immigrants so to speak, I just don't see why Britain should have unrestricted immigration to mainland Europeans.
We need to introduce a points based immigration system akin to America/Australia.
Britain is not as strong as it once once & I just don't understand why anyone would be prepared for those negatve impacts leaving the EU would have. The EU isn't perfect & it does need changes, I just feel leaving would be a massive mistake & done because of a "knee jerk" reaction to the refugee crisis in Europe. Free movement in the EU works both ways too, for all those going to the EU, there are just as many who have left the UK to live & work in other EU countries. I agree that immigrants from other countries outside the EU should have a points based system, but already it isn't that easy for people to simply go to the UK to live.
As I mentioned too the UK would still have to take in a quota of refugees, not forgetting that the UK only agreed to take a tiny percentage of the Syrian refugees anyway compared to how many other EU nations took, look how many Germany took for example...
Eh, not really. It can stop bills from going forward in certain situations and can delay them. It can be useful if a government wants to propose something harmful but it's certainly not democratic.
Quote:
Originally Posted by nei
With a two-party system it's fine democracy-wise
Having only two major parties is a symptom of FPTP though. The US situation isn't really enviable or desirable. You end up with a lot of people forced into voting for a party they don't necessarily like because there is no alternative.
In the UK, it's less clear cut, because we have FPTP but more parties with representation in government. The Scottish National Party got 1,454,436 votes in 2015, and got 50 seats in the House of Commons. UKIP got 4,376,635 votes but only 1 seat in the House of Commons. Liberal Democrats got a similar number to the SNP and was left with only 7 seats in the House of Commons. The Green Party got 1.1 million votes and had only 1 seat in the House of Commons.
In the UK at present it is extremely undemocratic and not proportional. Millions of votes were essentially rendered irrelevant. Every political party in the UK supports electoral reform except the ruling party - the Conservatives.
No, I don't think the UK is very democratic and I don't think the EU is less democratic. Probably the opposite.
Last edited by dunno what to put here; 06-22-2016 at 03:00 PM..
The NBI (the Finnish equivalent of the FBI) catched a wanted Czech pedophile at large yesterday in Turku. Without the EU common police cooperation this wouldn't been possible.
While the general focus is on "they are taking our independence", the EU organisations do a lot of good too.
Doesn't feel like 12am at all. Going to try and go to bed at 1am even though that will be difficult.
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