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I don't think developed countries consist of three countries. The fact that you have to handpick countries show how bogus your arguments are. And even in those countries, the people living on the streets are not just drug addicts. You need to be a resident to get these benefits.
These are the countries with the highest effective minimum wage! You are the one who try to scream doom and gloom as a result of that high minimum wage. When you are proven wrong you want to switch subject and talk about Greece and Italy! I have never said Greece and Italy have a high minimum wage.
Yes, the people living on the streets in these countries with high minimum wage are drug addicts by and large. And you are right that tourists cant get benefits if they cant afford the hotel room. But to claim that the benefits provided to their residents are useless and the same as in America where anyone who loses their job or get sick can become homeless at any moment is just absurd.
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Originally Posted by Camlon
How exactly? Cheap day care cost $100 - $150 per week in most states, school is free, cost of food is low relative to the rest of the word. Your response will be, but that day care is not good enough. That is just you who want middle class lifestyle on a minimum wage.
$12 000 a year is the bare minimum cost for center-based child care at a decent standard in America. Public transit is basically non-existent. Prescription drugs, higher education, health care, hospitalization, all extremely expensive in America. Air fares are through the roof (but it doesnt matter for minimum wage workers in America because they get NO vacation anyway, just like half of all workers). And dont get me started on the lackluster retirement situation for minimum wage workers. People simply become homeless because they are retired. Its a disgrace. And if you are disabled and can no longer walk or talk on your own, you get a maximum $700 a month. Is this how America should treat the most vulnerable in society?
These are the countries with the highest effective minimum wage! You are the one who try to scream doom and gloom as a result of that high minimum wage. When you are proven wrong you want to switch subject and talk about Greece and Italy! I have never said Greece and Italy have a high minimum wage.
And according to the cost adjusted minimum wages, they also have highest minimum wage. No one is questioning that they are great countries, I am questioning why you handpick countries.
We all know why, because a real comparison would totally fail. And even among your hand picked countries Australia only provide 4 months of parental leave, not 12 months like you claimed.
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Yes, the people living on the streets in these countries with high minimum wage are drug addicts by and large. And you are right that tourists cant get benefits if they cant afford the hotel room. But to claim that the benefits provided are useless and the same as in America where anyone who loses their job or get sick can become homeless at any moment is just absurd.
You obviously know nothing about Europe, because that is not even remotely true. By far, the largest group of homeless are migrants from inside and outside the EU. They outnumber drug addicts more than 10 to 1.
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$12 000 a year is the bare minimum cost for center-based child care at a decent standard in America. Public transit is basically non-existent. Prescription drugs, higher education, health care, hospitalization, all extremely expensive in America. Air fares are through the roof (but it doesnt matter for minimum wage workers in America because they get NO vacation anyway, just like half of all workers in America). And dont get me started on the lackluster retirement situation for minimum wage workers. People simply become homeless because they are retired. Its a disgrace. And if you are disabled and can no longer walk or talk on your own, you get a maximum $700 a month. Is this how America should treat the most vulnerable in society?
And I was right. You don't actually have a problem finding cheap day care, you just don't want the cheap options. If you want a middle class lifestyle, then get a middle class salary.
And the rest has been debunked. US got buses, that often are cheaper than Europe. In Copenhagen a transport pass cost $150, does that sound affordable to you? Most employers give some vacation. The retirement suck in many European countries too. For instance it is not uncommon for Swedish elderly to starve to death, not because they cannot afford food, but because no one helps them make their food. And in many European countries electricity prices are through the roof, and people die when they cut off electricity.
The only think you manage is to see advantages of European countries, but you are not capable of seeing the disadvantages.
And according to the adjusted minimum wages, they also have highest minimum wage. No one is questioning that they are great countries, I am questioning why you handpick countries.
We all know why, because a real comparison would totally fail. And even among your hand picked countries Australia only provide 4 months of parental leave, not 12 months like you claimed.
You obviously know nothing about Europe, because that is not even remotely true. By far, the largest group of homeless are migrants from inside and outside the EU. They outnumber drug addicts more than 10 to 1.
And I was right. You don't actually have a problem finding cheap day care, you just don't want the cheap options. If you want a middle class lifestyle, then get a middle class salary.
And the rest has been debunked. US got buses, that often are cheaper than Europe. In Copenhagen a transport pass cost $150, does that sound affordable to you? Most employers give some vacation. The retirement suck in many European countries too. For instance it is not uncommon for Swedish elderly to starve to death, not because they cannot afford food, but because no one helps them make their food. And in many European countries electricity prices are through the roof, and people die when they cut off electricity.
The only think you manage is to see advantages of European countries, but you are not capable of seeing the disadvantages.
You are clutching at straws! Sure, you can find cheap crappy child care where one former felon is responsible for your small child and 20 other small children for 9 hours every day! Oh, how great!
Public transit in America is a joke compared to developed Europe. In America it is essential to have a car. The costs of car ownership is MUCH higher than public transit. Thats just a fact. You are desperate in your attempt to prove something which cant be proven. Regarding homeless migrants in European countries, they are not residents, so your point is meaningless. I have never argued that tourists should get the same benefits as residents! The residents of the country are provided benefits to prevent them from being homeless, if you are still homeless then it is extremely likely that you are a drug addict. Its totally different than America where the government doesnt provide anything for the people, only for the donor class. HALF of all workers in America had no vacation at all last year. NONE! And another huge proportion fear for their jobs and the constant risk of homelessness if they do take vacation. Its a different world altogether compared to Denmark, Switzerland etc where any worker, minimum wage worker or someone making $100 000 a year can get at least 4 weeks paid vacation.
Denmark, Australia, Switzerland and a handful of other countries have the highest effective minimum wage in the world and there is no doom and gloom in these countries unlike what you claim. The stuff you talk about is just meaningless anecdotes where you read or heard something that happened in that country.
You are clutching at straws! Sure, you can find cheap crappy child care where one former felon is responsible for your small child and 20 other small children for 9 hours every day! Oh, how great!
Public transit in America is a joke compared to developed Europe. In America it is essential to have a car. The costs of car ownership is MUCH higher than public transit. Thats just a fact. You are desperate in your attempt to prove something which cant be proven. Regarding homeless migrants in European countries, they are not residents, so your point is meaningless. I have never argued that tourists should get the same benefits as residents! The residents of the country are provided benefits to prevent them from being homeless, if you are still homeless then it is extremely likely that you are a drug addict. Its totally different than America where the government doesnt provide anything for the people, only for the donor class. HALF of all workers in America had no vacation at all last year. NONE! And another huge proportion fear for their jobs and the constant risk of homelessness if they do take vacation. Its a different world altogether compared to Denmark, Switzerland etc where any worker, minimum wage worker or someone making $100 000 a year can get at least 4 weeks paid vacation.
Denmark, Australia, Switzerland and a handful of other countries have the highest effective minimum wage in the world and there is no doom and gloom in these countries unlike what you claim. The stuff you talk about is just meaningless anecdotes where you read or heard something that happened in that country.
Europeans largely live in metro areas where public transit is well developed. America is very spread out with many people living in places that do not have the population to warrant a public transit system.
Europeans largely live in metro areas where public transit is well developed. America is very spread out with many people living in places that do not have the population to warrant a public transit system.
I never argued why it is the way it is, just that transportation costs are much higher for lower income people in America than in other developed countries with extensive public transit.
You are clutching at straws! Sure, you can find cheap crappy child care where one former felon is responsible for your small child and 20 other small children for 9 hours every day! Oh, how great!
There are lots of options, they can't all be felons. If you live in the city, it might lack an outside playing area, but you cannot expect middle class lifestyle on minimum wage.
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Public transit in America is a joke compared to developed Europe. In America it is essential to have a car. The costs of car ownership is MUCH higher than public transit. Thats just a fact. You are desperate in your attempt to prove something which cant be proven.
It is not essential, again it is you who want a middle class lifestyle on minimum wage. There are many places in Europe where it is "essential" to have a car, people still can't afford it if they live on minimum wage, that is just reality.
As a minimum wage worker, you have to accept that some things will be a little more inconvenient.
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Regarding homeless migrants in European countries, they are not residents, so your point is meaningless. I have never argued that tourists should get the same benefits as residents! The residents of the country are provided benefits to prevent them from being homeless, if you are still homeless then it is extremely likely that you are a drug addict. Its totally different than America where the government doesnt provide anything for the people, only for the donor class.
So you don't really care about poor people, unless they are residents? In fact calling them tourist is very insulting, they work and live in those countries. Hardly tourists.
Also, this is only in your hand picked countries, if we visit some other countries, then you will also find residents on the street. Hardly the benefit nirvana that you claim it to be.
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Denmark, Australia, Switzerland and a handful of other countries have the highest effective minimum wage in the world and there is no doom and gloom in these countries unlike what you claim. The stuff you talk about is just meaningless anecdotes where you read or heard something that happened in that country.
First, the adjusted minimum wage data did show a higher minimum wage in Australia and the effective minimum wage in Switzerland and Denmark is even higher, so I do not even know what you are complaining about.
And again I will remind you that the developed world consist of more than 3 countries. The fact that you keep referring to your three hand picked countries show everyone how bogus your argument is. If you look at all developed countries, and not just your hand picked ones, then you will notice that minimum wage workers struggle on both continents.
And again I will remind you that the developed world consist of more than 3 countries. The fact that you keep referring to your three hand picked countries show everyone how bogus your argument is.
Those countries are specifically mentioned because they have the highest effective minimum wage in the world and there is no doom and gloom in these countries as a result, unlike what you claim would happen with a higher minimum wage. You refuse to accept it, and instead want to talk about corrupt Greece and Italy (which does not have a high minimum wage).
Those countries are specifically mentioned because they have the highest effective minimum wage in the world and there is no doom and gloom in these countries as a result, unlike what you claim would happen with a higher minimum wage. You refuse to accept it, and instead want to talk about corrupt Greece and Italy (which does not have a high minimum wage).
Now you are just trying to change your argument. What you are trying to prove is that the figure below is completely wrong, because welfare benefits are so much better in other western countries. I told you those welfare benefits are not as good as you have heard from progressive media.
Then when you try to show they are a benefit utopia, you pick Australia and two countries not even on the map. Great job!
I never argued why it is the way it is, just that transportation costs are much higher for lower income people in America than in other developed countries with extensive public transit.
yes, and that's mostly due to the requirement to own a personal vehicle in most places in the US. Many people can't afford to live in the city that they work in, so they commute long distances. I know some people commuting 3-4 hours a day.
I would hate to be low income and at the mercy of a vehicle. If it breaks down or you smash it up and can't get to work the low wage employer will fire you. Why would they care? They have a stack of applicants ready to replace you. And this is becoming true of skilled labor jobs as well.
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