New Atlanta airport master plan eyes new gates, sixth runway (Columbus: sale, hotel)

[Robbyb03]

1. If the airport built a "Victor Loop" on the south side, it would make easily make the airport more efficient.
2. The taxi from RWY 10/28 is not terrible at all at the moment, but would greatly benefit when aircraft land/depart RWY 10/28 if they didn't have to cross active runways.
3. If they put a terminal between 9R and 10 and it cuts out sight lines from the tower, a new control tower will have to be built for safety purposes. There is no way cameras would go over well in a safety culture. If it doesn't affect sight lines, then a new terminal between 9R and 10 would be great with a 6th runway south of I-285.
4. The best plan would be to build a "Victor Loop" on the south side and, when needed, put a 6th runway between 9R and 10 with its own "Victor Loop" around RWY 10 to connect to a new terminal south of I-285. This idea assumes that a new terminal between 9R and 10 would cause a new tower to be built otherwise.

[bu2]

Originally Posted by Robbyb03

"Circle the airport..." What are you talking about? Rarely do aircraft circle the airport. If you land on the north side, you most likely take the Victor loop so you don't have to cross an active departure runway. Depending on the operation (east/west) you may have to wait for departing traffic on the south side or you simply taxi behind the departures.

I can assure you that no one "waits for gates on the runway."

By circle the airport, I mean circling around the city in the air waiting for approval to land. I've done that. I've also waited 45 minutes on the tarmac (are you satisfied with that term?) for a gate. And I've had substantial waits on the tarmac at other times. When the flight is late, its tough to get in. And Delta is late a lot.

[cwkimbro]

Originally Posted by bu2

By circle the airport, I mean circling around the city in the air waiting for approval to land. I've done that. I've also waited 45 minutes on the tarmac (are you satisfied with that term?) for a gate. And I've had substantial waits on the tarmac at other times. When the flight is late, its tough to get in. And Delta is late a lot.

yea and as a frequent flier I get what you're saying, but it is misleading to say its common. It isn't common and hasn't been for some time.

It has been relatively rare ever since the 5th runway constructed, except when there are traffic fluctuations caused by weather events that are outside both the airline's and airport's control.

Out of all my flights... I think I've only had one flight that circled this year.

[AtlantaIsHot]

Originally Posted by PacoMartin

Excuse me for laughing. Do you know how many cities much larger than Atlanta are trying to make do with tiny airports? LAX, San Diego, London Heathrow, London Gatwick, Newark Airport, La Guardia, and Boston are just a few.

Some of your examples are flat out wrong... San Diego isn't larger than Atlanta, it's quite a bit smaller. It's metro only has 3.1 million. Boston isn't "much larger" than Atlanta either. Boston's metro is smaller and it's CSA is about 8 million compared to Atlanta's 6.2 million. London's urbanized area has a population of about 9 million with a couple million more in the commuter belt.

Airport expansion could be forced through imminent domain I would imagine. In preparation for future expansion of Hartsfield, Clayton and Fulton should restrict any zoning or building permits for the surrounding area so there won't be so much development crammed in around it.

[Gulch]

Originally Posted by AtlantaIsHot

Airport expansion could be forced through eminent domain I would imagine.

Fixed.

[Robbyb03]

Originally Posted by bu2

By circle the airport, I mean circling around the city in the air waiting for approval to land. I've done that. I've also waited 45 minutes on the tarmac (are you satisfied with that term?) for a gate. And I've had substantial waits on the tarmac at other times. When the flight is late, its tough to get in. And Delta is late a lot.

If you're "holding," it's most likely due to weather at the airport that isn't the control of the FAA, Delta Air Lines, ATL Airport Commission, et cetera. By the way, you're not holding over the city. You will be holding over somewhere 50-80 miles away from the airport. Right now, 81% of Delta flights into Atlanta (year to date) have been on time. Tarmac is a better term than runway because the later shows what little knowledge you have about what actually is occuring to get your flight to your destination and then home safely. Most controllable delays are airline induced. (Example: not everyone can leave NYC at 5 on a Friday and land in Chicago at 6). Scheduling is huge and the airlines into and out of Atlanta have done much better with that in recent years.

Time magazine article discussing "best airlines."
Delta Tops Airline Performance Rankings

RITA website with delays...
RITA | BTS | Title from h2

[bu2]

Originally Posted by cwkimbro

yea and as a frequent flier I get what you're saying, but it is misleading to say its common. It isn't common and hasn't been for some time.

It has been relatively rare ever since the 5th runway constructed, except when there are traffic fluctuations caused by weather events that are outside both the airline's and airport's control.

Out of all my flights... I think I've only had one flight that circled this year.

Some of it is caused by Atlanta's frequent afternoon thunderstorms backing everyone up (DFW has the same issue).

[cwkimbro]

Originally Posted by bu2

Some of it is caused by Atlanta's frequent afternoon thunderstorms backing everyone up (DFW has the same issue).

But that still makes what you were originally saying a bit of a stretch.

It isn't common. Its out of the airlines and airports control when that does happen. And most importantly... back to the original subject... it has little to do with the airport's design and operational efficiency for fliers. It is crazy efficient to handle the number of flights it does.

Now go back before the 5th runway was build... circling the airport was common back then. I remember those times quite well.

[bu2]

Originally Posted by cwkimbro

But that still makes what you were originally saying a bit of a stretch.

It isn't common. Its out of the airlines and airports control when that does happen. And most importantly... back to the original subject... it has little to do with the airport's design and operational efficiency for fliers. It is crazy efficient to handle the number of flights it does.

Now go back before the 5th runway was build... circling the airport was common back then. I remember those times quite well.

Its still not efficient for flyers. They've got the gates full which means delays on the tarmac. Having no vacant gates is efficient for the airlines, but not the flyers.

[cwkimbro]

Originally Posted by bu2

Its still not efficient for flyers. They've got the gates full which means delays on the tarmac. Having no vacant gates is efficient for the airlines, but not the flyers.

How much do you fly a year?