MGM’s pitch for a $1B casino in Downtown Atlanta (Cleveland: floors, designs)

[the resident09]

Originally Posted by jsvh

I have been around both. If you want high-end retail, a casino is not the way to attract it. Not that high-end retail is what we even want.

Downtown needs regular retail. Places to buy groceries, clothes for work and school, office supplies, etc. Not high-end boutiques.

The "National Harbor" Casino that is being held up as an example is not in downtown. It is outside the beltway near outlet malls. If you want to bring a mega casino here, do the same. Put it in the suburbs.

The key however is high end. MGM is not going to spend up to $2 billion on a property outside 285 in ATL suburbs. National harbor is already an existing large scale development already in use for outdoor events and conventions and shopping in the DC area WITHOUT the MGM property. It's also on a waterfront directly across from historic Old Town Alexandria with water taxis and Metrobus lines connecting it, which makes it that much more appealing of a destination all outside of the District proper. Again a very rare situation. I don't see as any outer Perimeter suburbs having any equivalence unfortunately. This would mean MGM looks to the urban core of Atlanta.

[the resident09]

Originally Posted by adelphi_sky

I picked MGM National Harbor only as an example of the amount of lighting new casinos try to incorporate into their floor plans. It's not as enclosed as Maryland Live or Baltimore Horseshoe.

You are correct on that, I was mainly getting at the overall location of the casino, but absolutely the National Harbor casino will by no means be a "fortress" type of building. With an outdoor plaza and ice skating rink, plus the natural light coming in.

[jsvh]

Originally Posted by the resident09

The key however is high end. MGM is not going to spend up to $2 billion on a property outside 285 in ATL suburbs. National harbor is already an existing large scale development already in use for outdoor events and conventions and shopping in the DC area WITHOUT the MGM property. It's also on a waterfront directly across from historic Old Town Alexandria with water taxis and Metrobus lines connecting it, which makes it that much more appealing of a destination all outside of the District proper. Again a very rare situation. I don't see as any outer Perimeter suburbs having any equivalence unfortunately. This would mean MGM looks to the urban core of Atlanta.

Then myself and others (including the downtown business association Downtown Atlanta group’s study casts doubt on gambling | AJC ) will fight it tooth and nail. No more dumping this BS in the urban core. They are a blight on the neighborhoods in which they locate.

[the resident09]

Originally Posted by jsvh

Then myself and others (including the downtown business association Downtown Atlanta group’s study casts doubt on gambling | AJC ) will fight it tooth and nail. No more dumping this BS in the urban core. They are a blight on the neighborhoods in which they locate.

What makes you think a $1.5- 2 billion entertainment property in the heart of any city is BS?

[jsvh]

Originally Posted by the resident09

What makes you think a $1.5- 2 billion entertainment property in the heart of any city is BS?

A Good Way to Wreck a Local Economy: Build Casinos - The Atlantic

Business-Economic Impacts Of Licensed Casino Gambling | Easy Money | FRONTLINE | PBS

Casinos and Economic Development: A Look at the Issues


They are like stadiums. They may bring people to an area, but not prosperity. If you think it does then, fine build it somewhere that wants it. Not the urban core. Not my neighborhood.

[the resident09]

Originally Posted by jsvh

A Good Way to Wreck a Local Economy: Build Casinos - The Atlantic

Business-Economic Impacts Of Licensed Casino Gambling | Easy Money | FRONTLINE | PBS

Casinos and Economic Development: A Look at the Issues


They are like stadiums. They may bring people to an area, but not prosperity. If you think it does then, fine build it somewhere that wants it. Not the urban core. Not my neighborhood.

Your thinking about slot palors, I'm referring to a world class resort/casino like MGM. I agree that the urban format could possibly be compromised depending on precise location. But when I say urban core it could be in any location close by, such as adjacent to a highway off ramp etc. It could essentially just be somewhere in that vicinity. Not on necessarily a prime urban street intersection.

My whole point to you is if they're coming to Atlanta and investing that type of money, they're coming to the urban core somewhere not Cumberland Mall or Perimeter.

[JMatl]

Originally Posted by the resident09

Your thinking about slot palors, I'm referring to a world class resort/casino like MGM. I agree that the urban format could possibly be compromised depending on precise location. But when I say urban core it could be in any location close by such as adjacent to a highway off ramp etc. It could essentially just be somewhere in that vicinity. Not on necessarily a prime urban intersection.

My whole point to you is if they're coming to Atlanta and investing that type of money, they're coming to the urban core somewhere not Cumberland Mall or Perimeter.

And most of us don't want this Downtown. Period.

[adelphi_sky]

Originally Posted by jsvh

A Good Way to Wreck a Local Economy: Build Casinos - The Atlantic

Business-Economic Impacts Of Licensed Casino Gambling | Easy Money | FRONTLINE | PBS

Casinos and Economic Development: A Look at the Issues


They are like stadiums. They may bring people to an area, but not prosperity. If you think it does then, fine build it somewhere that wants it. Not the urban core. Not my neighborhood.

They are in no way like stadiums. Stadiums sit empty 340+ days of the year. A casino that is properly integrated into the city with storefronts, a hotel, condos, bars, and shops would be active 365 days a year and perhaps 24 hours per day. Therefore you don't have two blocks held hostage most of the year not providing any activity or vibrancy to a city.

These casinos are not the casinos of the 70s and 80s where urban areas were on the downturn from urban flight to the suburbs. There are new factors to consider when dealing with Casinos in the era of revitalized downtowns and stronger economies.

Atlantic city fell because it didn't diversify its economy. There was nothing there but a beach town before casinos and the city felt casinos were all it needed to survive. When other border states began to allow gambling, the allure of Atlantic City wore off. Having no other economy besides gambling and hotels, Atlantic City was hurt being so heavily leveraged against casinos and not its main attraction, the ocean.

Atlanta is completely different. There is a strong economy there without gambling. Just like there is a strong economy in DC without gambling. If people stop gambling, the economies won't evaporate, just the casinos.

So I take those studies that assume casinos are bad with a grain of salt. They are bad in certain situations, but not all.

[jsvh]

Sure, one mega-casino is not going to sink the entire metro economy. But it will not help. In fact it will hurt the neighborhood it is in.

Put it OTP if you want one, there are more of the poor clientel casinos cater to there anyways, but these mega projects have got to stop in the core.

Can of you pro-casino folks give an example of an urban mega casino project you would hope for Atlanta to imitate? We don't need to make downtown into a "destination", it already is one. We need to make it into a neighborhood.

[magnetar]

Originally Posted by the resident09

The key however is high end. MGM is not going to spend up to $2 billion on a property outside 285 in ATL suburbs.

Sounds like there's no good location in the Atlanta region for a casino, then. If there's really a market for it, I'm sure the developers will find a location outside the city that's suitable. If not, no loss.