The Electoral College Explained (Decatur: living, move, office)

[Mutiny77]

The ironic thing here is that it could be argued that Trump's election is the very sort of the thing the Founding Fathers sought to prevent when they devised the Electoral College.

[arjay57]

Originally Posted by micstatic

It's simple. If their were no electoral college. The candidates would offer up a campaign that would promote projects within NYC, Los Angeles, Chicago, and Miami only. They wouldn't need to worry about the rest of the country and they could still get elected. It's a way of protecting people who live in smaller communities.

Yep, that's important. There are other pros and cons to the electoral college as well. (see below).

Personally I am okay with it, but I'd prefer proportional voting rather than the "winner takes all" situation we currently have in Georgia. If the popular vote is 50/50, then let half the electors go to one candidate and the other half go to the other candidate.

If I'm not mistaken, that's something we can change as a matter of state law.


Electoral College: Pros & Cons

[oldschoolChevy]

Originally Posted by LovinDecatur

Bingo. In our inception, we were by and large agrarian and very spread out. Many farmers would find it logistically impossible to access a polling place. The Electoral College was a means of inclusion for remote regions of the new nation. The Framers felt that an intermediary (the Elector) was needed to ensure that they were heard as well.

It's an antiquated system. Point blank period. 80% of Americans live in cities now. The days of most people living in rural areas are long gone. And I don't believe for one minute they put that system in place to protect people living in rural areas. Seems to me that they didn't want the regular folks to have a say from the get go. Our votes don't mean squat basically. If I live in Georgia and this is a red state, why does my vote even count if regardless of who I vote for, all the electoral votes go to one party anyway? And America has the nerve to go around the world starting wars to "preserve democracy" in other countries when we really don't even live in one ourselves. The simple fact that very few folks understand how the electoral college works shows that it's a sham. I'm sure if more people were keen to the workings of it they would call for it to end. But again, its deliberately confusing to keep us in the dark

[Aubie16]

Originally Posted by oldschoolChevy

It's an antiquated system. Point blank period. 80% of Americans live in cities now. The days of most people living in rural areas are long gone. And I don't believe for one minute they put that system in place to protect people living in rural areas. Seems to me that they didn't want the regular folks to have a say from the get go. Our votes don't mean squat basically. If I live in Georgia and this is a red state, why does my vote even count if regardless of who I vote for, all the electoral votes go to one party anyway? And America has the nerve to go around the world starting wars to "preserve democracy" in other countries when we really don't even live in one ourselves. The simple fact that very few folks understand how the electoral college works shows that it's a sham. I'm sure if more people were keen to the workings of it they would call for it to end. But again, its deliberately confusing to keep us in the dark

We don't live in a democracy. Never have. We live in a republic. That is a very important distinction and one that I do not wish to remove. It protects the rights of all better than a democracy does and always has.

I'm sorry you don't understand but the popular vote of each state very much matters. That is how we determine the electors (who are faithful over 99% of the time). Regardless, the presidential vote is very overrated. Local, state, and congressional elections are far more important to the actual laws that are passed. I wish people paid more attention to those.

The electoral college is not some "secret" system or a "sham". Votes absolutely matter, and the days of electors not following the will of the people are long gone. I was taught how it worked in AP Government and again in a government class in college. It stinks that your teacher evidently did not, but the research is not hard to conduct on your own. The electoral college helps preserve our system of federalism, which is crucial to our system of government.

[oldschoolChevy]

Originally Posted by Aubie16

We don't live in a democracy. Never have. We live in a republic. That is a very important distinction and one that I do not wish to remove. It protects the rights of all better than a democracy does and always has.

I'm sorry you don't understand but the popular vote of each state very much matters. That is how we determine the electors (who are faithful over 99% of the time). Regardless, the presidential vote is very overrated. Local, state, and congressional elections are far more important to the actual laws that are passed. I wish people paid more attention to those.

The electoral college is not some "secret" system or a "sham". Votes absolutely matter, and the days of electors not following the will of the people are long. I was taught how it worked in AP Government and again in a government class in college. It stinks that your teacher evidently did not, but the research is not hard to conduct on your own.

49% of the people in this state did not vote for Trump, but yet all the electoral college votes went to Trump. Clearly the 49% of people who voted for Clinton or Johnson cast ballots for no reason. Explain to me how the electoral voters in Georgia followed the will of the people when almost half didn't even vote for who they cast their ballots for. And please miss me with the veiled shots about "it stinks your teacher didn't teach you this". I'm trying to have a civil discussion. Let's not start slinging personal insults. If you want to take it there however I'm more than happy to get into the mud pit with you

[arjay57]

Originally Posted by Aubie16

We don't live in a democracy. Never have. We live in a republic. That is a very important distinction and one that I do not wish to remove. It protects the rights of all better than a democracy does and always has.

Totally agree. If we operated everything by simple majority rule, minorities (of all sorts) could be up the creek.

[Iconographer]

Originally Posted by oldschoolChevy

It's an antiquated system. Point blank period. 80% of Americans live in cities now. The days of most people living in rural areas are long gone. And I don't believe for one minute they put that system in place to protect people living in rural areas. Seems to me that they didn't want the regular folks to have a say from the get go. Our votes don't mean squat basically. If I live in Georgia and this is a red state, why does my vote even count if regardless of who I vote for, all the electoral votes go to one party anyway? And America has the nerve to go around the world starting wars to "preserve democracy" in other countries when we really don't even live in one ourselves. The simple fact that very few folks understand how the electoral college works shows that it's a sham. I'm sure if more people were keen to the workings of it they would call for it to end. But again, its deliberately confusing to keep us in the dark

First bolded statement: Without those 'non-existent' voters, Trump would not have won this election. Those that ignored them have done so at their own peril.
Second bolded statement: That's right, you don't live in a Democracy. You never have. You live in a Constitutional Republic.
Third bolded statement: If you're confused about the process, perhaps you should do some homework. No one is going to spoonfeed it to you.

[Aubie16]

Originally Posted by oldschoolChevy

49% of the people in this state did not vote for Trump, but yet all the electoral college votes went to Trump. Clearly the 49% of people who voted for Clinton or Johnson cast ballots for no reason. Explain to me how the electoral voters in Georgia followed the will of the people when almost half didn't even vote for who they cast their ballots for. And please miss me with the veiled shots about "it stinks your teacher didn't teach you this". I'm trying to have a civil discussion. Let's not start slinging personal insults. If you want to take it there however I'm more than happy to get into the mud pit with you

It works both ways. Only 48% of voters in Nevada and 49% of voters in Colorado voted for Clinton but she got all of those states electoral votes. The other voters in that state that voted for Trump/Johnson/Stein absolutely mattered. Just because you lose doesn't mean your vote didn't count.

By that logic, if we just had a national election and 49% of the voters voted for the losing candidate, did their votes "not matter"?

[oldschoolChevy]

Originally Posted by LovinDecatur

First bolded statement: Without those 'non-existent' voters, Trump would not have won this election. Those that ignored them have done so at their own peril.
Second bolded statement: That's right, you don't live in a Democracy. You never have. You live in a Constitutional Republic.
Third bolded statement: If you're confused about the process, perhaps you should do some homework. No one is going to spoonfeed it to you.

No I think I have a basic working knowledge of the process. While I'm for sure no constitutional lawyer I think I understand it better than most, as most Americans actually believe the popular vote elects the president. I however have known that wasn't the case since I witnessed Bush v Gore go down when I was in HS. I'm also well aware that America is a representative republic and not a democracy but it irritates me to no end that is constantly put forth as a democracy. Again, with all that said the electoral college is a sham and the POTUS should be decided by the popular vote.

[Mutiny77]

The United States is a constitutional republic and representative democracy.