Some Atlanta leaders want to start charging you to drive into the city (Dallas: property taxes, train)

[jsvh]

Originally Posted by arjay57

I wonder how the schoolteachers are going to get to class? And the police and firemen? Our city planners, bus drivers and trash collectors? The secretaries for the big law firms, the restaurant workers, the water system folks and the construction workers?

The same way they get to work in the many places tolls already exist.

If money is a concern, they should be commuting via other methods regardless of any tolls. Cars are simply too expensive.

A car might, but tolls or the lack there of is not going to be the thing pushing anyone into bankruptcy.

In fact, City of Atlanta residents have some of the highest poverty rates and lowest car usage in the metro. They should not be the ones paying the high taxes to keep up the streets for cars.

If you want to drive on Atlanta streets, great! Just pay for it. If it is not worth it to drive in to Atlanta, great! We already have plenty of traffic.

[aslowdodge]

Originally Posted by jsvh

The same way they get to work in the many places tolls already exist.

If money is a concern, they should be commuting via other methods regardless of any tolls. Cars are simply too expensive.

A car might, but tolls or the lack there of is not going to be the thing pushing anyone into bankruptcy.

In fact, City of Atlanta residents have some of the highest poverty rates and lowest car usage in the metro. They should not be the ones paying the high taxes to keep up the streets for cars.

If you want to drive on Atlanta streets, great! Just pay for it. If it is not worth it to drive in to Atlanta, great! We already have plenty of traffic.

From what I can see no one in this thread agrees with you and hopefully decisions will be made on what most people think. I think this would cut down on people coming into the city and hurt tax dollars. The idea that people who stop coming in will be replaced by others willing to pay is silly. You think there is a set of people who don't come into the city now that will all suddenly decide to do so once it costs more?

[jsvh]

Originally Posted by aslowdodge

From what I can see no one in this thread agrees with you and hopefully decisions will be made on what most people think. I think this would cut down on people coming into the city and hurt tax dollars. The idea that people who stop coming in will be replaced by others willing to pay is silly. You think there is a set of people who don't come into the city now that will all suddenly decide to do so once it costs more?

Most of the people opposed in this thread do not live in the city limits and are the ones benefiting from us city residents paying the higher property taxes.

And yeah, the people who have money but don't want to deal with the traffic will come in to the city more. I mean, if people are not willing to chip in to pay for the roads then they likely are not opening the pocket book up for much else in the city anyway.

Also, this is not some crazy new idea Atlanta would be the first to try. It works elsewhere already. Their economies did not crash and traffic improved.

[samiwas1]

Originally Posted by jsvh

Most of the people opposed in this thread do not live in the city limits and are the ones benefiting from us city residents paying the higher property taxes.

I vehemently disagree with you, and I am just as much a City of Atlanta resident as you are.

And yeah, the people who have money but don't want to deal with the traffic will come in to the city more. I mean, if people are not willing to chip in to pay for the roads then they likely are not opening the pocket book up for much else in the city anyway.

Again, and again, and again...those communities have streets that City of Atlanta residents use, and Atlanta has streets they use. Streets are a public good. Not some personal item that needs to be lorded over with a "me me me" attitude. Tell you what. As far as property taxes go, I will consider all of my property tax that goes towards things you like to go solely towards roads, and your property taxes can go towards the things you like? Deal?

If no deal, will you support the removal of all MARTA taxation from Atlanta sales taxes so that people who don't use the system aren't being required to pay for it?

If you don't agree to either of these, will you admit that your logic contradicts itself?

If you will not admit that, then of course you don't understand the reason people don't agree with you.

Also, this is not some crazy new idea Atlanta would be the first to try. It works elsewhere already. Their economies did not crash and traffic improved.

Third request: name one city in which the entire city is surrounded with a toll barrier.

After three strikes, you're out. By not naming one, you will admit that one does not exist and that this line of argument is false.

[jsvh]

Sam, I have found responding to you does not benefit the overall conversation. You take these things far too personally. If that means I have reached "three strikes" and I am therefore "admitting that my argument is false", so be it.

[samiwas1]

Originally Posted by jsvh

Sam, I have found responding to you does not benefit the overall conversation. You take these things far too personally. If that means I have reached "three strikes" and I am therefore "admitting that my argument is false", so be it.

Please. You don’t respond because you can’t refute what I say. I’m not taking it personally...I’m pointing out falsehoods and arguments that don’t logically make sense. If debating falsehoods and asking for proof of statements is bad style, then consider me the baddest mo....oops.

[arjay57]

Originally Posted by jsvh

The same way they get to work in the many places tolls already exist.

If money is a concern, they should be commuting via other methods regardless of any tolls. Cars are simply too expensive.

A car might, but tolls or the lack there of is not going to be the thing pushing anyone into bankruptcy.

In fact, City of Atlanta residents have some of the highest poverty rates and lowest car usage in the metro. They should not be the ones paying the high taxes to keep up the streets for cars.

If you want to drive on Atlanta streets, great! Just pay for it. If it is not worth it to drive in to Atlanta, great! We already have plenty of traffic.

A lot of these civil servants live where there is no viable alternative to driving to work.

[jsvh]

Originally Posted by arjay57

A lot of these civil servants live where there is no viable alternative to driving to work.

They can always move into the city to avoid the fee or simply drive to a MARTA station.

Again, owning a car is not cheap regardless of paying your share of the streets you use. If you are in that serious of a money crunch you need to be looking at other alternatives anyways.

The poorest among us do not own cars. Pretending you want to help the less fortunate by not tolling streets is dishonest, if that money is coming from taxes it is more of a burden on the poor.

I mean, what about giving the poor folks living in the city a little relief on their taxes?

[arjay57]

Originally Posted by jsvh

They can always move into the city to avoid the fee or simply drive to a MARTA station.

Again, owning a car is not cheap regardless of paying your share of the streets you use. If you are in that serious of a money crunch you need to be looking at other alternatives anyways.

The poorest among us do not own cars. Pretending you want to help the less fortunate by not tolling streets is dishonest, if that money is coming from taxes it is more of a burden on the poor.

I mean, what about giving the poor folks living in the city a little relief on their taxes?

I'm all for giving the taxpayer some relief.

However, many of these civil servants can't afford to live in the city and they may not want to anyway.

[jsvh]

Originally Posted by arjay57

I'm all for giving the taxpayer some relief.

However, many of these civil servants can't afford to live in the city and they may not want to anyway.

There are some quite affordable housing options in the city, but even if not, there are many ways to get into the city. In other cities that put in these types of tolls many people will just take the train in, and there are MARTA stations in every direction from downtown that offer parking.