Trump plans to loosen Obama's strict fuel economy regulations (2015, SUV, best)

[thecoalman]

Originally Posted by unit731

It's all over the country where there is fracking.
Not just this one guy.

I live near the heart of the Marcellus Shale, there is literally hundreds of wells in that area over thousands of square miles and the methane issue is concentrated in one small area that historically had methane in the water.

So people can believe in conspiracy theories or not believe in conspiracy theories.

Conspiracy theories typically rely on small pieces of evidence that have plausible explanations while attempting to ignore the overwhelming facts. Most people have drawn this conclusion about methane in the water because of the Gasland video, that's been shown to be false. What else you got?

[BIMBAM]

Originally Posted by thecoalman

I believe you are confusing 1000ppm of CO(Carbon Monoxide) with CO2(Carbon Dioxide). 1000ppm of CO will have an immediate effect, loss of conciseness in about 1 hour and death shortly after.

We are at about 400ppm of CO2 up from about 300ppm 100 years ago. That is 0.04% atmospheric content. the human body begins to feel the effects of CO2 around 4%, at our current rate we would have to go about 40,000 years before we would achieve that.

As a side note CO bonds to the hemoglobin in your blood and it can no longer carry oxygen, cumulative exposure of low levels that may not immediately kill can over time. This is why it's so deadly. With enough exposure even if you were sitting in an emergency room you're still dead. Even if you live it can have long term health effects. It's specific gravity is almost the exact same as "air"so it will easily travel along natural air currents.

CO2 will kill at around 12% concentration or 120,000ppm, the cure here is simply fresh air. It's specific gravity is half that of air so it will sink and form pockets. Deaths from this happened in the mining industry in the past before they had detectors, people working in large tanks, sewers etc. Anywhere it can accumulate and get trapped. That is why they have that big air hose going into the sewer when they are working on it.

I'm not confusing it with carbon monoxide, here is the source for why I said what I said:

https://www.kane.co.uk/knowledge-cen...d-co2-in-rooms

[thecoalman]

Originally Posted by BIMBAM

I'm not confusing it with carbon monoxide, here is the source for why I said what I said:

https://www.kane.co.uk/knowledge-cen...d-co2-in-rooms

I stand corrected and it's been while since I looked at any of these studies, I was basing what I wrote on studies I read many years ago. In any event even if we were to assume 1000 was upper limit before it effected humans you'd still be looking at 600 years at the current rate.

[BIMBAM]

Originally Posted by thecoalman

I stand corrected and it's been while since I looked at any of these studies, I was basing what I wrote on studies I read many years ago. In any event even if we were to assume 1000 was upper limit before it effected humans you'd still be looking at 600 years at the current rate.

I think the current rate is about 2.1ppm increase year over year, so yeah, it'd take a couple centuries at the current rate, but if fossil fuel use continued to grow as it has been until recently it'd be faster, maybe even as fast as one century. But I agree, the human health effects are not really the main concern, if we actually got to 1000ppm global temperatures would be much, much higher and the effects on civilization and existing ecosystems unbelievably disruptive.

[blazerj]

Originally Posted by BostonMike7

I think it's a good move from a big picture perspective


When the new CAFE standards were introduced, I thought they were optimistic. 54MPG as a fleet average is going to be VERY difficult to achieve from an engineering perspective. It really means developing a fleet of super sipper cars to offset the ones that the manufacturer sells below the average. You can only sell so many ford focus's to offet the higher consuming vehicles.


The ball is already rolling towards increased fuel economy. It's on my mind each and ever time I shop for a vehicle, so I don't mind taking the gov't out of the equation here. The public already demands better MPG, and manufacturers are delivering on this.


I'd rather see a company mature a technology, then rush one out the door to meet a lofty (in my eyes) goal. In my opinion, EV will much more common by 2024 anyway, so we may see the death of the ICE as a common means of propulsion within the next decade or so.

Yeah Trump bro. Government sucks (damn their gas taxes, regulation of fuel standards, enforcement of the false claims of OEMs, regulation of MPG standards).

[eddie1278]

Originally Posted by NYCresident2014

That's too bad, though it won't really matter after ~2020 or so. Once battery costs come down to reasonable levels, lots more people will be driving electric cars.

If Tesla could actually produce enough Model 3's to meet demand, the whole automotive world would change. I doubt they'll be able to, but it sure would be nice.

I could give a rats arse about electric cars and i'm an electrician. I will drive a combustion engine vehicle until i die.

Originally Posted by thecoalman

True as long as they fall within the scope of the law. That said even with the legal authority to implement them sweeping regulations, EO's or whatever carried out with a "pen and phone" should be carefully considered especially if you do not have wide support for them. Trump has his own "pen and phone".

This back and forth is not good for the consumer or business. Business needs a clear and concise path whatever it may be.

The 54.5 mpg requirement didn't just appear, you know.

It was worked out with GM, Ford, Chrysler, Honda, Toyota, Hyundai, Nissan, Kia, Mazda, Volvo, Mitsubishi, Jaguar, and BMW, as well as the UAW and the state of California.

Volkswagen didn't sign on, complaining that it was unfair (this was before they got caught cheating on emissions tests).

I get so sick of listening to this nonsense where people act like Obama is this rogue far-out dictator sitting in the oval office issuing orders with his pen, when in reality he's used executive orders less than every president since Grover Cleveland left office for the first time (and even Cleveland outdid Obama his second time around). Just for some perspective, that goes back to 1889.

Same thing with these standards. They were carefully hashed out and agreed to with the relevant parties. They weren't just dreamed up by the administration and then forced upon the auto makers.

The troubling thing is that now we do have a President-Elect who doesn't believe he needs to listen to anyone and who clearly thinks being president means he just does whatever he wants.

[Bummer]

Very interesting posts / comments so far . . .

Personally, I would greatly prefer to pay a little more for fuel while traveling in comfort and, above all, safety rather than being cramped in some flimsy aluminum foil and plastic vehicle with tires not much larger than those on my Mountain Bike.

Possibly the reason we are witnessing so many injuries / deaths from roll-overs nowadays.

[Stonepa]

Originally Posted by censusdata

Donald Trump
You can't haul a trailer loaded with cattle behind a Prius.

I come from a farming family but you realize very very few people need a vehicle that can haul anything other than a couple of people? And even if they did I'm sure they'd rather have a truck that had enough power but one which sips fuel rather than drank it. I have a 12mpg Chevy K2500HD puller and I'd go for a 30mpg version in a heart beat.

[Stonepa]

Originally Posted by eddie1278

I could give a rats arse about electric cars and i'm an electrician. I will drive a combustion engine vehicle until i die.

Why would anyone want to waste money fueling and maintaining an ICE any longer than necessary? This makes no sense in my mind but then I have to work for my money which makes dogmatic statements like the above nonsensical. I'll drive whatever works.