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View Poll Results: Which type of transmission do you prefer?
Automatic 100 29.15%
Manual 175 51.02%
Both 68 19.83%
Voters: 343. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 02-06-2016, 10:37 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by notnamed View Post
If you have any interest in cars, how do you not know this?
That is not twice the amount as you stated.

I want you to show me that the amount of power lost from the engine to the wheels is twice as much with an auto over a manual.

There are a lot of factors with how much power is loss, and this differs from car to car.

Last edited by boxus; 02-06-2016 at 11:18 PM..
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Old 02-06-2016, 11:28 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by boxus View Post
That is not twice the amount as you stated.

I want you to show me that the amount of power lost from the engine to the wheels is twice as much with an auto over a manual.

There are a lot of factors with how much power is loss, and this differs from car to car.


Ok. Current gen forte turbo. 201hp claimed at crank by Kia.
186hp at wheel with the 6 speed manual
http://www.forteturbo.org/forum/atta...vs-stage-0.jpg
163hp with auto
First ECU tuned 1.6T 0-60 Video

Last I checked 38 was more than double 15. It varies from car to car. In my experience manuals are usually in the 7-10% range and autos in 15-20%.

Last edited by notnamed; 02-07-2016 at 12:07 AM..
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Old 02-07-2016, 01:32 AM
 
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I enjoy driving stick but I recognize the drawbacks in places with stop-and-go traffic and hilly cities. All the vehicles I've owned have been manual.
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Old 02-07-2016, 02:02 AM
 
35,309 posts, read 52,315,210 times
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Manual or automatic? kinda depends where you live and what type of driving you mostly do.
If you have to deal with the traffic and congestion of an urban environment i think an automatic is the way to go,if most of your driving is suburban or rural then a manual would suffice.
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Old 02-07-2016, 07:22 AM
 
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I have driven and owned manuals my whole life. Even had some odd cars to be in manual like a Mazda 626, Nissan Maxima, Jeep Cherokee, Saturn SL1, etc

I just bought a 2009 Jeep Wrangler Unlimited and hate the manual transmission on it. It is not an enjoyable stick to drive. The transmission just seems clunky. My 1994 Jeep Cherokee that was stick had a much better feel to it than the Wrangler I have now. This is the first stick shift vehicle I really don't like. Otherwise, I wish more vehicles were available in stick. Honda sticks are usually pretty enjoyable to drive.
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Old 02-07-2016, 07:23 AM
 
1,646 posts, read 2,781,476 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jambo101 View Post
Manual or automatic? kinda depends where you live and what type of driving you mostly do.
If you have to deal with the traffic and congestion of an urban environment i think an automatic is the way to go,if most of your driving is suburban or rural then a manual would suffice.
Personally, I rather drive stick in traffic because I am not riding my brake while everyone else is.
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Old 02-07-2016, 12:45 PM
 
91 posts, read 100,387 times
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After so many automatics and compromises, I'm finally getting a stick car this year. Hurry up, tax return
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Old 02-07-2016, 02:04 PM
 
18,069 posts, read 18,822,893 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by notnamed View Post
Ok. Current gen forte turbo. 201hp claimed at crank by Kia.
186hp at wheel with the 6 speed manual
http://www.forteturbo.org/forum/atta...vs-stage-0.jpg
163hp with auto
First ECU tuned 1.6T 0-60 Video

Last I checked 38 was more than double 15. It varies from car to car. In my experience manuals are usually in the 7-10% range and autos in 15-20%.
Yet in your ZL1 chart, the Internet shows 580hp for a 2013 ZL1, so the difference between the manual and auto is not "twice" the loss.

Also, "twice" depends on context; 2 is twice the amount of 1, yet no one would be saying much if the HP loss was 2hp over the 1 hp of the manual. It is better to view as a percentage and even then, in what powerband this is occurring and gear as new autos have locking converters at hwy speeds that remove a lot of the power loss. For older cars, a built auto removes a a lot of the power loss especially given the shift points are more defined.


Regarding your Kia example, as the articles below show:

2014 Kia Forte Koup SX review notes | Autoweek

2014 Kia Forte5 Turbo Test – Review – Car and Driver

2014 Kia Forte Koup SX T-GDI First Test - Motor Trend

The two manual tests achieved a 75. and 6.8 0-60, while the one auto test achieved a 6.9. Of course the manual times can become better (especially the 7.5) as the driver gets to know the car and shift points better. But this goes back to the point; just how significant is the power loss? Especially to the casual/daily driver who is not racing, basically not maximizing the performance constantly during every drive?

Basically, the power loss from manual to auto is inconsequential to almost everyone except the racer. and even then, depending on aftermarket offerings, the auto can be modded up to obtain highly efficient performance from it. This does not even get into gearing differences between the two, in which a manual may have less efficient gearing than a trans (or vice versa) to maximize the power it gets.

This is why back when I was racing, I went from a top loader to a c6, because to rebuild the loader utilizing more efficient gear ratios was way more expensive than building up a c6 (if I had the funds, I would have built up the loader of course). But this was for racing, maximizing performance, I doubt most people are racing their car daily going to work, grocery store, etc. However, I did keep the manual in my camaro,my daily driver, because it is just that much funner.
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