Owings Mills Mall and the area... (Baltimore, Columbia: apartment, rentals, mortgage)

[GoPhils]

Originally Posted by nurider2002

I wonder if you would elaborate; what were the "red flags" other than the decline of the mall? I'm just curious since I lived in New Town ten years ago and now live near McDonogh School. As I mentioned in a previous post, I have never been a victim of crime, never felt the least bit unsafe walking in Owings Mills and never observed any behavior that would concern me so I am curious exactly what it is people are uncomfortable with. thanks

Yeah, I guess "red flags" = blacks moving there?

[trax21]

Owings Mills - all this talk about how its dead, The mall is dead but owings mills is not, I hate to say this but everytime african americans move into an area they call it ghetto, Please get over it, I am a single professional that purchased a townhouse in om and have no issues and its 5 minutes from the mall, I would never move to New Town due to all the apartments that are there. They are building new condos and townhomes. The place gets a bad rap, I am surrounded by professionals in my Neigborhood and if you can afford it there are some beautiful homes in Garrision. People please quit stereotyping people. All races have their bad apples and just because a group of people populate an area and they dont have the same skin color as you does not mean they are ghetto. I have lived alone here for 5 years and have never had an issue. I have gone to the OM malls where all these so -called ghetto people go and have never had an issue. Crime is everywhere but it certainly is not in any abundance or more that in Owings Mills, Having a dead mall may actually be better than having a thriving one like the one in Columbia, Maryland. On any halfway sunny day its populated by blacks, whites chinese and everybody usually teenagers of all colors on their skate boards with these tight baggy pants on. A co- worker of mine said their daughters car was vandalized at the Columbia Mall. I usesd to work in Columbia Mall and guess what I worked in Lord and Taylor and the people that were the shop lifters and vandalizers were not the so -called Ghetto people they were the so called suburban kids.

[nurider2002]

trax21--thanks for telling it like it is.

[young east coaster]

I've lived in Owings Mills for 8 years. There's a lot of families here. It's reasonably safe. The mall is pretty dull. But it's not really that big a deal. It's a convenient and inexpensive suburb to live in; grocery stores, target, walmart, gym, banks, restaurants all easy to get to. Baltimore county does not have a lot of outdoorsy stuff like parks, but there are a few hiking trails and play grounds in Owings Mills.

I'm looking to move to LA county this summer if my job transfer goes through. Where do you live?

[subwayfan]

The mall just needs to be downsized. It's the half of the mall of Macy's JCPenney and foodcourt that could be salvaged. The A list tenants not in those locations could be provided relocation assistance.

Owings Mills Mall - Top Stores, Shops, Brands in Baltimore, Maryland

On the map, block C and D, parts of E and the vacant anchor spaces could be demolished.

While Boscov's was operating, it wasn't worth the effort for GGP to refinance to redevelop. But, now there is a whole lot more space, and front space, that is, a lot of land for something useful, that could go there.

Macy's and JCPenney, the two together, are still solid anchors for a center, and the center still has a number of tenants.

I'm not sure what would be the best use of the generated space though, but perhaps outdoor lifestyle center retail component, or mixed use space.

However, it make more sense to do it now, while a number of inline tenants are still there, than later, as these chains will leave when their lease expire, if there is no upkeep done by the management to draw in traffic there.

In Southern NJ, the Echelon Mall was redeveloped last year but it was much too late.

Many of the A list chains, like GAP, Express, New York & Company,etc. left the mall 4-5 years before.

So, now there is Macy's and Boscov's, and very nice & modern mall with brand new floors, but very few tenants in the mall.
http://www.voorheestowncenter.com/directory/46-level_2

[fhart]

Originally Posted by Woodlands

I too am curious on why OM gets such a bad rep.. I considered the area when I moved here several years ago.. but the proximity to transit for my DC commute.. not to mention housing prices made the City more attractive (ahem.. current housing market, proposed income tax increase notwithstanding) I plan to stay in the City though housing prices in OM have made it attractive.

I would hope as the economy improves that they would raze the mall and turn it more into a lifestyle center like Hunt Valley and maybe add some more office and residential..but Im not a developer so I dont know if it makes $$. Its proximity to the train station should make the site appealing for a Transit Oriented Development. I know there is a plan in place but the economy may have stalled it.

Sections of OM and many suburbs in general may experience "flight" over the next several decades.. I did not categorize it as "white flight" because whites may not be the only ones to spread their wings. Employment opportunities, congestion, housing (newer) choices, and lifestyle changes (i.e. one factor that lead to the death of the mall) may have their impact on the area. Future generations (Gen Y) may choose to live in more walkable suburbs and even is cities as alternatives which may limit the number of potential buyers and families looking to move into these traditional suburbs. Therefore the values may level off and eventually "decline"? With the neighborhood competing with newer, trendier, intown, etc... potential buyers have a range of options which may impact values and perceptions of the area from both a retail and residential perspective? Again, I am not saying that OM all or a portion is IN decline but it like many other neighborhoods is certainly susceptible to these varying factors

I am an African-American woman. I moved to Owings Mills from NYC almost 20 years ago. The mall was vibrant and OM wasn't as multi-cultural. I agree with all the points made in your email. What causes a place to undergo change most of the time IS time and lifestyle. It was recently in the news that people don't frequent malls as they use to, as a source of entertainment. It was my understanding that Owings Mills Mall was supposed to be replaced with an outside shopping set up similar to Hunt Valley, but then along came the recession. As the stores' in OM Mall leases run out, they are not being renewed. That's what I was told by an employee of New York & Co. Perhaps when the economy improves they will go ahead with renovation plans.

People tend to equate change and decline with racial demographics and it is not fair. Crime and poverty are not exclusive.

[GoPhils]

Is there supposed to be some type of retail complex right next to the giant subway garage? I live right by there and always see the sign but it doesn't say what or when it's supposed to be or if it was just something they planned before the recession and have pretty much forgotten about it.

[barante]

I liked Boscov's because I am the ultimate Cheap Charlie. Now I go to JCPenney's at Owings Mills. Last week I bought two pairs of Rockports for a grand total of $105; an identical pair at Dan Brothers in Federal Hill listed for $110.
Readers of this forums have ample evidence as to what my thinking and prejudices are. I must conclude that race -- i.e. the steady movement of African Americans -- plays a role in the Owings Mills Mall's difficulties. But that is not the only reason.
The best local comparison is Hunt Valley Mall. For whatever reason -- and race was not a big factor in that latter case -- that mall was pretty much DOA, a dire circumstance that worsened after anchor tenants went bankrupt. After some stillborn efforts to relaunch it, the mall was then reconfigured and all buildngs, except for Sears, demolished. Instead, a strip mall was built, along the lines of The Avenue in White Marsh. It has been a huge success. Wegman's, the food store, alone grosses $90 million a year!
Could the same be done at Owings Mills? Perhaps. But the prominence of race as a factor to the mall's decline makes such a proposition less than a guaranteed solution.
I got a first-hand reminder of that when I went to a gas station across from the mall. I saw a couple of Jamaican yo-boys (that ethnic identification is probably wrong, but that's mine) in their rasta cornrows on bikes circling the station. While this was happening, a carload of cornrow guys sped their clunker to get some air.
A trained killer, I am not easily scared. But sighting them made me wonder. If that happened to me, the experience might have sent shivers down the spine of a less wordly traveler.

[GoPhils]

If they put some decent stores there I think it'd be fine. Tons of people go shopping at the many strip malls along Reisterstown Rd which are just around the corner from the mall. Although I guess a mall could be more of a "hangout" for troublemaking teenagers (of any race). Heck the Hunt Valley Mall has a pretty large police/security presence despite the different racial makeup than Owings Mills.

But even the restaurants right across from the street from the mall usually seem pretty busy (obviously except for the closed Tony Roma's which supposedly is going to become a Cracker Barrell).

[barante]

I hope you are right about Cracker Barrel. I kind of wonder because they usually site their braches within an easy access of Interstates. But maybe the East-West expressway qualifies with a huge potential customer base right in Owings Mills. We don't live in OM, but would go there for Cracker Barrel.