Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
The commentor is wrong. There is no comparison. Patriot Place is half way between huge by comparison BOSTON and also larger than Buffalo Providence, and the entire corridor between the cities is developed. On the other hand, there's Buffalo and ...and...and...Erie PA?
Thundarr, a person who has actually operated a business in western NY provides a much better answer.
Why would I be against development? I love and encourage well planned development. I am a developer. Again, pay attention.
Again, that doesn't explain away the Title Town or even the Township 5 developments in smaller markets mentioned in the thread and the point is about the property around the stadium, not the cities it is in between. I also could just as easily counter with the Canadian/Golden Horseshoe market of about 9 million nearby and to go further, many from that market go to Ellicottville to visit, as an example of where said market goes in the region. So, that is a large market with plenty of people that cross the border to visit and attend games(on average about 15% of season ticket holders).
The thing is that the stadium isn't going to change its location. So, that is moot.
Also, perhaps you should answer your own question, as there are examples of developments near stadiums that have worked.
Again, that doesn't explain away the Title Town or even the Township 5 developments in smaller markets mentioned in the thread and the point is about the property around the stadium, not the cities it is in between. I also could just as easily counter with the Canadian/Golden Horseshoe market of about 9 million nearby and to go further, many from that market go to Ellicottville to visit, as an example of where said market goes in the region. So, that is a large market with plenty of people that cross the border to visit and attend games(on average about 15% of season ticket holders).
The thing is that the stadium isn't going to change its location. So, that is moot.
Also, perhaps you should answer your own question, as there are examples of developments near stadiums that have worked.
Answer ONE question. Why haven't the people who have the knowledge, money and know how to build a development that you propose, as well as an embedded knowledge of the Buffalo region not interested? It's an IDEA. That's all. Keep in mind with your answer that these people understand that the expenses need to be paid in full every month.
Answer ONE question. Why haven't the people who have the knowledge, money and know how to build a development that you propose, as well as an embedded knowledge of the Buffalo region not interested? It's an IDEA. That's all. Keep in mind with your answer that these people understand that the expenses need to be paid in full every month.
Actually, that is the wrong question, as the article mentions how there is interest in developing the area that ECC is looking to leave and other pieces of property that is near the new stadium. So, again, that is just simply reading the article to find that out.
Every development starts out with an idea to meet a need and as mentioned many times between the article and thread, there are stadiums in other cities that aren't in a built in location for vibrancy from the neighborhood that have developments that were built for that reason. Meaning, to increase vibrancy and do so outside of the game day experience. It really isn't that hard to understand, given where the new stadium is going to be located.
Actually, that is the wrong question, as the article mentions how there is interest in developing the area that ECC is looking to leave and other pieces of property that is near the new stadium. So, again, that is just simply reading the article to find that out.
Every development starts out with an idea to meet a need and as mentioned many times between the article and thread, there are stadiums in other cities that aren't in a built in location for vibrancy from the neighborhood that have developments that were built for that reason. Meaning, to increase vibrancy and do so outside of the game day experience. It really isn't that hard to understand, given where the new stadium is going to be located.
Ain't gonna happen, no mater how delusional you are. Bills have to be paid. There might be a chicken wing place or 2.
Just look north to Niagara Falls NY. There is MUCH more reason for people to visit NF, from all over the world, than Orchard Park. I do that occasionally from Rochester, and spend money there, and it's a failure. We usually drive down rt 18. Look at the falls for 5 minutes. Have lunch/dinner at the Hard Rock and go home. That's it.
The irrefutable fact is that the stadium has been there for 50 years and nothing has ben done. What has changed to spur development? Orchard Park is not the most exciting place plus the McKinley Mall which is 2 miles away went bankrupt and was just sold for 8.5 million. OP is a sleepy, 96.3% white suburb, where there is little to do. I know I lived there. 8-9 games per YEAR not enough to spur development. As I have said repeatedly the stadium should have been domed and downtown where there is lots to do.
Ain't gonna happen, no mater how delusional you are. Bills have to be paid. There might be a chicken wing place or 2.
Just look north to Niagara Falls NY. There is MUCH more reason for people to visit NF, from all over the world, than Orchard Park. I do that occasionally from Rochester, and spend money there, and it's a failure. We usually drive down rt 18. Look at the falls for 5 minutes. Have lunch/dinner at the Hard Rock and go home. That's it.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Thundarr457
The irrefutable fact is that the stadium has been there for 50 years and nothing has ben done. What has changed to spur development? Orchard Park is not the most exciting place plus the McKinley Mall which is 2 miles away went bankrupt and was just sold for 8.5 million. OP is a sleepy, 96.3% white suburb, where there is little to do. I know I lived there. 8-9 games per YEAR not enough to spur development. As I have said repeatedly the stadium should have been domed and downtown where there is lots to do.
We'll see, but there can be development separate from the Bills as well. Niagara Falls is different in that there are other factors that come into play, as it actually isn't living up to its potential and needs to execute plans that have already been on the board for years. So, there isn't that much of a difference, if you consider the potential to maximize off of the attraction/landmark that is there, like the article is referring to.
As for the other post, you also have to think about changing trends. Meaning, the stadium was built during a time when stadiums were built in areas with cheap land, whether within or outside of cities without much consideration for activities outside of the stadium. What has happened is when stadiums were being built in the 1990's, they were starting to be attached to neighborhood development/activity outside of the stadium. Given that there are other examples given of development next to stadiums(a key aspect versus 2 miles away), even in suburban/outer city areas very similar to Orchard Park like Patriot Place and Title Town, it looks like both are viable examples of what can be done(i.e.- mixed use development). Keep in mind that the point is for activity that occurs throughout the year and not just revolved around game days(i.e.-become a live, work, play, visit type of development). So, that may mean a mixed use development with say a water/amusement park with say a Fisher Price/Mattel theme, given the proximity to that company's HQ's in East Aurora and/or to include some of the things that Destiny USA in Syracuse has included like those in its Entertainment section: https://www.destinyusa.com/directory/ . Again, the stadium will not move and in turn, this is a way to create a scene/space of activity around the stadium like other examples illustrate, which by the way, are similar demographically to Orchard Park(Patriot Place in Foxborough MA and Title Town in Green Bay by the border with Ashwaubenon).
Last edited by ckhthankgod; 03-10-2024 at 08:53 AM..
We'll see, but there can be development separate from the Bills as well. Niagara Falls is different in that there are other factors that come into play, as it actually isn't living up to its potential and needs to execute plans that have already been on the board for years. So, there isn't that much of a difference, if you consider the potential to maximize off of the attraction/landmark that is there, like the article is referring to.
As for the other post, you also have to think about changing trends. Meaning, the stadium was built during a time when stadiums were built in areas with cheap land, whether within or outside of cities without much consideration for activities outside of the stadium. What has happened is when stadiums were being built in the 1990's, they were starting to be attached to neighborhood development/activity outside of the stadium. Given that there are other examples given of development next to stadiums(a key aspect versus 2 miles away), even in suburban/outer city areas very similar to Orchard Park like Patriot Place and Title Town, it looks like both are viable examples of what can be done(i.e.- mixed use development). Keep in mind that the point is for activity that occurs throughout the year and not just revolved around game days(i.e.-become a live, work, play, visit type of development). So, that may mean a mixed use development with say a water/amusement park with say a Fisher Price/Mattel theme, given the proximity to that company's HQ's in East Aurora and/or to include some of the things that Destiny USA in Syracuse has included like those in its Entertainment section: https://www.destinyusa.com/directory/ . Again, the stadium will not move and in turn, this is a way to create a scene/space of activity around the stadium like other examples illustrate.
Keep in mind that Patriot Place and Gillette Stadium were built entirely by the Kraft family with private funds. I don't think you can begin to compare the economies of Boston vs Buffalo. Title Town was built by the Green Bay Packers, which is a community owned franchise, again built with private money. The beloved Bills owners have concentrated most of their development dollars downtown. There are only 9 games/year, what kind of development can succeed on 9 days/year? 50 years have passed ans still nothing. The new stadium is just like the old stadium except newer and shinier. If it were domed and downtown, that would be different but its not and will never be.
Keep in mind that Patriot Place and Gillette Stadium were built entirely by the Kraft family with private funds. I don't think you can begin to compare the economies of Boston vs Buffalo. Title Town was built by the Green Bay Packers, which is a community owned franchise, again built with private money. The beloved Bills owners have concentrated most of their development dollars downtown. There are only 9 games/year, what kind of development can succeed on 9 days/year? 50 years have passed ans still nothing. The new stadium is just like the old stadium except newer and shinier. If it were domed and downtown, that would be different but its not and will never be.
Again, you also have to keep in mind that there are private(key word) developers interested in properties or state that properties are prime for redevelopment around the new stadium as well. If you have checked out the article, it mentions that and talks about how the development would be for the whole year, not just for game days. Again, people should read the actual article for context, as there is private interest.
You also have this huge mall near Giants Stadium in NJ, which has the indoor Nickelodeon amusement park(it is pretty nice and attracts a good amounts of people/families, yes I’ve actually been there): https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Americ...am_Meadowlands
Another type of attraction that I’ve been to in the Poconos that comes mind as an idea for nearby development: https://www.kalahariresorts.com/pennsylvania/ https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kalahari_Resorts (or could an example with a mixed use development, but with the Fisher-Price/Mattel theme. You could also host other events like cheerleading and dance competitions, organization conventions, etc. You also could add housing as mentioned before for those in the Bills organization and at nearby companies like Fisher-Price/Mattel or Moog in East Aurora, as well as a medical facility, retail, etc.)
So, these are other examples that could be looked at for ideas of a year round mixed use town center development near the stadium. It could even be packaged with other nearby attractions in the region.
Last edited by ckhthankgod; 03-10-2024 at 01:29 PM..
Again, you also have to keep in mind that there are private(key word) developers interested in properties or state that properties are prime for redevelopment around the new stadium as well. If you have checked out the article, it mentions that and talks about how the development would be for the whole year, not just for game days. Again, people should read the actual article for context, as there is private interest.
Maybe you should post the link to the "article." I don't recall anyone saying the area is ripe for development other than the sellers. They haven't been able to parlay their property into a destination, and that's why they're selling.
We'll see, but there can be development separate from the Bills as well. Niagara Falls is different in that there are other factors that come into play, as it actually isn't living up to its potential and needs to execute plans that have already been on the board for years. So, there isn't that much of a difference, if you consider the potential to maximize off of the attraction/landmark that is there, like the article is referring to.
.
There you go again. You just answered your own question.
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.
Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
