Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
I don't see the problem either - although I do see that FinsterRufus has a problem with 'it', whatever 'it' is.
Whether one has or doesn't have dementia, whether one imagines or makes up stories about something that all of us already know can and does happen - rape, for instance - doesn't mean that each and every reported incident of same should not be taken seriously and investigated thoroughly. If someone cries rape, that should be looked into - even if the person has dementia - because it could actually have happened. So someone needs to be told. And it needs to be taken seriously and investigated. Just because we don't want to hear about it, doesn't mean it doesn't or isn't happening.
And whether it was real or not in the end, if one talks about the fact that persons with dementia can say some astonishing things, then the next caregiver may be more ready to deal with whatever happens during their journey better than if they didn't know about it all.
It actually seems quite selfish to NOT talk about some things in public in my opinion. Secrecy in many cases helps no one except the person who would keep that secret so they are not uncomfortable themselves. Secrecy can prevent others from knowing about some possibilities which could indeed cause hurt or extra trial at a time when they have enough on their plate anyway.
I have been there in retirement homes and nursing homes. Untoward and unwanted sexual advances DO happen there - sometimes by the residents, sometimes by the staff themselves. In fact, it is far more common than many people realize. So, if something definitely could happen and sometimes does happen, then everyone should know about that in my opinion - to protect themselves and their own loved ones. Silence is not always golden.
So .. an anecdote appears on a public forum .. perhaps even with a name attached (though you and I won't know if that name is real or not - or even if the incident actually happened, though stranger things HAVE happened) .. and someone relates an incident where grandma cried foul. And the person most 'offended' by that story .. is someone far out on the internet, probably posting under a fictitious name who is totally unrelated and removed from that incident ... who says they would not want anyone to ever tell if something like that ever happened to them?
Fine. If 'you' are bothered by the idea that someone would talk about you after your death, then I would ensure that you let your family know that anything you may ever say to them about anything, or to any caregiver if you should have one in future, is kept locked tight in a safe somewhere in perpetuity. That family can keep their heads in the sand forever .. no problem. No one is trying to convince you otherwise. We acknowledge your opinion even if we may respectfully disagree that is an opinion that all of us should hold.
But, perhaps the rest of the world, or even the real life individuals involved have decided that there is a lesson here that more than they should know about and that for the good of the many (or even only for the good of the storyteller) the story should be shared in a way that will get out to the most people possible.
Or am I completely misunderstanding what you meant, Finster?
Maybe one of the elders who have been chiming in on here can answer this. I do not understand the obsession about the cost of things. The most recent example: My father and I signed up for an activity that has a per person registration fee. It was an activity he wanted to do. He has complained and complained about the fee (which is nominal, basically the cost of an average meal. "Why are they charging so much." "What are we getting for that fee." There were about 4 conversations centered on the fee, plus an email.)
So, I went online and just paid both of our fees myself. Later when he brought it up again, I mentioned that it was my treat, that I paid for the both of us. He got mad about that ("that's BS!") and handed me cash.
He has the money to pay for something like this. He actually has more money than my husband and I do. I didn't ***** about the fee, why did he?
This obsession with cost only started after he became elderly.
Is the problem
1) being afraid about running out of money?
2) Thinking in terms of what things cost decades ago -- "sticker shock"?
3) Cognitive issues?
4) Just something to complain about?
It kind of takes the enjoyment out of activities when someone makes it sound like they are going to go broke spending the money.
EDIT -- the starred out word I wrote was "complain" -- for some reason that's considered an offensive word?
Maybe one of the elders who have been chiming in on here can answer this. I do not understand the obsession about the cost of things. The most recent example: My father and I signed up for an activity that has a per person registration fee. It was an activity he wanted to do. He has complained and complained about the fee (which is nominal, basically the cost of an average meal. "Why are they charging so much." "What are we getting for that fee." There were about 4 conversations centered on the fee, plus an email.)
So, I went online and just paid both of our fees myself. Later when he brought it up again, I mentioned that it was my treat, that I paid for the both of us. He got mad about that ("that's BS!") and handed me cash.
He has the money to pay for something like this. He actually has more money than my husband and I do. I didn't ***** about the fee, why did he?
This obsession with cost only started after he became elderly.
Is the problem
1) being afraid about running out of money?
2) Thinking in terms of what things cost decades ago -- "sticker shock"?
3) Cognitive issues?
4) Just something to complain about?
It kind of takes the enjoyment out of activities when someone makes it sound like they are going to go broke spending the money.
EDIT -- the starred out word I wrote was "complain" -- for some reason that's considered an offensive word?
IMHO, many elderly people complain or are obsessed with the cost of things. I remember people who lived through the depression and there was an actual of fear of starving or being homeless that terrified them to their very core. My parents worried about running out of money and having to go into the County Poor House and it seemed to be an unusually hellish, humiliating, cruel place to be. They described it in terms that would make a third world prison seem like a luxury spa vacation.
But, it has been my experience that it the obsession with costs is usually a combination of things. As a retired senior there are very limited ways to add money to the amount of money that you had when you retired, and you don't know how long you will live so there is always a fear of running out of money. I once discussed this with a relative's step-father. He was forced to take early retirement at age at age 58 due to serious health problems. He anticipated that he only had a few years to live so he really was not worried about "outliving his money". He recently passed away at 98 years old. It ended up that his after college working career was 36 years and he was retired for 40 years. In his case he has a good pension (with cost of living raises) in addition to a small SS check. He often said that if he did not have that pension he never would have been able to survive all those years of retirement.
Also, it can be sticker shock, especially for the big purchases such as a house or a car. Or it can be that their late spouse handled the finances so they really weren't aware of the cost of most items.
For some it can be cognitive issues or just something to complain about.
Last edited by germaine2626; 08-17-2016 at 07:28 AM..
Also, it can be sticker shock, especially for the big purchases such as a house or a car. Or it can be that their late spouse handled the finances so they really weren't aware of the cost of most items.
The funny (odd) thing is that he recently has made several comments about wanting to buy a new car (which is not something he NEEDS because his current car -- which he has always said he loves -- is in great shape and very good on gas mileage. Plus he still has my mother's car which is also in good shape.
He even went to a couple of dealerships to look (and we're not talking budget brands.)
So, he would consider shelling out thousands for a car, but a small fee is the subject of angst? (Luckily that car bee seems to have flown OUT of his bonnet.)
The funny (odd) thing is that he recently has made several comments about wanting to buy a new car (which is not something he NEEDS because his current car -- which he has always said he loves -- is in great shape and very good on gas mileage. Plus he still has my mother's car which is also in good shape.
He even went to a couple of dealerships to look (and we're not talking budget brands.)
So, he would consider shelling out thousands for a car, but a small fee is the subject of angst? (Luckily that car bee seems to have flown OUT of his bonnet.)
Yeah, but has he actually looked at the total cost of a new car lately? I bet not or he would be complaining about that too, lol.
I think a lot is sticker shock. I'm not elderly yet but on a recent trip to the grocery store I did get a bit of sticker shock AND a vivid reminder that age can make a huge difference in the way we see things. I needed a loaf of bread, something I rarely buy, and I expressed surprise that some of the bread was $7 a loaf and wondered what happened to cheap bread for a dollar. My daughter just rolled her eyes and called me a dinosaur, as if bread hadn't been that cheap in her lifetime.
I think as we get older it doesn't seem like just yesterday things were much cheaper, but to younger people that same time frame seems like eons ago.
The funny (odd) thing is that he recently has made several comments about wanting to buy a new car (which is not something he NEEDS because his current car -- which he has always said he loves -- is in great shape and very good on gas mileage. Plus he still has my mother's car which is also in good shape.
He even went to a couple of dealerships to look (and we're not talking budget brands.)
So, he would consider shelling out thousands for a car, but a small fee is the subject of angst? (Luckily that car bee seems to have flown OUT of his bonnet.)
Yeah, but has he actually looked at the total cost of a new car lately? I bet not or he would be complaining about that too, lol.
I think a lot is sticker shock. I'm not elderly yet but on a recent trip to the grocery store I did get a bit of sticker shock AND a vivid reminder that age can make a huge difference in the way we see things. I needed a loaf of bread, something I rarely buy, and I expressed surprise that some of the bread was $7 a loaf and wondered what happened to cheap bread for a dollar. My daughter just rolled her eyes and called me a dinosaur, as if bread hadn't been that cheap in her lifetime.
I think as we get older it does seem like just yesterday things were much cheaper, but to younger people that same time frame seems like eons ago.
Yeah, but has he actually looked at the total cost of a new car lately? I bet not or he would be complaining about that too, lol.
I think a lot is sticker shock. I'm not elderly yet but on a recent trip to the grocery store I did get a bit of sticker shock AND a vivid reminder that age can make a huge difference in the way we see things. I needed a loaf of bread, something I rarely buy, and I expressed surprise that some of the bread was $7 a loaf and wondered what happened to cheap bread for a dollar. My daughter just rolled her eyes and called me a dinosaur, as if bread hadn't been that cheap in her lifetime.
I think as we get older it does seem like just yesterday things were much cheaper, but to younger people that same time frame seems like eons ago.
I don't see the problem either - although I do see that FinsterRufus has a problem with 'it', whatever 'it' is.
Whether one has or doesn't have dementia, whether one imagines or makes up stories about something that all of us already know can and does happen - rape, for instance - doesn't mean that each and every reported incident of same should not be taken seriously and investigated thoroughly. If someone cries rape, that should be looked into - even if the person has dementia - because it could actually have happened. So someone needs to be told. And it needs to be taken seriously and investigated. Just because we don't want to hear about it, doesn't mean it doesn't or isn't happening.
And whether it was real or not in the end, if one talks about the fact that persons with dementia can say some astonishing things, then the next caregiver may be more ready to deal with whatever happens during their journey better than if they didn't know about it all.
It actually seems quite selfish to NOT talk about some things in public in my opinion. Secrecy in many cases helps no one except the person who would keep that secret so they are not uncomfortable themselves. Secrecy can prevent others from knowing about some possibilities which could indeed cause hurt or extra trial at a time when they have enough on their plate anyway.
I have been there in retirement homes and nursing homes. Untoward and unwanted sexual advances DO happen there - sometimes by the residents, sometimes by the staff themselves. In fact, it is far more common than many people realize. So, if something definitely could happen and sometimes does happen, then everyone should know about that in my opinion - to protect themselves and their own loved ones. Silence is not always golden.
So .. an anecdote appears on a public forum .. perhaps even with a name attached (though you and I won't know if that name is real or not - or even if the incident actually happened, though stranger things HAVE happened) .. and someone relates an incident where grandma cried foul. And the person most 'offended' by that story .. is someone far out on the internet, probably posting under a fictitious name who is totally unrelated and removed from that incident ... who says they would not want anyone to ever tell if something like that ever happened to them?
Fine. If 'you' are bothered by the idea that someone would talk about you after your death, then I would ensure that you let your family know that anything you may ever say to them about anything, or to any caregiver if you should have one in future, is kept locked tight in a safe somewhere in perpetuity. That family can keep their heads in the sand forever .. no problem. No one is trying to convince you otherwise. We acknowledge your opinion even if we may respectfully disagree that is an opinion that all of us should hold.
But, perhaps the rest of the world, or even the real life individuals involved have decided that there is a lesson here that more than they should know about and that for the good of the many (or even only for the good of the storyteller) the story should be shared in a way that will get out to the most people possible.
Or am I completely misunderstanding what you meant, Finster?
Yes, pretty much.
Firstly, let's drop the pretense that this particular thread was started with the intention of helping people.
Secondly, taking on a caregiver role does not give you the right to share deeply personal conversations verbatim that the person would never, ever share if they were still the people they were before they succumbed to their disease. It's a respect and trust issue. I don't really care whether you're going to get busted or not, that's not the point.
Thirdly, helping others should not come at the expense of a person who has no choice about what they share with you when they aren't lucid and have no control over what they say to you. It doesn't give you carte blanche to embarrass them, whether to you do it intentionally or with the best possible motive. I am embarrassed for the OP's MIL. Not at all because of the content of what she said. But because I am reading it. I shouldn't be privy to that conversation. I doubt she meant it for my ears. I felt betrayed on her behalf.
Fourth - I'm aware my POV is not popular around here. I am in no way denigrating caregivers. The OP is more than capable of putting up her side of the story should she choose, when she returns.
Firstly, let's drop the pretense that this particular thread was started with the intention of helping people.
Secondly, taking on a caregiver role does not give you the right to share deeply personal conversations verbatim that the person would never, ever share if they were still the people they were before they succumbed to their disease. It's a respect and trust issue. I don't really care whether you're going to get busted or not, that's not the point.
Thirdly, helping others should not come at the expense of a person who has no choice about what they share with you when they aren't lucid and have no control over what they say to you. It doesn't give you carte blanche to embarrass them, whether to you do it intentionally or with the best possible motive. I am embarrassed for the OP's MIL. Not at all because of the content of what she said. But because I am reading it. I shouldn't be privy to that conversation. I doubt she meant it for my ears. I felt betrayed on her behalf.
Fourth - I'm aware my POV is not popular around here. I am in no way denigrating caregivers. The OP is more than capable of putting up her side of the story should she choose, when she returns.
You're cetainly entitled to your feelings, but it's probably best to stay away from forums then, because there is a lot said that you are privvy to unintentionally.
BTW, a family member of mine "vented" to me about their relative's behavior which included pulling down her pants and defecating on the kitchen floor on a daily basis. This was not anonymous at all as it was a personal conversation about someone I actually knew. Now, whenever I think of this poor woman I think of her defecating on her kitchen floor. It probably would have been better for the venting to be anonymous.
Firstly, let's drop the pretense that this particular thread was started with the intention of helping people.
Secondly, taking on a caregiver role does not give you the right to share deeply personal conversations verbatim that the person would never, ever share if they were still the people they were before they succumbed to their disease. It's a respect and trust issue. I don't really care whether you're going to get busted or not, that's not the point.
Thirdly, helping others should not come at the expense of a person who has no choice about what they share with you when they aren't lucid and have no control over what they say to you. It doesn't give you carte blanche to embarrass them, whether to you do it intentionally or with the best possible motive. I am embarrassed for the OP's MIL. Not at all because of the content of what she said. But because I am reading it. I shouldn't be privy to that conversation. I doubt she meant it for my ears. I felt betrayed on her behalf.
Fourth - I'm aware my POV is not popular around here. I am in no way denigrating caregivers. The OP is more than capable of putting up her side of the story should she choose, when she returns.
Beautifully said Finster. And, it needed to be said. I hope some posters realize that their need to vent doesn't outweigh the respect due those they are currently caring for. As I find myself taking a bigger role in my mother's life, I will look elsewhere for advice if I need it.
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.
Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
