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Foxx this morning at his state of the city address: "Streetcar is more important than baseball, more important than football."
Now THAT's a slide show presentation I'd like to see. Though I prefer faster light rail over a streetcar, Foxx is probably right about this one. Eventhough the streetcar is slow, it could bring Southend-like development to very blighted areas of central Charlotte. Even I can admit that.
Now THAT's a slide show presentation I'd like to see. Though I prefer faster light rail over a streetcar, Foxx is probably right about this one. Eventhough the streetcar is slow, it could bring Southend-like development to very blighted areas of central Charlotte. Even I can admit that.
And that's part of the problem. It isn't being started in central Charlotte. Interesting spin on corporate welfare though. One company controls almost 5 blocks in the area that the streetcar will run. The owners are very excited and expect 10K new apartments in the next 10 years just on the starter line.
What do you think Foxx is right about? That we need it even though the council has said no twice?
And what about the idea that CATS can't pay for it. I just seems unusual that it's a whatever it takes approach even if our dedicated transit system tax can't handle it.
After threatening the ladies on the council and stonewalling hoping to win by attrition, I say enough is enough. If you've got to use those tactics to pay for something that already has a dedicated payment system but fails to afford it then it should be let go. Especially when we have our hand out to the state acting like we can be trusted with millions because we know how to run a transit system.
I did some some East folk on the news last night talking about it. They've been complaining about the half cent tax not doing anything for them without understanding that the half cent tax isn't in the picture. But what got me was this one guy moaning about how the city doesn't do anything for the east side.
I've seen this before. Apparently Eastland was "nothing" to some of them.
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Originally Posted by GCharlotte
Foxx this morning at his state of the city address: "Streetcar is more important than baseball, more important than football."
Foxx needs to shut up & move on, which does not make McCrory's tactic right. McCrory should have called Foxx directly, unless his objective was to set Foxx off so that the state could pull the funding, making Foxx more vulnerable to a Republican challenger.
Trolleys are not a good solution, unless they are used as in-fill. Fox should have a goal of having a good reason to run light rail to the east side & the west side. Rapid transit trumps trolleys.
Trolleys are not a good solution, unless they are used as in-fill. Fox should have a goal of having a good reason to run light rail to the east side & the west side. Rapid transit trumps trolleys.
Apparently there's no money for that either. Talk is the Blue Line Extension will be it for quite awhile due to MTC tax shortfalls.
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Originally Posted by GCharlotte
Apparently there's no money for that either. Talk is the Blue Line Extension will be it for quite awhile due to MTC tax shortfalls.
That's OK.
Apparently, he doesn't understand the old saying: A bird in the hand is worth 2 in the bush. He should be trying to get light rail to the airport in line & getting a reason to build light rail to the east, then get that put on the wait-list.
When the DNC was in town he should have made a special point of talking transportation with Michael Nutter, who could have connected him with people in the SEPTA organization who would have cured him of his trolley problem.
Foxx needs to shut up & move on, which does not make McCrory's tactic right. McCrory should have called Foxx directly, unless his objective was to set Foxx off so that the state could pull the funding, making Foxx more vulnerable to a Republican challenger.
Trolleys are not a good solution, unless they are used as in-fill. Fox should have a goal of having a good reason to run light rail to the east side & the west side. Rapid transit trumps trolleys.
I wasn't aware trolleys would be Used on the extension line being discussed. Just on the current fully funded under construction start segment which will run from Presby to Light Rail.
The streetcar is made for inner-city commute. It would hold just as much as a light rail and not go any slower than light rail would on the same proposed route.
It's like saying we should have commuter rail operating on the current blue line or light rail on the red line. They all serve different purposes.
Light rail Brings people INTO center city, streetcar moves people AROUND the city. Do you know how fast Light rail "barrels" through uptown? Not very fast. Do you know much closer the blue line stops in uptown are versus the initial stops starting boat the 485 station?
Streetcar will connect mass transit (Transportation center, Lynx Blue Line, Amtrak, Lynx Red line, Gateway station), Presbyterian hospital, CPCC, Johnson and Wales, JCS University, North Eastern University, Charlotte School of Law, Epicenter, Rosa Parks transit, Midtown/Elizabeth, Memorial stadium, Charlotte Knights, Bank of America Headquarters, Trade/Tryon, Charlotte Bobcats arena, Government district, gateway village, east/west inner coty charlotte, etc. all within a few blocks from this line.
The signals can be timed and have censors for streetcar, it's much much much more cost effective and just as efficient to had streetcar vs. light rail on this route. The epicenter of this route wil be trade and Tryon. It will only radiate out 5 miles in each direction from uptown.... Do we really need high speeds for frequent stops that is only a few miles outside of uptown? No. Do we need high speed for people connecting to the blue line from at gateway station to the CTC/blue line?
Light rail wouldn't go any faster in uptown! And the cost aren't worth it for the few miles it is out of uptown
Last edited by Charlotte485; 02-04-2013 at 11:19 AM..
....The streetcar is made for inner-city commute. It would hold just as much as a light rail and not go any slower than light rail would on the same proposed route.
Not even close. The trolley cars that Charlotte is planning to use hold ~45 seated and ~57 standing. They are slow and not low floor. In comparison a single S70 carriage used on lynx can hold more than 250 people standing. They are using these vehicles because they can't afford the modern European design they are showing in the brochure. Of course there hasn't been a real presentation to the public on this.
Streetcars are deemed "not cost effective" by the federal government in a city like Charlotte because they do not serve any function that can't be served better by modern city buses. This is why CATS/MTC dropped the project. It wasn't realistic. If they build out the original proposal, it will cost more than 1/2 billion dollars and no doubt that is low since the estimate was done in 2009. The city simply does not have this kind of money to spend on something that won't add much incremental transit capacity.
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Originally Posted by Charlotte485
I wasn't aware trolleys would be Used on the extension line being discussed. Just on the current fully funded under construction start segment which will run from Presby to Light Rail.
The original plan had trolleys to the east & west instead of light rail. Foxx has been stuck on trolleys. Trolleys in an inner city area are a terrible idea. There are valid reasons that many cities tore up tracks & went with trackless trolleys. The video that urban posted of the poorly parked car blocking the trolley is a real situation that does happen. It can cause gridlock if the tow truck can't get there immediately. If a fender-bender blocks the tracks, again no passage.
Trolleys should be at the bottom of the list. work on getting rapid transit 1st. At a later point connecting rapid transit (light rail) lines with trolleys would be fine. Because of funding, this is at least a 2 generation project. Charlotte & Gastonia both used to have trolleys. A trolley once ran between Concord & Kannapolis. If they were such a great option, they'd still have all of those lines running.
Not even close. The trolley cars that Charlotte is planning to use hold ~45 seated and ~57 standing. They are slow and not low floor. In comparison a single S70 carriage used on lynx can hold more than 250 people standing. They are using these vehicles because they can't afford the modern European design they are showing in the brochure. Of course there hasn't been a real presentation to the public on this.
Streetcars are deemed "not cost effective" by the federal government in a city like Charlotte because they do not serve any function that can't be served better by modern city buses. This is why CATS/MTC dropped the project. It wasn't realistic. If they build out the original proposal, it will cost more than 1/2 billion dollars and no doubt that is low since the estimate was done in 2009. The city simply does not have this kind of money to spend on something that won't add much incremental transit capacity.
Wrong; trolleys are only going to be used on the 2 mile or so starter project. In fact; if we get the funding approved for the extension which is being discussed; they wouldn't even have to use a trolley... Ever on this line.
And as far as fender benders go. Tell me how many times has light rail slammed into a car before and caused delays? The same amount of times fender benders will disrupt streetcar. It's been designed with common sense that fender benders could disrupt streetcar.
Wrong; trolleys are only going to be used on the 2 mile or so starter project. In fact; if we get the funding approved for the extension which is being discussed; they wouldn't even have to use a trolley... Ever on this line
The extension is to JC Smith. So basically the $119M proposal will be used to run the tracks from JC Smith to just past CPCC where the tracks are already laid. There is no plan, as far as I know, to purchase new vehicles. If you have any evidence the city is planning to do this, then I'd be interesting in seeing it. What manufacturer and brand are they planning to buy?
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