My day in court (insurance, crime, lawyer)

[DawnW]

Ok, well, not exactly, but as some of you may remember, I was very worried about tainting my perfect driving record with a speeding ticket and the additional insurance it would cost.

I ordered my driving record to show them and went in today.

They didn't even look at it. I could have had 10 other tickets on my record, they didn't even look. They just asked if I wanted to bargain down to a non-moving violation (equipment failure or some such thing).

I have to admit, I felt a little funny signing the form saying I had committed an equipment failure when that is nothing close to what happened. It felt like I was lying and was being told to do it IN COURT! I know they see it every day, but it felt weird to me.

Dawn

[Metallisteve]

...and now you see the reason people drive like they have their head up their keester (not saying you did...but the vast majority of others on teh road). There are no repercussions for doing bad. No punishment. And the general knowledge of "oh you'll get off easy for that" cushions it further.

[brokensky]

I know we are just talking about a traffic violation here, Dawn, but I can't help but relate to your " feeling funny" about signing that paper and agreeing that you were pulled over for something other than the REAL reason . ..

This is what I think confuses me the most about the justice system in our country. Now, i know this is taking it a lot further than you intended, but a good attorney will tell you - our court system is not about justice - it is about arguing the law.

So if you can find a way to get around a charge and use some law to do it . . . then that is about as much "justice" as one can get in the courts. Our justice system is not about what is FAIR - it is about what can be argued as being acceptable w/in the scope of law.

That strikes me as so different than what we were all taught our court system is really about. It is like - we say guilty and not guilty . . . not guilty and innocent. Jurors either agree you are guilty . . . or that no one proved you were guilty so in that case, you are "not guilty."

Anyway - that is probably going off on a tangent and so I ask your indulgence, but like you - I find the way things are handled in our court system to be sometimes kinda strange, Hee Hee.

Bottom line: glad everything worked out in a positive way for you today!!!!

[ellemaew]

Just my 2 cents worth, but I didn't see it as saying that she hadn't (it was my daughter's ticket) done what she was pulled over for - they didn't write her a new ticket, they simply charged her with and fined her for a lesser infraction, which was written onto the original ticket. To me it isn't any different than a plea bargain - a reduced sentence in exchange for something. Here, that something is simply going to the courthouse, which we both took an entire afternoon off to be able to do.

And btw, what you need the driving record for is a Prayer for Judgment, which completely removes the infraction from your driving record, not just reducing it - at least that was what I was told by a couple of local cops. Apparently you can only do that once every 3 years and if you don't have any other infractions on your NC driving record.

[MommyV]

I'm glad that it didn't taint your driving record or cost your insurance to go up, but it affirms my disgust for our whole court system these days. Plea bargains, lawyer lingo, etc... The system is not doing what it's supposed to do. Instead, it's just a processing forum or people and paper mill. Nobody cares about justice, right, wrong, innocent, guilty, etc... There's no honor in our judicial system any more.

I understand exactly what you're saying.

[DawnW]

Interesting you mention that. The guy in front of me had a much more serious infraction than I did.....I didn't hear what it was.....but I heard him ask for the Prayer for Judgement and the lawyer basically told him they do that in Meck county, but that judges in Union County don't typically allow it.

I see what you are saying, it just seemed strange to me to say I had some equipment problem. I didn't!

Dawn

Originally Posted by ellemaew

Just my 2 cents worth, but I didn't see it as saying that she hadn't (it was my daughter's ticket) done what she was pulled over for - they didn't write her a new ticket, they simply charged her with and fined her for a lesser infraction, which was written onto the original ticket. To me it isn't any different than a plea bargain - a reduced sentence in exchange for something. Here, that something is simply going to the courthouse, which we both took an entire afternoon off to be able to do.

And btw, what you need the driving record for is a Prayer for Judgment, which completely removes the infraction from your driving record, not just reducing it - at least that was what I was told by a couple of local cops. Apparently you can only do that once every 3 years and if you don't have any other infractions on your NC driving record.

[DawnW]

Well, this is exactly what I was telling a friend of mine today after the incident.

Lawyers don't want to know if you actually committed the crime, they just want to know how to get you out of paying your time!

I really don't think I could work the judicial system. I can't imagine defending someone who I think is actually guilty and I can't imagine procecuting someone I believed to be inocent.

Dawn

Originally Posted by anifani821

I know we are just talking about a traffic violation here, Dawn, but I can't help but relate to your " feeling funny" about signing that paper and agreeing that you were pulled over for something other than the REAL reason . ..

This is what I think confuses me the most about the justice system in our country. Now, i know this is taking it a lot further than you intended, but a good attorney will tell you - our court system is not about justice - it is about arguing the law.

So if you can find a way to get around a charge and use some law to do it . . . then that is about as much "justice" as one can get in the courts. Our justice system is not about what is FAIR - it is about what can be argued as being acceptable w/in the scope of law.

That strikes me as so different than what we were all taught our court system is really about. It is like - we say guilty and not guilty . . . not guilty and innocent. Jurors either agree you are guilty . . . or that no one proved you were guilty so in that case, you are "not guilty."

Anyway - that is probably going off on a tangent and so I ask your indulgence, but like you - I find the way things are handled in our court system to be sometimes kinda strange, Hee Hee.

Bottom line: glad everything worked out in a positive way for you today!!!!

[GirlTravels]

Originally Posted by DawnW

Well, this is exactly what I was telling a friend of mine today after the incident.

Lawyers don't want to know if you actually committed the crime, they just want to know how to get you out of paying your time!

I really don't think I could work the judicial system. I can't imagine defending someone who I think is actually guilty and I can't imagine procecuting someone I believed to be inocent.

Dawn

I don't do criminal law, but I DO believe that even the "guilty" deserve adequate representation and not to be railroaded into accepting a plea deal that far outweighs their crime. (And that doesn't mean I'm "soft" on crime - it means I believe in equal punishment for equal crimes)

I have a bigger issue with prosecutors going after people who they know are probably innocent - the Duke lacross case comes to mind - for political gain. It's shortsighted - you see what happened to Nifong!

I do know that there are a lot of good attorneys and judges who work very hard to get/give their clients and those that appear before them a fair day in court. I also know that there are a lot of people that abuse the system - litigants, judges, and attorneys. In the end, the best I can do is to represent my clients aggressively and yet ethically (yes, ethics really still do matter for 99% of lawyers, believe it or not!).

I also think that traffic court and low level criminal court is not where you see the justice system at its best. It's more of a revolving door.

[Miker2069]

Originally Posted by DawnW

Ok, well, not exactly, but as some of you may remember, I was very worried about tainting my perfect driving record with a speeding ticket and the additional insurance it would cost.

I ordered my driving record to show them and went in today.

They didn't even look at it. I could have had 10 other tickets on my record, they didn't even look. They just asked if I wanted to bargain down to a non-moving violation (equipment failure or some such thing).

I have to admit, I felt a little funny signing the form saying I had committed an equipment failure when that is nothing close to what happened. It felt like I was lying and was being told to do it IN COURT! I know they see it every day, but it felt weird to me.

Dawn

To bad, you should have read an earlier thread on this topic and asked to have it dismissed or worst case take a driving case in exchange for a dismal. The plea down is just to cut the workload for the DAs. You have a great driving record and you could have easily had it dismissed.

[DawnW]

I understand what you are saying, but an equipment failure is as bad as having a headlight out, why would that taint my driving record?

The problem too is that my husband had to take the day off of work so that I could go, and I really didn't want to make him take off another day to go to actual court and fight it.

The plea I signed has an infraction of 0 points so it won't affect my insurance. I am not too upset about that. Yes, I paid the $121 court fees, but I am not too stressed about that.

Dawn

Originally Posted by Miker2069

To bad, you should have read an earlier thread on this topic and asked to have it dismissed or worst case take a driving case in exchange for a dismal. The plea down is just to cut the workload for the DAs. You have a great driving record and you could have easily had it dismissed.