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Let me give you just a tiny glimpse into traditional Christianity, Katzpur, and, remember, things are better now than they were during the dark ages and the supposed reformation. Here are just a couple of links out of thousands that teach exactly what traditional Christianity believes and has taught for 2000 years. In fact, there are some people on these forums who use and teach from one of these links below. Just take a good long look at these links, and tracts and pictures and put yourself in the shoes of children and teens around this country and world who just wanted one time, long ago, for God to love them and their family.
One thing that the filmmakers have done to take their subject seriously is to focus on a family of five whose father helps run the haunted house while his daughter lands the coveted role of "abortion girl." (That's her above with fake blood slathered lovingly over her inner thighs.)
Now, we have Christianity and their hell houses and their Jesus camps with all their terror and fear and idiocies and illogical nonsense and corruption, and you have a child who is sensitive and who loves nature and loves the birds and trees and sunshine and who thinks that Jesus loves all the little children, and then they are taken to this crap or they have to listen to it in these sermons. What do you think happens?? They will stop thinking for themselves. That's what happens. When you are told from the time you are a small child that the God who loves you will set you on fire for eternity if you leave tradition and it's way of thinking, what do you think happens? You shut down, you take drugs, you drink, you try to be perfect but then your preachers say that you are saved by grace, so you go into a tailspin wondering if you are really saved and you wonder if you really understand and you wonder if you are backslidden, and then your brilliant teachers and preachers tell you that you just need to rest and don't worry too much about the good works part, but then you read in the Bible about how you have to have good works and run the race until the end or you will be eternally lost, and on and on and on and on................................................ ........
At the top of my list for the most twisted doctrine of all time on this planet comes from the Calvinists, and there are some on this board, who teach that God elected only a few for salvation and the rest get to go to hell, because that is what they deserve. They might have been sexually abused and/or tormented by their earthly parents, but any good they do in life is nothing but filthy menstrual rags, because they don't believe in a good god or because they can't understand what the hell is going on, and religion tells them their heavenly parent is going to set them on fire. They just haven't been elected. Too bad, so sad. In fact, this was the dominant teaching in America until recently. Manifest destiny and all. You have the people who have never heard of the Good News (good news my butt) out there in North Korea and in China or wherever who are going to be eternally tormented because that's just the way God rolls. He is holy and perfect and psychopathic, apparently.
You have children or adults who have just lost someone to suicide or whatever, and they have all these twisted horrible images running through their heads, and they hear the screams coming from their loved ones in their dreams, and you just have to wonder why more people haven't ended up completely insane.
Here is a very popular tract in evangelical groups from Chick, which I got to read when I was little. You can click on it and then turn the pages. This Was Your Life And, here is the complete list of twisted tracts:Complete list of Chick cartoon gospel tracts
We have the famous Jonathon Edwards sermon, "Sinners in the Hands Of an Angry God" which scared so many people to death that they committed suicide because the fear was so overwhelming they went crazy. And I'm here to tell you that I understand why. I was close to it myself not too long ago. I could go on and on, and I could get a lot more graphic, but I won't right now. I'm here to say that this planet is a very sick place, and the people who run the religions here are very sick people. Sick, sick, sick.
I hate organized religion. I hate it with an unbridled passion, and I'm trying to be fair, and I'm trying to be loving, but when children around the world are brainwashed and confused and tormented by sick men and women around the world, my claws are going to come out, and that's not usually pretty.
I'll just leave you with one more pic from the annual hell-house productions that many churches put on every Halloween. And this place dares to call itself "City of Hope Church.":ma d:
And we wonder why what's-her-face drowned all of her children........
Even if all of that is true (I don't know for a fact if there is or isn't a hell) none of those tactics will save one soul. They may scare people into acting against their natural urges and flesh and help people to go through the motions of trying to earn their way to heaven but that does not save anyone.
Even if all of that is true (I don't know for a fact if there is or isn't a hell) none of those tactics will save one soul. They may scare people into acting against their natural urges and flesh and help people to go through the motions of trying to earn their way to heaven but that does not save anyone.
Jesus saves, not fear.
If any of my post is true, a psychopath is our creator and a psychopath is running this planet and Jesus has saved practically nobody. What a grand win for the dark powers that be. Love did not win, love did not conquer, and love has no power. That's the simple and honest truth.
If any of my post is true, a psychopath is our creator and a psychopath is running this planet and Jesus has saved practically nobody. What a grand win for the dark powers that be. Love did not win, love did not conquer, and love has no power. That's the simple and honest truth.
Not knowing for sure why there would be a hell, what it would be and who would be there I can't say but I know that fear won't save anyone.
Not knowing for sure why there would be a hell, what it would be and who would be there I can't say but I know that fear won't save anyone.
So, if fear won't save anyone, and if most people sitting out there became "saved" through emotional pleas, through fear, through tradition, or through the fear of what God will do to them if they leave church, don't go to church on Sundays, or whatever, where does that leave everybody?
Why are people getting saved and what are they getting saved from? Are they getting saved from the loving God that created them? Or are they getting saved from an angry God with priests and pastors who need to warn them that he hates them and they need to get on his good side before he sends them into the abyss?
So, if fear won't save anyone, and if most people sitting out there became "saved" through emotional pleas, through fear, through tradition, or through the fear of what God will do to them if they leave church, don't go to church on Sundays, or whatever, where does that leave everybody?
Why are people getting saved and what are they getting saved from? Are they getting saved from the loving God that created them? Or are they getting saved from an angry God with priests and pastors who need to warn them that he hates them and they need to get on his good side before he sends them into the abyss?
Cult-ish?
They are being Chosen by God, why, I have no clue, how many, I have no clue, in our life or after death, I have no clue. In this life being free from the guilt and bondage of the law and having freedom in Christ is a positive thing to me.
They are being Chosen by God, why, I have no clue, how many, I have no clue, in our life or after death, I have no clue. In this life being free from the guilt and bondage of the law and having freedom in Christ is a positive thing to me.
Don't know what you mean by cult-ish.
I'm not even going to address your first paragraph, there. I don't think I'm in the right mood.
By cult-ish, I mean that you go to church where people smile and where people say the darnedest things and they tell those people in those pews that anybody who does not believe will go into outer darkness for eternity, or worse. Much, much worse. I don't care who tries to tell me that Christianity is not a cult. It is. Even if there were one time where a child/teen/adult were told that they were going to fry for eternity if they didn't believe or would be thrown into outer darkness forever, that's enough to do some serious damage to a thinking, imaginative soul. Serious.
Cults are always friendly at first, and they always tell you that they will always love you or whatever (depending on the religious cult), but if you try to leave or question them???
And what does Christianity tell it's followers and others around the world?
I'm not even going to address your first paragraph, there. I don't think I'm in the right mood.
By cult-ish, I mean that you go to church where people smile and where people say the darnedest things and they tell those people in those pews that anybody who does not believe will go into outer darkness for eternity, or worse. Much, much worse. I don't care who tries to tell me that Christianity is not a cult. It is. Even if there were one time where a child/teen/adult were told that they were going to fry for eternity if they didn't believe or would be thrown into outer darkness forever, that's enough to do some serious damage to a thinking, imaginative soul. Serious.
Cults are always friendly at first, and they always tell you that they will always love you or whatever (depending on the religious cult), but if you try to leave or question them???
And what does Christianity tell it's followers and others around the world?
Believe or else.........................
That's the good news.
Well if you know who is (all of us? Maybe) or who isn't saved, why and how it happened, I would love to know. It seems to me you have one debate and look to fit everyones cmments into your debate.
Have I said one word about preaching hell and damnation?
If you are trying to sterotype me I am afraid you are barking up the wrong tree.
Well if you know who is (all of us? Maybe) or who isn't saved, why and how it happened, I would love to know. It seems to me you have one debate and look to fit everyones cmments into your debate.
Have I said one word about preaching hell and damnation?
If you are trying to sterotype me I am afraid you are barking up the wrong tree.
Hilgi, I'm sorry if I pushed a button. I don't even care who posts on this thread. I don't really know why half of you did. I'm just ticked at a couple of people on these forums, and I'm ticked at religion in general, really. This is the place of debate, is it not?
My thread was: Define Cult. So that's what I'm here to do. I'm not sure what the problem is. What exactly are you upset about? And what exactly do you believe, anyway? If you don't believe in eternal torment or eternal darkness, then what?
Truly, hilgi. I'm not trying to upset you or anybody. I'm just tired of being upset by others who don't understand what it is they've done and what it is that religion has done. People need to wake up, and they need to understand why there are so many atheists out there right now, and why desperate people are throwing in the towel.
Last edited by herefornow; 10-27-2010 at 11:53 PM..
Hilgi, I'm sorry if I pushed a button. I don't even care who posts on this thread. I don't really know why half of you did. I'm just ticked at a couple of people on these forums, and I'm ticked at religion in general, really. This is the place of debate, is it not?
My thread was: Define Cult. So that's what I'm here to do. I'm not sure what the problem is. What exactly are you upset about? And what exactly do you believe, anyway? If you don't believe in eternal torment or eternal darkness, then what?
I don't get my buttons pushed, I roll with what ever way these threads go. I sense you are ticked, hence why I said it looks like you are putting square pegs in round holes.
I think some people have a problem with you saying we are all in a cult. As I said before, my bar is high, once the matching tennis shoes and kool-aide come out, its a cult.
I posed more questions than I answered, as I said I know a lot less than I know but what I do know is it is all God and not what I do.
I don't know if I believe in ET, UR or some hybrid, there are ways to interpret any of those. I tend to stay out of that debate and focus on Jesus, he saves, he changes us and because of him God sees us as perfect. Because of him our fruit is Love, I don’t focus on non-love related sins, I don’t think consensual sex or homosexuality is the greatest evil as many Christians do. Those “laws” were more guidelines for healthy living and a way to reduce strive and heartache in life.
If that is a cult, I bet it won't have many members.
I don't get my buttons pushed, I roll with what ever way these threads go. I sense you are ticked, hence why I said it looks like you are putting square pegs in round holes.
I think some people have a problem with you saying we are all in a cult. As I said before, my bar is high, once the matching tennis shoes and kool-aide come out, its a cult.
I posed more questions than I answered, as I said I know a lot less than I know but what I do know is it is all God and not what I do.
I don't know if I believe in ET, UR or some hybrid, there are ways to interpret any of those. I tend to stay out of that debate and focus on Jesus, he saves, he changes us and because of him God sees us as perfect. Because of him our fruit is Love, I don’t focus on non-love related sins, I don’t think consensual sex or homosexuality is the greatest evil as many Christians do. Those “laws” were more guidelines for healthy living and a way to reduce strive and heartache in life.
If that is a cult, I bet it won't have many members.
Okay, hilgi. I just hope you understand where I'm coming from. The people who do not want to think and who won't question what they've been taught are only hurting others. They are. Katzpur said that they don't teach anything like what I've been taught in the Mormon churches, and that's great, but so many others have been terribly hurt and even destroyed because they dare to question ET or other Christian doctrines.
Anyway, I just told Ironmaw on another thread that I think it's time for another break from the boards for me. I'm just an angry thinker sometimes, and I've seen the horror that comes from some of these doctrines firsthand, so I'm a little () passionate about this stuff.
Talk to you all later.
(and, honestly, there are only a couple of people, if that, on these forums that royally tick me off, and you're not one of them. You just got caught in the cross hairs tonight. Sorry.)
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) passionate about this stuff.