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Mike55, I would sure love to get your answers to this one as I know "prophecy" is right up your alley.
What I want to know is why don't we find ONE passage of scripture in the New Testament that predicts a distant future return of the people of Israel to their ancient homeland while the mid-latter Old Testament does?
It has been shown time and time again that the OT predictions (if they were indeed that) were written for a time long past when sages predicted that the exiled captives would return to Judah/Israel and since by the New Testament times their return had long since happened, there was no need in the New Testament to make any more predictions. Yet, those who want so bad to prove the Bible is a divine book, proofed by its alleged fulfilled prophecies, point time and time again to OT passages (ONLY)supposedly predicting a distant future return of Israel to its ancient land. Why don't we find these predictions in the NT? Why are they strictly limited to the OT?
Last edited by InsaneInDaMembrane; 11-04-2010 at 03:20 PM..
I like your posts, Insane. I don't mind you hanging out here. Your posts have helped me quite a bit.
Anyway, Mike's probably mad because you only used two 5s after his name. He likes that triple 5. ~~~~~~~~~~`Mike55, I would sure love to get your answers to this one as I know "prophecy" is right up your alley. Triple 5s can come from chaos majick, and Hitler's party number was 555 (55 at first). 555 also means man, 666 devil, and 777 God. Just some fun facts.
I like your posts, Insane. I don't mind you hanging out here. Your posts have helped me quite a bit.
Anyway, Mike's probably mad because you only used two 5s after his name. He likes that triple 5. ~~~~~~~~~~`Mike55, I would sure love to get your answers to this one as I know "prophecy" is right up your alley. Triple 5s can come from chaos majick, and Hitler's party number was 555 (55 at first). 555 also means man, 666 devil, and 777 God. Just some fun facts.
Yeah, I know I get on the guy's theological views, but I don't know him, he does not know me and I have nothing personal against him. I just challenge his lofty views from time to time.
Mike55, I would sure love to get your answers to this one as I know "prophecy" is right up your alley.
I don't emphasize prophecy over any other category of doctrine.
Quote:
What I want to know is why don't we find ONE passage of scripture in the New Testament that predicts a distant future return of the people of Israel to their ancient homeland while the mid-latter Old Testament does?
It has been shown time and time again that the OT predictions (if they were indeed that) were written for a time long past when sages predicted that the exiled captives would return to Judah/Israel and since by the New Testament times their return had long since happened, there was no need in the New Testament to make any more predictions.
You speak without understanding. Some prophecies were about Israels first dispersion and their return to the land. Other prophecies concern their future in the Millennial kingdom when Christ returns. For example, in Zech 14, Jesus' return is spoken of and Israel being back in the land.
Quote:
Yet, those who want so bad to prove the Bible is a divine book, proofed by its alleged fulfilled prophecies, point time and time again to OT passages (ONLY)supposedly predicting a distant future return of Israel to its ancient land. Why don't we find these predictions in the NT. Why are they strictly limited to the OT?
The Old Testament primarily concerns Israel and its future. The New Testament Epistles concern the Church and the spiritual life of the church-age believer. Not Israel. Therefore, you wouldn't expect to see prophecies concerning Israels future.
Jesus, who lived and died during the age of Israel, said that the Jews would not see Him until they turned to Him. Matthew 23:37-39. That will happen as a result of the judgments of the tribulation. After His resurrection, His apostles asked Him as recorded in Acts 1:6-7 when the kingdom would be restored to Israel. Jesus told them that the time of His return wasn't for them to know.
Much of what Jesus spoke of concerned that future Millennial kingdom into which surviving believers of the tribulation, both Jew and Gentile will enter.
Revelation gives an overview of the judgments that are to come in the tribulation.
But the Epistles concern the church-age, not Israel. Therefore, it is the church-age which is talked about. That should be easy enough to understand.
If you were interested in actually learning about these things instead of attempting to discredit the word of God, you would do some serious studying instead of trying to start debates.
Anyone who is interested might want to go into these earlier threads of mine concerning Israel.
I would also recommend reading 'Major Bible Prophecies' by John F. Walvoord. He was the second president of Dallas Theological Seminary. The book covers prophecies which have already been historically fulfilled, as well as prophecies yet to come.
And this is the end of my participation on this thread.
Okay. I just saw this post and the following posts after I posted my post. I just saw this thread. I'm not constantly on this forum. So for people to come on and say I didn't reply because I'm mad is ridiculous. You have the answer to your question.
Last edited by Michael Way; 11-04-2010 at 04:28 PM..
Okay. I just saw this post and the following posts after I posted my post. I just saw this thread. I'm not constantly on this forum. So for people to come on and say I didn't reply because I'm mad is ridiculous. You have the answer to your question.
We don't really think you're mad, Mike. I do like the debate between you, Insane, and the others. It helps me learn.
I don't emphasize prophecy over any other category of doctrine.
But it's your ace in the hole, isn't it?
Quote:
You speak without understanding. Some prophecies were about Israels first dispersion and their return to the land. Other prophecies concern their future in the Millennial kingdom when Christ returns. For example, in Zech 14, Jesus' return is spoken of and Israel being back in the land.
Hmm...
Quote:
The Old Testament primarily concerns Israel and its future. The New Testament Epistles concern the Church and the spiritual life of the church-age believer. Not Israel. Therefore, you wouldn't expect to see prophecies concerning Israels future.
Yet one of MAJOR alleged prophecies some Christians point to is in Matthew 24 where they claim that the "fig tree" mentioned is Israel and her return to the ancient land. I find it very hard to believe that with all the hoopla around the prophecies of Matthew 24 and the similar passages chapters in Mark and Luke, Israel's return is NOT mentioned. Supposedly Israel is god's lynch pin but yet these prophecies are mum about her return.
Quote:
Jesus, who lived and died during the age of Israel, said that the Jews would not see Him until they turned to Him. Matthew 23:37-39. That will happen as a result of the judgments of the tribulation. After His resurrection, His apostles asked Him as recorded in Acts 1:6-7 when the kingdom would be restored to Israel. Jesus told them that the time of His return wasn't for them to know.
They were referring to the glory days of king David and Solomon.
[/quote]Much of what Jesus spoke of concerned that future Millennial kingdom into which surviving believers of the tribulation, both Jew and Gentile will enter.
Revelation gives an overview of the judgments that are to come in the tribulation.
But the Epistles concern the church-age, not Israel. Therefore, it is the church-age which is talked about. That should be easy enough to understand.
If you were interested in actually learning about these things instead of attempting to discredit the word of God, you would do some serious studying instead of trying to start debates.
Anyone who is interested might want to go into these earlier threads of mine concerning Israel.
I would also recommend reading 'Major Bible Prophecies' by John F. Walvoord. He was the second president of Dallas Theological Seminary. The book covers prophecies which have already been historically fulfilled, as well as prophecies yet to come.
And this is the end of my participation on this thread.[/quote]
I'm not sure you really addressed the subject. The book of Matthew, for example, is a Gospel directed at the Jews - NOT the church - yet we find little, if anything referring to some future restoration of Israel from the amongst the nations.
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