Will Christ fail to accomplish Gods desire to save all people? (crucified, convert)

[Ironmaw1776]

Originally Posted by twin.spin

"Sower and the seed" is a good example of not all "seeds".But what kills the seed is the ground on which it falls on not God's inability to cast it out.

You misunderstand much of what Christ was saying because you take it all out of context and disdain the audience relevance in favor of the traditions of men, that is why you are blind to the truth of Christs complete victory over sin and death and his 100% success rate in being the savior of all people.

[Ironmaw1776]

Originally Posted by Finn_Jarber

You think God was just talking to stay warm?

Salvation is work of God, but you must allow Him to do it. You must turn back, says the Lord. You are making me choose between the Gospel of Ironmaw, and the Gospel of Jesus, and I choose Jesus.

It has nothing to do with us allowing anything ... on the contrary it all has to do with God making us desire and do what pleases him. We don't allow him to make us desire and do what pleases him. We cant stop him from making us desire and do what pleases him.

I am making you deal with the reality of what the scriptures teach in contrast to the false doctrines of the traditions of men to which you subscribe.

[katjonjj]

Originally Posted by twin.spin

What I do know is that dogs were not considered part of the family in Jewish tradition and pigs were considered even worse. Anybody from that time period knew the significance of the mentality of what you were when being called that.

But this also should tell you who God considers the new "Israel" is in the NT....those who place their faith in Jesus. That is why only those who place their faith in Jesus are considered the seed of Abraham, not the actual blood line.

Not all "seeds" are saved.

If you read your bible you'll see it's one seed never multiple seeds... Christ is the seed.

Luke 8:11 "This is the meaning of the parable: The seed is the word of God.

1 Peter 1:23 For you have been born again, not of perishable seed, but of imperishable, through the living and enduring word of God.

Galatians 3:16 The promises were spoken to Abraham and to his seed. The Scripture does not say "and to seeds," meaning many people, but "and to your seed," meaning one person, who is Christ.

[katjonjj]

Originally Posted by twin.spin

"Sower and the seed" is a good example of not all "seeds".But what kills the seed is the ground on which it falls on not God's inability to cast it out.

Mark 4:13 Then Jesus said to them, "Don't you understand this parable? How then will you understand any parable?

Apparently you have the same problem?

[Finn_Jarber]

Originally Posted by Ironmaw1776

It has nothing to do with us allowing anything ... on the contrary it all has to do with God making us desire and do what pleases him. We don't allow him to make us desire and do what pleases him. We cant stop him from making us desire and do what pleases him.I am making you deal with the reality of what the scriptures teach in contrast to the false doctrines of the traditions of men to which you subscribe.

I take it you are under the impression that everyone who has ever lived did what God desired. I don't know who taught you such things, cut I can assure you that it is not true.

[Ironmaw1776]

Originally Posted by Finn_Jarber

I take it you are under the impression that everyone who has ever lived did what God desired. I don't know who taught you such things, cut I can assure you that it is not true.

Everything happens for a reason, and nothing is by chance. God has a very good reason for everything that happens under the sun.

Everyone who will ever live eventually WILL DO what God desires, and then God will be all and in all.

[legoman]

Romans 11:32 For God has bound everyone over to disobedience so that he may have mercy on them all.

[look3467]

Originally Posted by BudinAk

The Gentiles who believe attain that righteousness, not EVERY single person who has lived, or will live! It is of and by faith, as the scripture plainly states. Not every single person has faith....many do not...many refuse to believe. Therefore, I do not believe God has any responsibility to "save all". Those who believe, and endure to the end, will be saved.

Bud

I used to believe just like you stated it BudinAk.

I just couldn't come to grips with a God who claims love to be His center piece, and our in ability to have had a choice in being born in the flesh, and believing that it is all my fault for not believing in Him!

No, there had to be a better answer! That answer can be found in one verse of scripture that in my opinion, is the key to explaining the love of God.

That scripture is: Rom 8:20 For the creature was made subject to vanity, not willingly, but by reason of him who hath subjected the same in hope,

If you also read the next verse you shall see as well where it states "shall be delivered".

God knew the conditions He was subjecting us into, therefore His compassion is limitless, and without prejudice; understood as He having the final control in the faith of our souls.

He demonstrated it in the person of Jesus Christ, the very essence of just who this wonderful, compassionate God is.

Jesus is the hope mentioned in the latter part of verse 8 above, and having Jesus begin deliverance from the very first set of parents, to all future yet unborn souls.

That is why it matters not what you believe or not, as far as your souls outcome is, but it does matter what you believe when in the flesh as to whether you will be a successful beneficiary of enjoying heaven on earth.

Let's say for example that you are a devote Muslim, a Jehovah's Witness, a Mormon, a Catholic, a Satanist, or an Atheist, whatever youre belief is will be a reflection of what heavenly experiences you will have.

The onus is then for the individual to seek God out in the best way possible in order to achieve an inner peace and tranquility in the midst of a corrupt world.

I have that peace, the tranquility of the security of hope regardless of the conditions this world has to throw at me. Why?

Because I have placed my faith in the God demonstrated by Jesus to be a God of love, more so than in condemnation.

Blessings, AJ

[look3467]

Originally Posted by Finn_Jarber

I take it you are under the impression that everyone who has ever lived did what God desired. I don't know who taught you such things, cut I can assure you that it is not true.

Two things to consider: 1. God desired that all should be conformed to the stature of Jesus Christ, whether it be here on earth or when you expire, you shall be converted instantly upon coming face to face with Jesus.
That is biblical in that He "predestined it".

2. Because of our individuality as gods of the lesser kind, meaning without power other than making decisions concerning our thoughts, we have consequences, good or evil, due and payable here on earth.

Number two is what our hang ups are all about. That is what we argue in these type of forums. everybody has an opinion apart from that which God has predestined.

What God has predestined, we have no control over, only our behavior, which could be a blessing or a curse.

That is up to us to figure out.

My view is that you work at finding God which ever way you are able to; so that He take notice of you and bless you.

He will never turn anyone away regardless!

blessings, AJ

[rodgertutt]

Originally Posted by Ironmaw1776

Everything happens for a reason, and nothing is by chance. God has a very good reason for everything that happens under the sun.

Everyone who will ever live eventually WILL DO what God desires, and then God will be all and in all.

I very much agree with that Ironmaw.
I think of myself as a theistic fatalist.
I believe that everything has to happen the way that it does, including all of our attempts to assist or prevent it from happening.

I believe that God will eventually fit every individual into His master plan in a positive way that necessitates their unique temporary involvement in evil and suffering that will enable God to manifest, and glorify, and magnify the many facets of His character in a way that uniquely involves that person, and everyone else involved in that person’s life too.
Then, after God has finished using evil and suffering for the reasons why He allowed them to temporarily exist, He will eradicate them from existence.

I believe that God has both the ability and the intention to eventually save all fallen creatures from everything from which they need to be saved, including their stubborn will, and He will not fail to do so.

I believe that God's determination, within the wise counsel of His "DECRETIVE" will which is that which MUST occur, to eventually rid all of creation from evil and suffering, will in every case, overcome the strongest will that is temporarily opposed to God's "PRECEPTIVE" (not perceptive) will which is what we OUGHT to do, e.g. THE GOLDEN RULE, and choosing Jesus Christ.

Chance by L. C.

In future days oh will there be
Another chance to yet make good?
Does God intend to let us see
If lessons learned were understood?

To let us start life o'er again
With stronger faith, and greater pow'r-
A life without the sin and pain,
Without temptation hour by hour?

Oh no! God nothing leaves to chance,
He made a settled perfect plan,
Each move well thought out in advance
With overwhelming good for man.

Creation all He'll reconcile-
The whole of it--both heav'n and earth.
Though evil may all minds beguile,
Yet in His cross true peace had birth.

Yes--having made this perfect peace
He'll draw all men to Him at last;
He'll give a weary world release,
With sin a thing forever past.

He'll make anew a sin-cursed earth,
Put ev'ry harmful thing away.
No fear or pain, no dreaded dearth
Will in creation wend its way.

What rest and joy such life would mean--
It surely would be "life indeed,"
No rift to ever come between,
No more of selfishness or greed.

Since God has planned this future good
For ev'ry creature ent'ring life,
Tell out the tidings as you should,
So sorely needed in the strife.

For hearts are weary of unrest,
Of disappointment, discord, pain;
Of trying hard to do the best,
Yet proving in the end how vain.

So tell them of the future fair,
Pass on the message with delight;
That day of joy each soul shall share
When Christ has come to put things right.